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Tuning B6 S-line 190 Bhp

Discussion in 'A4/A4 cabriolet/S4 forum(B6 chassis)' started by powertuningltd, Sep 22, 2007.

  1. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    The following mods are going to be place on my car:-

    Purchase O.CT inlet pipe, imported from germany £297 shipped.
    Getting Awesome GTI to but full miltek and sports cat.
    Carbonio intake fitted, after reading this http://mjbmotorsport.com/id82.html

    Going up to Star preformance for custom remap?

    Will i need bigger injectors, say from an audi S3?

    Do i need a higher rated fuel regulator?

    Phoned MRC tuning and they say i will need bigger injectors with the miltek and intake added, otherwise not.

    Noticed on this forum a guy handled ‘bubstar’ how had a similar set-up

    But jim at star didn,t but bigger injectors on.

    Noticed tuners like APR and oettinger claim that by just increasing the injectors on my car with a remap can give more bhp, than just a standard remap.

    So i'm confussed.

    Any help would be appreciated
    cheers stephen
    #1
  2. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Related thread:-

    http://www.tyresmoke.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/465786/page/0/fpart/1/vc/1

    I will but this another way!

    If an Audi S3/TT has 225bhp as standard, and your remapping (with bolt on mods) your a4 to 235+ BHP.

    Would it not be a good idea to but S3 injectors on anyway.

    So that when you go for the remap you are not limited by maxing out your current injectors?

    oettinger seem to agree with this on there stage 2 remap.

    http://www.oettinger.de/index2_e.htm

    I guess the max BHP from just a standard remap is around 232bhp for the s-line 190 (twin intercoolers, slightly bigger injectors and turbo, over VW group 180bhp versions)

    http://www.goapr.com.au/products/ecu_upgrade_8ea418t.html

    Awesome GTI are now selling this remap, advertised on Aus APR website.

    There for my assumption is that is your going above 232bhp you will need bigger injectors / different fuel reg?

    But APR claim by putting bigger injectors on with a remap you can get even more BHP with a stage 1+ (235 bhp on a 180 bhp version)

    Surely you would need More air flow (turbo upgrade/ induction/exhaust) to take advantage of larger injectors / fuel reg limit increase.

    Or are these tuners all saying that the injectors are maxed out on a remap, and you can remap further with bigger injectors?

    I sure Bubstar, will come on line tonight and but me straight ;-):scared2:
    #2
  3. jase0851
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    jase0851 Member

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    how much are you going to spend on your car ? i was thinking about taking my 190 to jabba but cant get a response from them as to what gains i can expect from a remap. star performance is about the same distance from me as jabba so might go there
    #3
  4. dan_b
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    dan_b Member

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    What Mihnea says - with your spec the 190 engine is limited most by its injector capacity rather than by what the turbo can flow - so, you can tune it more if you up the injectors... Go with Mihnea at MRC, they know their stuff.
    #4
  5. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Background:-

    This is my 8th Audi group car.

    Used to Own:-
    An Octavia VRS 1.8t (Had it chipped my awesome/Apr + turbo pipe)
    Also own an
    S3 225(never modified) and a
    3.0 sport A4 b6 Avant.

    Out of these car i always loved the Octavia VRS, seemed to out spool the S3 and felt better on the road (Bar 4 Quattro on S3).

    Discovered the 190 sline a4 b6, and it felt like my octavia, this put a big smile on my face :hubbahubba:

    So the question about how much i would like to spend is a weird one, because i love spool-up of a KO3s compared to KO4.

    So my idea was to max out the KO3s maitaining spool-up.

    But i still open to putting a KO4 hybrid on there.

    I was going to purchase from

    http://www.kineticmotorsport.com

    a standard K04-0015 for $895 shipped

    then forward it onto turbo dynamics to convert to top spec hybrid which they quote handles upto 280-290 BHP.

    But am i not putting a bigger turbo on there and loosing some of the dynamics of a KO3s.

    Also has i prefered my octavia vrs(ko3s) chipped to my S3(ko4), do i really want to get a bigger turbo?

    I also live in cumbria, nice backroads, mybe more suited to a smaller turbo?

    I live an equal distance between Fife (Star) and Awesome Gti, but i pass awesome once a month, so i was going to get them to do hardware, and remap at fife or MRC if its not to far (1 day job).

    thanks for the replies cheers stephen
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  6. jase0851
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    jase0851 Member

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    was just wonering how much it was all gonna cost thats all
    #6
  7. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    I did phone Jabba, but there very sketch about remapping longitudanl A4 B6 1.8t, the said to by the being getting non-consistant remap results, car dependant.

    This comment but me off them a bit.

    They seem more geared towards tuning S3 engine.

