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Unhappy S3 Bluefin Owners.

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by Spin140, Jun 30, 2008.

  1. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    To clarify.

    Phase 1 REVO
    £499 + VAT = £586.33
    Select Plus Switch = £249 + VAT = £292.56
    Select Switch = £149 + VAT = £175.00

    Total REVO Price = £878.91 or (£761.41)
    Total Bluefin = £450 (inculdes ASN Discount)
    Total GAIC Price = £530

    As a repeat customer (used twice before) Ive tried to get some discount from my dealer and with REVO direct, and its a flat NO.

    So, the numbers tell the story, the price differences are indeed significant.

    cheers
    Paul
    #41
  2. JohnS3
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    JohnS3 Active Member

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    Yes it can, but you need a Select or Select plus for the CAN based cars. The SPS won't work.
    #42
  3. JohnS3
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    JohnS3 Active Member

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    Some Revo dealers will knock the VAT off for you, but you have to ask nicely. ;)
    #43
  4. S3IZZO
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    S3IZZO Guest

    That's not comparing like for like, or is the GIAC flash loader free?
    #44
  5. SteveTDCi
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    SteveTDCi Active Member

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    I thought the GIAC loader was something like £150 extra
    #45
  6. S3IZZO
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    S3IZZO Guest

    So like-for-like they are the same price, as the Flash loader doesn't allow adjustment of Boost, Timing and ignition like the Select Plus, only changing preset maps (Race, Pump, Stock) like the Select device.
    #46
  7. Vtec Abuser
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    Vtec Abuser Member

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    Exactly mate..


    If you guys do it like I did and offer cash for the map, they will generally knock the VAT off. Then buy a Select switch off Ebay for £100 (when they come up), then it will cost you £600.. ;) Around the same as GIAC.
    Yeah Bluefin maybe £150 cheaper, but if you want to save £150 and get 5bhp gain, be my guest! ;)

    If any of you guys are not a million miles away from Lincs area, I would recommend Quattronics for Revo. Had mine done there and rather than just bang the map on with a laptop and send you on your way. Corey had the car for nearly 3 hours and went out mapping on the road making sure all the settings were running bang on for the car, before handing my keys back. I have since had guys take logs of mine on Vagcom and they are well impressed with the results to say the least.. :rockwoot:
    I think you'll find S31ZZO will echo this, as his car was done there too IIRC..
    #47
  8. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    Just in case people aren't reading the other thread - any views on my Bluefinned 8P S3 RR readout ? The one with zero gain .....

    [​IMG]
    #48
  9. Spin140
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    Spin140 Active Member

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    GIAC including flashloader and standard map = £585 from Statller with ASN 10% discount.

    The claims for power gains at Superchips aren't nescessarily peak output claims the + 40bhp could be anywhere within the rev range. When Iggu visits the HQ his car will be dyno'd before and after with results laid over, from memory my peak bhp gain of 40 was lower down the rev range, this makes sense if you think about it.

    The point of this thread was to allow the unhappy Guys to seek a solution as they have already spent money not really to start another Revo V GIAC V Bluefin thread but this is a discussion forum afterall :)
    #49
  10. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    Seriously guys, I`ve tried speaking nicely to the local REVO guys and none are interested in a cash/no VAT transaction deal, so I can only quote the full + VAT price in this instance.

    So even if a could get a cheap REVO switch it still works out at nearly £700!!.
    And its not a fair comparison to assume `cash in hand` prices and second hand e-bay hardware against full retail prices for other products.

    And if many cars are making 285bhp (ish) and REVO are quoting 300bhp for Stage 1. then its £700 for 15bhp is it not?

    Im only looking at the numbers so please correct me if Im wrong. I admit I have no experience with S3 maps apart from what Ive read on here.
    Does anyone have a before and after plot for REVO?
    What were the real gains?

    Like i said, I think REVO is an excellent product from experience, but it appears very expensive for the S3, with not much gain.

    I agree there are questions over Bluefin, and I had been given a bum steer in the GIAC flash loader.

    cheers
    Paul
    #50
  11. S3IZZO
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    S3IZZO Guest

    You pays yer money, you makes your choice (or not as the case may be).

    I'm no Revo evangelist, all I can say is i'm more than happy with my map - If you feel it's too much to pay for the gains then that's your choice. I'd quite happily pay double the asking price for GIAC or Revo myself.

    BTW Paul mine made 10bhp above what Revo quotes, assuming my car was 285ish standard, it made 320bhp which is more than expected (Running mild boost and timing)

    Sorry, this has gone a bit off topic hasn't it :)
    #51
  12. The911SC
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    The911SC Active Member

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    I seem to remember that there is a way of using vag com measuring bocks to get an indication of power/acceleration and whilst not being anywhere near a calibrated dyno, I wonder if its worth a few of us doing some plots. My car is std and about 2 weeks old and I thought about the bluefin thing but you kind of have to get there and be dissapointed if you already have a hi output engine?.

