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Turbo upgrade :)

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by Lee Goodall, Apr 28, 2008.

  1. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 20, 2009]
    so the turbo is fine then :p

    Surprised it didnt fuel cut though?

    I guess your just going to have to go back and see what they say. If they pull out more excuses then refund time.
  2. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 20, 2009]
    Yeah an amazing amount of boost.. wish I could drive it like that all of the time lol.

    I'll call them tomorrow and see what the crack is!
  3. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 20, 2009]
    AFR? any idea if the fuelling is keeping up?
  4. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    Didn't have any way of monitering fueling.. it was just a test of the boost system really.

    Would be interesting to check the AFR at such high boost though.
  5. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    i would imagine you'd cringe if you saw just how lean it actually was.

    There's no way the injectors could possibly hope to fuel for 2 bar even if the map wanted them to. I suspect your lucky not to have speed holes in your pistons ;)
  6. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    So..

    With the actuator hose to the N75 reconnected I set off on my drive home.. Opened the throttle in 2nd gear and got the fuel cut/boost loss problem again!?!

    On my drive to work this morning opened the throttle in 3rd gear and got a solid 1.1bar/16 PSI to redline! Opened the throttle again in 2nd and hit about 0.6bar to then settle at 0.5bar!?. but with no fuel cut/boost loss.

    The problem is obviously linked to gearing, revs and boost which has got to be the map not controlling the boost well.. yeah?!?
  7. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    :puke2:
  8. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    No fault codes?

    I'm wondering if the wiring to your N75 might be acting up?

    But i'm at a loss as to whats actually going on...

    What happens if you gently open the throttle up in 2nd gear? rather than just flooring it?

    Try unplugging the N75, but leave it connected, and see how much boost you get...

    If you get the 0.5bar with the N75 disconnected then i presume that means thats the pressure the actuator is set to open at, as with the N75 unplugged the actuator sees all the boost pressure, all the time, but it would mean that either teh N75 isnt working when its only producing 0.5bar, OR perhaps the ECU is disabling it, after it detects the fault condition?
  9. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    The only code is for boost limit exceeded which coincides with the power loss.

    I had a broken wire at the N75 connection end a while ago which was repaired but it was bringing up a fault for open circuit to N75 and I'm not getting anything now.

    I'll run it without the N75 connected later to see what boost I get and I'll try gently increasing the throttle in 2nd too.
  10. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    Why would I get 1.1 bar in 3rd but only 0.5/0.6 in 2nd gear on the same run? Surely this is down to the map?
  11. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    that is very odd, i was thinking perhaps the ECU was detecting the overboost and disabling the N75, so you'd get 1.1 to begin with, then once you've overboosted it would just give the failsafe 0.5bar?

    Try to see if the 1.1 in 3rd and 0.5 in 2nd is consistent, ie after 2nd is only giving you 0.5 does third still give you 1.1? perhaps its just that the fuel cut was just about to kick in when you downshifted into second to try it?
  12. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    Yeah I'll experiment with a few different loads, gears and speeds tonight to see what's going on.. only problem's full boost in third and you're doing 70 before you know it!!
  13. disco-barry
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    disco-barry New Member

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    [Jan 21, 2009]
    Just a quick reply to this, i have an Audi A4 1.9TDI engine code AJM and i have the same fault code on my A4 with the same power loss issues and occasional overboosting like i'm dropping it hard into the gear above.

    I've been onto a specialist diesel company called Feather Diesels who are in Elland(west yorks) and Oxford and i'm from a garage but this little fault code baffled me, i rang up one of there incredibly experienced guys who we deal with and he told me straight away it was the turbo...What happens is it doesn't dump the pressure some sort of rod like it should in the waste dump so it goes into limited mode until you restart the car.