    I know jim at star has the custom mapping for the 190 s-line with a switable box, also phoned MRC tuning a few times, how seemed to live and breath the knowledge about my car.

    for this reason i going for MRC or Star.
    #7
  8. jase0851
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    jase0851 Member

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    oh right i wont be using jabba then
    #8
  9. jase0851
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    jase0851 Member

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    are the intercoolers on the s3 the same size as the 190 then ?
    #9
  10. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    A4 B6 2WD 1.8T 190BHP (6 speed) Milltek cat-backdual 100mm Jet £537.66

    Milltek Hi-flow Catalyst for A4 1.8T 190BHPEX-MIL-MSAU279 £448.20

    Carbonio Intake A4 B6 1.8TAF-IND-CARB-A418TB £225

    O.ct turbo inlet pipe shipped direct from austria O.CT £297

    http://www.oct-tuning.com/shop/catalog/index.php?cPath=34&language=en

    Audi TT/S3 225 injectors
    http://www.ecstuning.com/stage/edpd/pagebuild_v2.cgi?make=Audi&engine=1.8T&model=B6%20A4&submodel=FWD&category=Engine $439 = £217 plus shipping



    Custom Remap My Jim at star around £500

    judging by bubstar dyno the following mods above should be good
    for 240 bhp(With awesome spool-up & low down grunt),
    unless of course i need larger injectors then the price goes up again, hence orignal question.

    cheers stephen
    #10
  11. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    This is a good move. It should give you between 5-10 more hp. In fact, this is the best bang-for-the-buck upgrade for our cars, next to remap.

    No. Our engines use returnless fueling system (unlike the S3) with FPR mounted inside the tank. There is no higher rate replacement available. The fuel pressure is fixed @ 4bar.

    Yes you will. Since you can't increase the fuel pressure by simply swapping the FPR, you need to put bigger injectors in to support higher boost levels.

    The type (size) of injectors used will depend on the specific programming (tuner). Most of them seem to use the widely available TT225/S3 injectors (blue, log nose), but there are some that prefere different injectors - Sportec for example. So ask before you buy.

    You will not loose spool up time with K04-15. This is a much smaller K04 model than the one used used in TT225 (K04-20). K04-15 spools up about 200rpm later than the regular K03 does. And since 190hp BEX engine uses the bigger, sport version of K03 (K03s), that difference will be even smaller.
    #11
  12. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Thanks for taking the time to answer.

    I was going to take the K04-15 and hybrid it at turbo dynamics, this makes it a bigger turbo, there charging £480 + vat.

    I don't thing the KO4-15 would be a worth while mod by itself, as you say we already have k03s with ko4 internals, giving similar results.

    Also do you not think the Carbonio is a could mod, its been dyno at star giving an extra 10 bhp.

    http://www.tyresmoke.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/268731/page/8/fpart/1/vc/1

    granted it was on an R32.

    cheers stephen.
    #12
  13. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    So far noone was able to prove (on a dyno) that Carbonio gives any gain on B6 A4.

    That is why most of the BT guys are still using the stock airbox. And that is why I didn't get one myself.
    #13
  14. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Ok Carbonio is now off my wish list, perhaps leave it to the bigger turbo boys.

    If i went for the Hybrid KO4-15 from turbo dynamics, would you recommed leaving it on the OEM manifold.

    heard Scare storied form forums and Star jim, saying that the ATP ko4 longitudinal manifold cracks.

    Jim at star even stoped selling them for this reason.

    links of manifolds below.

    http://www.kineticmotorsport.com/products/Kinetic_Motorsport_VW_AUDI_1_8T_Longitudinal_Turbo_Manifold-25-0.html

    http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ATP-VVW-156&Category_Code=VVWM

    Is the manifold itself going to give any gain, with the oem turbo?
    Star preformance used to claim 10bhp!

    Heard off forums that the OEM manifold is restrictive.

    cheers stephen
    #14
  15. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    My expirience suggest otherwise. The most restrictive part of the exhaust is not the exhaust itself, not the cat, and not even the mainfold - but the hot side of the turbo. Be it K03 or K04.

    In my expirience, putting the ATP mani doesn't do much. I have made before and after dynos, logged the mass flow, and aparently found there is little difference between the stock mani and ATP one, at least on a K04 turbo.

    I personally regret getting one.

    I have spend 400$ for the mani shipped, 150$ to get it ceramic coated, install costed me another 150$ - that makes 700$ in total for virtually no hp gain.

    Plus, the mani may still crack and the bolts back off. From what I have heard Kinetic mani is no diffrent.

    One way to prevent, or at least minimise the possibility of mani cracking, is to utilise the doenpipe connecting bracket and the factory turbo support bracket. Most BT guys do not run one and that puts A LOT of stress on the mani 'cos the whole weight of the turbo/exhaust just hangs on the mani. Stock mani cracks in those conditions as well, BTW.

    If I were you, I would just get the car remapped, install the OCT TIP and TP as an option (If your tuner knows how to disable the second O2 sensor - otherwise running a testpipe will give you a CEL). You may install the Milltek as well - mostly for tone, not hp gain.

    What I would skip is:

    1) ATP mani - no hp gain + bunch of problems
    2) Milltec HFC - again proven 0hp and 0tq gain
    3) K04 turbo - it doesn't flow much more (if anything) than your K03s; modding the turbo is opening a next pandora's box. IMO there is no way you can make K04-15 support 280hp. K04-20 - maybe, since it is much bigger, but not the lil K04-15.
    #15
  16. bubstar
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    bubstar Member

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    Hi there. I think you've answered your own questions really. I'm pleased you've found my posts useful too. There is very little info on the BEX 1.8t but there are a few about and I guess coming to the age where 2nd or 3rd owners want to play!

