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Wheel spacers - size,make,cost?

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by S3_MCD, Mar 16, 2006.

  1. S3_MCD

    S3_MCD Member

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    Hi all.

    What is the general recommendation for spacers, 10mm front 15mm rears?
    Brand, cost? - seen prices from £40+ per spacer to £25 per pair!!

    All very confusing. I am going for Eibach Pro springs, want to space the OE 17" wheels out to fill the arches.

    Cheers
    PS - worth changing bump stops at the same time?
     
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  3. s3bow

    s3bow Member

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    Worth changing the shocks.
    What about the forge spacers ?
    I turned my own and then had them hard anodised. 10f and 16r. 40mm bolts from trackstore.

    Chris.
     
  4. dickys3

    dickys3 Moderator
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    I've got FK ones mate and they are fine. I paid about £100 all in which included 2 x 11mm front and 2 x 15mm rear spacers and 40mm bolts.

    Had them on for a year now with no probs.
     
  5. RichA3Turbo

    RichA3Turbo ...Watching you!
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    Forge spacers are horrendously over priced! Eibach's are equally good but half the price! Got for 15mm minimum (30mm track) as then they can still have the centre bore lip to locate the wheel...without this its very hard to get the wheel central!

    We do them for around £30 a set.

    Rich
     
  6. silver75

    silver75 Big Ron

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    is that a set of four with bolts?
     
  7. S3_MCD

    S3_MCD Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Forge spacers are horrendously over priced! Eibach's are equally good but half the price! Got for 15mm minimum (30mm track) as then they can still have the centre bore lip to locate the wheel...without this its very hard to get the wheel central!

    We do them for around £30 a set.

    Rich

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Cheers for that Rich...was what i was thinking .... H&R set 2*10 and 2*15 with bolts £180 - ouch!!

    To clarify a set = one side, pair, with/without bolts??
    Will be in touch next week to get some ordered up.

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ok.gif
     
  8. keendean

    keendean Member

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    Rich can you do 2 x 11mm front and 2 x 15mm rear spacers and 40mm bolts as King Dicky has, if so how much inc P&P
    TIA
     
  9. RichA3Turbo

    RichA3Turbo ...Watching you!
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    Take a look at the eibach site. If they do them we do them. They give better info than me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    This is without bolts. Prices are per pair.

    Rich
     
  10. Triple_A

    Triple_A Member

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    Do you think that 15mm front and 20mm rear is too wide, or is it ok? My wheels are 8.5x18 and car is lowered 25mm.
     
  11. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Do you think that 15mm front and 20mm rear is too wide, or is it ok? My wheels are 8.5x18 and car is lowered 25mm.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Depends on the offset of the wheels...
    If they are ET35, I'd say 20mm at the rear is too wide, especially on an 8.5" rim.

    15s on the front may well be too...again depending on offset and amount of negative camber you are running.
     
  12. Drill

    Drill Member

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    Gotta check my wheel size / offset, but I've got 15mm spacers (H&R /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif) front and rear... fronts are no problem, the rears actually rub a bit on hard bumps since I got the H&R Sport Springs / Bilstein Shocks installed /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif It's not bad enough to do anything more than "Polish" the head of the wheel liner screw, but it IS annoying /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

    Off the top of my head I'd say the wheels are 7.5 wide (17 dia.) and IIRC the offset is 38 (or 35 /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif)

    I know that's not very helpful.... but I haven't babbled here in a while /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angel.gif

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
     
  13. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I know that's not very helpful.... but I haven't babbled here in a while /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angel.gif

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Not at all Drill...

    Mine were 8"x18" ET32 and with 16mm spacers, you'd have to run rear negative camber to clear the arches when driven hard.

    Not normally a problem if you have a lowered car, as you'll gain lots (too much) rear negative camber...but if you wind it out to standard, you'd buff on the arch lip.

    So, 8.5"x18" with 20mm spacers, and any sort of normal VAG offset (ET 30-35) is likely to rub, I would say.
     
  14. Drill

    Drill Member

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    Oh yeah, I forgot to add that when I had the suspension installed, I also got Forge Adjustable control arms and had camber set to (S3) stock /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif So I guess that compensated for the usual (too much) negative camber /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angel.gif

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
     
  15. Mo-S3

    Mo-S3 Member

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    So... if you had a lowered car with coilovers, 7.5"x18" alloys, adjustable tiebars and then fitted 15mm spacers on the rear, do you think there would be rubbing on the arches?
     
  16. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    So... if you had a lowered car with coilovers, 7.5"x18" alloys, adjustable tiebars and then fitted 15mm spacers on the rear, do you think there would be rubbing on the arches?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Depends on the offset of the wheels, and how low.