    If we could compare std output though..???..
    Event 3rd part cheap vag com leads offer access to the measuring blocks iirc?
    #52
  13. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    That makes it up 35bhp which puts a different spin on things.
    The published figures figures indicate 15 bhp but It looks like they are a bit of a minefield as you have already seen much more than that.

    What settings are you running?
    I ran Boost 7, Fuel 9, Timing 6 (iirc) on my Golf and it was very, quite impressive, and agressive.

    Apologies for `minor` thread highjack.
    Cheers
    Paul
    #53
  14. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    Here's my Std plot from the other day , SI3ZZO can you upload your plot , and we could maybe overlay them with IGGU's? and QuickNick or Kris.

    [​IMG]
    We maybe able to see the midrange gains , not just the numbers. :ninja:

    p
    #54
  15. S3IZZO
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    S3IZZO Guest

    Long time since I last checked, i'll find out what settings it's running and let you know :) - if I had to guess B=6, F=8, T=7 but i'll double check.
    #55
  16. S3IZZO
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    S3IZZO Guest

    I don't have access to a scanner, don't even know anyone local that owns one.
    #56
  17. The911SC
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    The911SC Active Member

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    Thats just amazing; 294 from a standard car!?..
    What is your secret?
    #57
  18. Vtec Abuser
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    Vtec Abuser Member

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    Fuel is way to high mate if you're running them (unless you run 105ron fuel? LOL.. I would guess you may have got them muddled up, surely?

    Back on topic though.. Interested to see these graphs along side each other..
    #58
  19. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    Fcuking leather it once FULLY warmed up and Tesco99 ron fuel :)

    p
    #59
  20. Kontraband
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    Kontraband Active Member

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    HAHAHAHAh result!
    #60
  21. The911SC
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    The911SC Active Member

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    :jester:
    #61
  22. Rabbit222
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    Rabbit222 Member

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    I don't have a before or after graph but do know that I gained significantly on my S3...REVO was my software of choice. My car made 193kw ATW with REVO stage 1 and after fitting my Forge intake she made 203kw ATW. A few S3s that were dyno'd only made in the region of 160-165kw ATW stock. This was on 95 octane fuel. REVO is without doubt expensive and this tends to be a deciding factor when remapping your car...REVO needs to revise their pricing.
    #62
  23. AL_B
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    AL_B Active Member

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    You need to log block 120 which records current load in Nm, this can then be converted to lbft and the bhp worked out from there. Roughly...

    lbft = Nm x 0.738
    bhp = lbft x (RPM/5252)

    If anyone is interested..

    Go to...

    http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/cars/index.html

    and browse down to "Some useful off-site links" and the "Block 120 Spreadsheet.xls". Download the spreadsheet and plug in your values.

    I did this in August 2007 when the car had about 4000-5000 miles on the clock. V-Power since new. Figures gave the car around 275bhp and 273lbft.

    I will try to post up the excel charts at some stage. This is why I'm very sceptical of my standard S3's output figure of 291PS/287bhp at Prosport. If the cars actual sensors are to be believed (to get the Nm figures) could the car have gained 12bhp just by loosening up?

    This is the thread that shows some figures from "the guy whos name I can never remember"...

    http://audi-sport.net/vb/showthread.php?t=39935


    AL
    #63
  24. aiculedtzu
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    aiculedtzu under pressure

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    That would be me :)

    Also i have a Superchips remap (done at the local Romanian Superchips dealer) and i couldn't be happier with the result.

    When i got my "custom map" we tried different maps and made a lot of logs with vag com which were sent to Superchips HQ in UK so they knew exactly where to improve. Also is very important to use high quality fuel in the TFSI engines.

    And as far as i know, my S3 is the fastest 8P S3 in Romania.
    #64
  25. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    Bit of an update - really for people who may be thinking of buying Bluefin. After the rolling road results posted earlier in the thread I went back to ProSport for a second RR - this time a "with" Bluefin and "without" Bluefin. The results are below. I emailed the results to Jamie at SuperChips just for his response. He said he was still surprised at how early the test had cut the power as the bhp is still rising when the power is cut (you can see this on the graph) and he noticed the power "blip" at 4700 rpm (you can see this on the graph below too).

    Then ... how's this for customer service ? Free of charge he offered to remap the car again - with the specific aim of smoothing out the "blip" spot and freeing up the top end a little more. Within 2 days he got back to me to say my new map was ready. This was just last week. I downloaded it to the Bluefin on Friday and have been thrashing it this weekend. What a difference. You can feel the blip has gone - the power just keeps on coming now - and the it seems to rev more easily too. It now hits 65mph in second gear every time (although I don't try this on every upshift obviously).

    They really pulled out the stops to make sure I was a happy customer. I didn't rant or rave (or even complain) - I just emailed him my dyno graph and asked for his comments. Off his own back he did me a new custom map - hats off to SuperChips I say.

    I can only say that I've not had better after sales support from many companies in my life to rival this.