    I hoped it was a MAF air sensor but £475+ is sadly what i have to pay for the part.
  14. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 22, 2009]
    Does anyone know what boost (PSI/BAR) the actuator will allow the turbo to boost at with the N75 disconnected from the ECU/electrical connection disconnected on an AEB engine?

    ..does anyone fancy testing and letting me know?

    Cheers.
  15. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 22, 2009]
    won't you just get limp mode if you disconnect the N75?
  16. Andy.B
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    Andy.B Member

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    [Jan 22, 2009]
    See i had a problem with mine when i put a new chip in.. they said it was a up to 18psi map and it was plug and play... But when i used it the chip / ecu would only let std boost happen. I ended up leaving the N75 connected an bypased the system with a bleed valve set to 16psi. I have not had one fault with the car or map on the chip since.

    I know it sounds a **** way of getting round the problem but if you have a rolling road and diagnostic equipment to keep an eye on fueling while setting the bleed valve up i dont see why it would be an issue as long as you dont mess around with the valve after you have had it mapped.
  17. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 22, 2009]
    so long as your map supports the boost with relevant fueling then an MBC and plugged in but disconnected N75 is the way to do it.
    if it works who cares.
  18. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 22, 2009]
    I think the no-N75 boost is around 4psi, but thats assuming you have a standard turbo, and the actuator is set in the default position.

    It could easily change with a stronger actuator or more preload on the stock actuator.

    If you unplug the N75 and drive, you dont get limp mode. You just dont get any more than whatever boost pressure the actuator will naturally hold.

    The wiring to our N75 was broken until just last week and the car drove fine, albeit marginally slower than with a working valve.

    I'm just theorising that if the ecu detects overboost, it would make sense for it to do all it can to stop the overboost happening again, and an easy way for it to do that would be for it to disable the N75 and let the actuator control everything itself

    Havent you tried it without the N75 plugged in yet lee?
  19. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    Yeah I've tested it.. just wanted a comparison.

    With the N75 unplugged I get 5 PSI all day long so that indicates there's no setup issue etc with the actuator.

    I can't work out what's going on. I was getting boost/fuel cut in every gear at about 0.7-0.8 bar. Now I'm not getting the fuel cut as often but only see about 0.7 bar dropping back to 0.5 bar to redline!

    I was seeing a spike of 0.9 bar dropping to about 0.7 before the map!!

    I will contact Chipped UK again today as I've tested the boost control system and everything is functioning correctly so it's down to them now.
  20. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    Sorry only just noticed jcb and andy b had posted here too..

    Yeah as Aragorn said AFAIK the actuator takes control with the N75 unplugged.

    Andy b - I did have the same idea to put a bleed valve between the N75 and the actuator. If the map is set to fuel to 18 PSI then surely you could achieve this safely. So yours has had no issues at 16 PSI with the bleed valve then mate?

    I didn't even get a code with no actuator at 29+ PSI the other day!
  21. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    Lee: the problem lies in that its cutting boost before its even getting to 18psi...

    You said the most it would boost to is 0.9bar before fuel cutting? Seen as 0.9 bar is about 13-14psi, setting an MBC to 18psi would make no difference to the fuel cut whatsoever.
  22. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    How did I get massive boost without the actuator connected the other day with no fuel cut though? It seems the problem is the ECU (after map) not agreeing with how the N75 and actuator interact with each other.
  23. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    Jayson at Chipped UK isn't in today or tomorrow so it's going to have to wait until Monday now!! Wonder if I'll ever get this sorted out?
  24. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    This is getting beyond now isnt it?