    On a 7.5" wide wheel, even with 15mm spacers it won't rub if it's not too low.
    If it IS low, and you try to run no rear negative camber...the offset of the wheels would dictate if they'd rub.

    As I said, on my 8" x 18"s, ET32, 225/40/18 tyred BBS wheels they would have rubbed with no rear negative camber on H&R springs and Bilstein dampers.
    I didn't take the chance...as it was obvious they would scrub....not a lot...but on the roads I drive and at the speeds I drive...I wasn't risking it.

    Although, to be honest, I was never intending running the rear wheels with no negative camber.
     
  17. Triple_A

    Triple_A Member

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    Ok thanks for help mates!

    My wheels are BBS CH 18x8.5, but im not sure about ET (30-35?) and i have 25mm Eibach springs. My friend has 10mm spacers so I need to try those first and see how much there is space between wheels arch and tyre with those.

    Reason i would like to use 20mm spacer is that then i could use spacer that is bolted to wheel hub and then wheel is bolted to that spacer. I talked to company that make custom wheel adapters and they said that 15mm is thinnest bolted adapter that can be made. Those bolted ones are legal in my country and those others are not.

    Are those spacers that you use like these in that pic? (except bolt pattern of course)
    So it is just between wheel and wheel hub and not bolted to wheel hub.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. dickys3

    dickys3 Moderator
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    Yes they are like my ones. They just sit between the wheek and the hub.
     
  19. Defratos

    Defratos You’re Dethpicable!!

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    [ QUOTE ]


    Reason i would like to use 20mm spacer is that then i could use spacer that is bolted to wheel hub and then wheel is bolted to that spacer. I talked to company that make custom wheel adapters and they said that 15mm is thinnest bolted adapter that can be made. Those bolted ones are legal in my country and those others are not.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    I know the ones you're talking about mate. My bro has them on his golf, I think they are FK automotive or something like that. It's sport spec which is why it fits onto the wheel hub first and then the wheels bolt on to that, much safer I think and more solid. I'd like to know how you get on with 20mm in the rear because that's what I want to do once I've bought my BBS RX 8.5x18, just not sure about how much space I'll have and how much camber adjustment I'd have to make at the rear. Let us know how you get on /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
     
  20. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]

    Reason i would like to use 20mm spacer is that then i could use spacer that is bolted to wheel hub and then wheel is bolted to that spacer. I talked to company that make custom wheel adapters and they said that 15mm is thinnest bolted adapter that can be made. Those bolted ones are legal in my country and those others are not.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Ahh...
    I have a real issue with using bolt on spacers / adaptors.
    I can't understand why you'd (anyone) would want to bolt aluminium adaptors onto their hubs...then bolt their wheels onto the spacers. I drive hard, and I don't like the idea of my wheel bolts being tapped into soft aluminium rather than high tensile steel, as the normal hub is.

    To me, they are a posers mod...and potentially a weak point.

    The solution would be to use steel adaptors / spacers...but imagine the weight (not to mantion, I've never come accross any made in steel)
    Even if you get steel spacers...you are adding weight right where you least want it...de-tuning again...

    Whereas using a light aluminium straight shim type spacer, to me, is the best and safest solution...one i'm happy to use on road or track.

    But, that's just my view...and if the legal situation says differently, then you have no option...
     
  21. s3bow

    s3bow Member

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    Agree with Essthree here. Even if those spacers are made from 7 or 8 series aluminium , I still wouldn't have 100% faith in them.
    You can get shim type spacers in 20mm and use 45-50mm bolts.

    Chris.
     
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  23. Triple_A

    Triple_A Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I can't understand why you'd (anyone) would want to bolt aluminium adaptors onto their hubs...then bolt their wheels onto the spacers. I drive hard, and I don't like the idea of my wheel bolts being tapped into soft aluminium rather than high tensile steel, as the normal hub is.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You have good point, thanks for help. I drive also many track days and don´t want any weak points. I think then that im going to get 10mm shim spacers front and 15mm rear.

    Are those shim type spacers safe to use if driven hard? Could there be any problems?
     
  24. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    You have good point, thanks for help. I drive also many track days and don´t want any weak points. I think then that im going to get 10mm shim spacers front and 15mm rear.

    Are those shim type spacers safe to use if driven hard? Could there be any problems?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yes, perfectly safe.

    Be sure they are hubcentric, to remove the chance of your wheels not quite sitting peoperly and causing wheel wobble...and make sure you use wheel bolts of the correct tensile strength...you'll be fine.