    [​IMG]
    #65
  26. jamiekip
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    jamiekip Guest

    That is GREAT customers service. I'm really pleased they pulled out al the stops to look after you Iggu.
    So, did Jamie @ Superchips say whether or not this 'custom' map was going to deliver you more power and torque, ie, closer to the quoted figures?

    You going to run it again so you can see the changes for yourself?
    #66
  27. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    Great stuff mate , you need to get back on Prosports rollers ,if the figures are good the Blufin map may be back in line for my car?

    p
    #67
  28. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    Well its already putting out a lot more torque than they quote (333 lb/ft and I think they claim 305 lb/ft). To see the 310 bhp (which I'm sure is there with the freer top end) I'd need a RR which revved it to the limiter - currently about 7100 (!!) which I don't think ProSport (understandably I must say) will do.

    Next time in the Midlands I'll turn up at SuperChips and take them up on their seemingly "open"offer of a RR with them.

    Very happy though as you can tell.
    #68
  29. jamiekip
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    jamiekip Guest

    If you get it done at their offices and have before and afters on their rolling road..... that's my take on all of this - don't believe what it says on the tin, make sure you get it on the RR so you can see exactly what you've got out of it!

    Edit: That goes for all remaps!
    #69
  30. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    Phantom - with their 7 day no quibble refund policy PLUS this level of customer service you can't lose. I honestly believe they would have refunded me had I been ultimately disappointed with what they tried to do for me. They must get 70% of their business from recommendations through sites like this - I reckon they'll ALWAYS make sure you're a happy bunny: even if means a full refund but I doubt it would come to that.
    #70
  31. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    One good thing that ive just found out about GIAC maps is you can switch on the move.

    Very good idea that if you " forget to tell your insurance " your car is mapped lol

    p
    #71
  32. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    True that - my Bluefin lives in the boot. If I lose it and end up in a bush upsidedown somewhere I'll be in that boot in a flash. They'll find me bleeding to death desperately uploading my standard map !
    #72
  33. richs2891
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    richs2891 I cant spell !

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    How can you switch maps on the move ?
    Handy if you get cant find a garage that sells 99 ron - or have a reduced power maps for when the gf drives !!

    Richard
    #73
  34. S3-N
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    S3-N ?

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    But with GIAC the insurance company would find the GIAC map with stock power rather than an Audi map so your insurance would be voided anyway.

    Only bluefin would put the stock map back on and even then you might not be able to get it back on for some reason or another. Even if you have a switchable remap it's still worth telling your insurance for the extra £100 it's going to cost you. :sm4:
    #74
  35. xs2man
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    xs2man Member

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    Having read all this, I wonder where you guys got your "stock" figures from? Was it the same RR on the same day? Did you drive there on your remap and change to stock map for comparison? What actually happened?

    I know its different, but I recently purchased the Chipped UK ST3 for my 2.0TDi, and uploaded the fast road map initially. From the start I wasn't too impressed, but after about 30 miles of spirited driving, it was a completely different story. It surley takes a while for your map to "settle" in.

    What I'm getting at is if you drove down on your remap, took the initial RR, before reverting to your "stock" MAP and going again, did you give the map a chance to settle in? Or was it straight off the remap? This could explain unusually high stock figures (Although I have no doubt VAG are conservative with their figures).

    Its just a suggestion. A consideration if you will. My experience was I needed to run the map in.
    #75
  36. S3 Big Andy
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    S3 Big Andy Stealth Beast Baby Yay

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    Interesting thread, I looked into Blufin and spoke to AD-Superchips a franchisee from Slough, he charged me £400 for the install, the reason I never went Blufin was on his advice, that people were having problems with the correct way to install the map, now I dont know if this was sales pitch, BUT he works for/with Superchips and knew there were problems!!
    #76
  37. julians
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    julians Member

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    xs2man,

    the stock figure were from stock cars. Not cars that were downgraded prior to the run or anything like that, just bog standard cars. All runs were on the same day on the same dyno.
    #77
  38. Staz
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    Staz is a retronaut Staff Member Moderator

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    Is this custom map available for the rest of us Iggu?
    #78
  39. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    Good question - not sure how that works given that SC remap your own car's specific map. Would my map fit your car Staz ? Dunno.

    I've no problem at all with you using my name etc. and contacting SC to see if this "latest" map can be made available. I bet if you tell them there is positive commentary on ASN at the moment they'd be more than willing to email it over to your handset. PM me with your email address if you like and I'll forward you the emails between me and Jamie together with my details.
    #79
  40. Iggu
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    Iggu Active Member

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    You do have to follow the instructions carefully. I'm no I.T. boffin but my mate (who is) reckons that if you were to cut the power to the handset or misuse it during file transfer there is a risk that the firmware would be lost and the car could be undriveable until the original map could be reinstalled - possibly by Audi. No idea how true that is but it could be what you're referring to.

    It would be user-error though rather than any fault with the product itself - i've installed and uninstalled Bluefin loads of times on mine but I'm always ULTRA careful .....
    #80

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