    Lee did you pay much over the odds for the custom tune??
  25. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    get your money back, disconnect the N75 and get an MBC and see if that sorts it
  26. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    Lee, I feel for you mate... mines still not 100%... Getting the actuator tested next week. If it tests ok then I shall be going back for a refund. As you know, I've had my probs since November when I had mine done :(

    Look on the bright side though mate, you get your money abck and you will have some spare cash for those In-Pro lights of mine ;P

    <tuffty/>
  27. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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  28. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 23, 2009]
    You knows it mate ;P
  29. disco-barry
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    disco-barry New Member

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    [Jan 24, 2009]
    I'm sorry but if thats the code it's likely to be the waste gate which is at fault in the turbo, I'm sure some of you know but it's the the rod which dumps the pressure into the exhaust which won't be doing it as it will be ceased...thus limp mode and lack of boost.
  30. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 24, 2009]
    Wastegate flap moves freely and the Actuator also moves freely.
    As the turbo holds the right amount of boost ascting on its own using just boost pressure to control the actuator
  31. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 26, 2009]
    Yeah.. need to get the map working as it should or get it removed completely on my next visit to Chipped UK as I'm not happy to go away for a third time with this unresolved.

    I think I paid too much really.. seems others have had the same service but for less money which just adds to my frustration.
  32. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 26, 2009]
    Cheers mate.

    I'm not going to gain any BHP with new shiney lights though lol.
  33. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Jan 26, 2009]
    The actuator and wastegate are functioning correctly mate as Byzan said.
  34. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    Ok...

    I managed to get back to Chipped UK for the third time to try and get the fuel cut issue sorted.

    I got there at 1:30pm and left in a hire car at about 8:00pm.

    Due to the amount of times the chip had been fitted/removed they were unable to get it to fit and connect correctly. Chipped UK replaced my ECU (F.O.C.) but unfortunately the ECU wasn't available until the following day so they arranged a hire car for me.

    I collected my car the next day and was told that it was boosting to 1.15 bar but my gauge was incorrect.

    I was pleased to find that I now have no problem with fuel cut but after trying several gauges and replacing hoses I'm still only seeing a spike of 0.9 bar to settle at about 0.7 bar to redline. The car is faster now but not as it should be (1.1 - 1.2 bar).

    I also have a flat spot now between 2000 and 2500 revs which is not good.

    I do appreciate all of Chipped UK's efforts but I am not particularly happy. I wont be taking my car back to them now as I don't believe that they will be able to make any further improvements (after 4 months).
  35. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    I am so pissed i recomended them to you mate. Sorry about that.

    Andy B was in contact with someone that was going to tune his A4 t28 usuing an ecu from an A3/Golf as the DBC ones of those are flashable equiv to our ME7, they are ME 3.8.3 IIRC.
    I have one here but am waiting for Andy to get back to me as to who his tuner was so i can question them. I know Andy is having a few problems so doesnt visit here as much as he used to.

    Have you tried another boost guage mate?
  36. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    No worries.. no way you could've known mate.

    Yeah I'd be interested in finding out more about the flashable ECU.. would make life a lot easier hey.

    Yep.. tried two different gauges and get the same readings from both. Going to have a play with a bleed valve to see what the crack is then possibly introduce an MBC if the AFR is safe and I don't hit fuel cut I still might see 1+ bar.

    We going to race soon then or what? GTI Inter?
  37. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    I ******* hate cowboys :(

    Clearly they arent tuners at all, they're just loading on some maps they've got, and tweaking them about hoping to deliver something thats about right.

    Question is who is actually able to do this kinda work properly...
  38. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    :yes:

    Bring it on, :p
  39. Lee Goodall
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    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    Good question!? It seems that a real 'custom map' is hard to find.

    You're a bit handy with computers hey mate.. maybe you should give it a try lol.
  40. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 21, 2009]
    Well i have it on good authority Jabbasport are the kiddies, so i think i will enter into communication with them about this, as i m sure both Lee and I should be seeing more power than we are currently seeing.

    I mean on an s3/a3 with full stainless exhaust, free flow mani, ko4 + hybrid FMIC etc they are seeing 275 to 300 bhp and at the moment i am only seeing 240 ish, and i am not sure what Lee is seeing. IMO Lee should be seeing around 240 ish and me a bit more as my unit is the "next step up" apparently

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