    I ran 16mm spacers for years, driven hard on the road, David R did many, many track days in the same car, and the new owner id still driving it hard...all with the spacers on.

    As long as you torque the wheel bolts up correctly, they'll be just fine.
     
  25. S3_MCD

    S3_MCD Member

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    Ess - to check...

    OTM 17" wheels, Eibach ProKit (20-25mm drop), with spacers - 10mm fronts and 15mm rears.

    Am I gonna still be able to spank the car, A roads and track without negatively affecting handling, or rubbing arches?

    Cheers.
     
  26. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess - to check...

    OTM 17" wheels, Eibach ProKit (20-25mm drop), with spacers - 10mm fronts and 15mm rears.

    Am I gonna still be able to spank the car, A roads and track without negatively affecting handling, or rubbing arches?

    Cheers.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yeah, you should be fine.

    Assuming you leave the rear camber as it settles with the lowering kit, you'll be fine with the rear...but if you fit adjustable rear tie bars and wind the rear camber back off to factory, you MAY scuff the rear tyres on the arches with 15mm spacers...but I'd doubt it...
    It is going to be close though...

    20-25mm should be fine...but if it settles lower...and your dampers aren't too stiff...there's a slight chance of a scrub...but I expect you'll be fine.

    Fronts will be fine...but if you have any sense, you'll pull the balljoints all the way outwards anyway, to add some negative camber to the front...you'll gain plenty of grip that way.
     
  27. S3_MCD

    S3_MCD Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess - to check...

    OTM 17" wheels, Eibach ProKit (20-25mm drop), with spacers - 10mm fronts and 15mm rears.

    Am I gonna still be able to spank the car, A roads and track without negatively affecting handling, or rubbing arches?

    Cheers.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yeah, you should be fine.

    Assuming you leave the rear camber as it settles with the lowering kit, you'll be fine with the rear...but if you fit adjustable rear tie bars and wind the rear camber back off to factory, you MAY scuff the rear tyres on the arches with 15mm spacers...but I'd doubt it...
    It is going to be close though...

    20-25mm should be fine...but if it settles lower...and your dampers aren't too stiff...there's a slight chance of a scrub...but I expect you'll be fine.

    Fronts will be fine...but if you have any sense, you'll pull the balljoints all the way outwards anyway, to add some negative camber to the front...you'll gain plenty of grip that way.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Many thanks .... more questions:
    "pulling ball joints all the way outwards...." - how do I do this?

    Assuming negative camber means putting the wheel back square on the road surface (ie pulling the top of the wheel out?)

    Cheers
     
  28. Ess_Three

    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [ QUOTE ]

    Many thanks .... more questions:
    "pulling ball joints all the way outwards...." - how do I do this?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    With the front wheels off, loosen the 3 bolts that hold the lower front balljoint onto the lower arms, and pull the balljoint as far to the outside as you can.
    That'll add some negative camber.


    [ QUOTE ]

    Assuming negative camber means putting the wheel back square on the road surface (ie pulling the top of the wheel out?)


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Other way round...top of the wheel in.

    The man doing the suspension alignment after your suspension work will be able to adjust it, and set it up.
     
  29. Triple_A

    Triple_A Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    but if you have any sense, you'll pull the balljoints all the way outwards anyway, to add some negative camber to the front...you'll gain plenty of grip that way.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Is there some disadvantages with negative camper? Extra tyre wear, etc...Is there big difference in grip?

    And how much negative camper are we talking about?
     
  30. elucidate

    elucidate Member

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    Ess_Three,

    What are your settings for alignment on the wheels?

    I have to take mine in tommorow to get done after lowering the car and want to make sure they get it right...
     
  31. S3_MCD

    S3_MCD Member

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    Does £275 sound right for the the fitting of srpings and wheel alignment ?
     
  32. Mo-S3

    Mo-S3 Member

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    erm no!!!!!!!!! way too much
     
  33. elucidate

    elucidate Member

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    about £125 too much, at an expensive place!!
     
  34. S3_MCD

    S3_MCD Member

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    thought that was a little over the odds!!

    Westec in Newport gave me the quote, will be double checking the price:

    £200 to fit springs
    £75 alignment

    ...... anybody know of any good (but cheaper) places in / nr Bristol?

    Cheers
     
  35. dickys3

    dickys3 Moderator
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    Marcus you have PM
     
  36. god_thats_quick

    god_thats_quick Numptie of the highest order

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    Not sure I agree with all of this, it is quite a lot of work to change the suspension on the S3 in my opinion, and add to that a full wheel allignment (if done correctly) can take 2 hours + it all depends on the hourly rate where you go and how good a job they do in my opinion!
     

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