    You really don't need the injectors, my car hasn't missed a beat since the re-map and at a recent power run still showed a rich top end. I asked Jim at the time and he said I wouldn't need them, I'd already bought them and still own them to this day! :)

    I've just got back from the US' and was going to buy a K04-15 while there. But after speaking to Jim I spent the money on some KW V1 coilovers instead.

    I think that I've taken the car as far as I want for the forseeable future but agree with your K04 hybrid comments/ideas. Oettinger claim 270ps with their K04 so I would hope to get at least that.

    All the best

    BUB :beerchug:
    #16
  17. bubstar
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    bubstar Member

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    PS I pretty much agree with most of the info in this thread too.

    BUB :thumbsup:
    #17
  18. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    One thing I have learned over the years modding my A4 is that you have to be VERY careful about tuner claims.

    270hp is not possible from a stock K04-15, twin intercooled or not (they are putting a second IC from the BEX engine on all other 1.8Ts), so unless they are putting a bigger turbo in there, this is just what it is - a "claim".
    #18
  19. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Hi bubStar,

    i new i drag you into this thread eventually ;-)

    I have been reading your thread, which have been helpful to see your progress, especially i was thinking of a similar route.

    The thread on the O.CT pipe, lead me to purchase one, only hope that it does fit.

    I have two questions for you, which would be helpful to me:-

    1) I noticed on you wish list you wanted a miltek exhaust, did you ever purchase, did you then remap. Are you still running at 233BHP.

    2) I do believe what you saying about the injector, for a start i now they are already bigger as standard, than what on a octavia vrs 180.
    So therefore should remap to 233bhp.

    But the bit i don't understand is how can the injectors run non rich without a remap.

    You then remap and suddenly there running rich at the top end,
    i'm guessing jim open the duty cycle right up, but did't expect injector to preform that well, then tuned down the duty cycle on the top end.

    But could you not just de-tune some S3 injectors, after all there on an S3 runnning 225bhp as standard.

    Then any extra bolt on mods would simply be a remap.

    Or is there a benfit to keeping the orginal injectors.

    The reason i ask about the miltek exhust, is it cold give you 237bhp with sports cat, and thats the route i going, so i could be taking the injectors to the edge.

    cheers stephen.
    #19
  20. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    I totaly agree, i read enough forums, where client where slightly disapointed with the power diffrence from the K04-15 alone.

    Apr quote:-

    http://www.goapr.com/Audi/products/turbo_b6a4_k04.html

    247hp/286lb-ft on 93 octane gas

    probably with different injectors, and the APR full exhaust.

    I did email APR in the USA and they said the turbo was not hybrid ko4.

    I guessing with out the exhaust the would have probaby got 242 as a better comparison.

    There the swap of turbos for the k03s to a k04-15 should only be good for 9 BHP.

    However turbo dynamics are hybrding these for £495 + VAT.

    Spec below:- MD417

    High flow “K04” compressor wheel, C.N.C. re-profiled compressor housing for maximum flow, modified seal plate assembly, 360 degree “Heavy Duty” thrust bearing, left hand thread turbine large trim K04 wheel assembly, Hi-temp turbine end piston ring fitted,
    C.N.C. modified turbine housing, fitted with standard actuator (0.4 Bar), uprated actuator​
    optional. Approx 270-290 bhp potential.

    Also i now alot of A4 1.8T owners, will be intrested in this thread, so here are some useful links.

    General:-

    http://www.vaglinks.com/VAGLinks.asp

    http://www.a4mods.com/index.php?page=webcontent/pages/FAQ_Appearance.html

    http://www.c3cars.com/VW/Turbo/
    (Turbo links bottom of page)

    hybrid KO4:-

    http://www.blouchturbo.com/turbos/K04_18T_1/
    (Have alook at this guys videos, laught at Turbo charged moped).

    http://www.turbodynamics.co.uk/

    E05(direct Bolt On):-

    http://abdracing.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ADIAR&Product_Code=058.145.705.ESB

    http://www.greedspeed.com/applications/2002-2004_Audi_A4_Quattro_B6_1.8t.aspx/11/2053/_GreedSpeed_E05_Turbo_Kit

    http://www.ecodetuning.com/shop/cart.php?m=product_list&c=88


    Standard K04-15:-

    http://www.supremepowerparts.com/applications/2002-2005_Audi_A4_FWD_1.8T.aspx/1/5594/_BorgWarner_K04_0015_Turbo

    http://www.kineticmotorsport.com/products/BorgWarner_K04_015-37-141.html

    http://www.ecodetuning.com/shop/cart.php?m=product_list&c=88




    [​IMG]


    Cheers stephen






    #20
  21. bubstar
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    bubstar Member

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    I have to disagree with you there. Oettinger are one of the most respected VAG tuners in the world, if they say 270ps they mean 270ps.

    They claim 230bhp and 250lbft for their stage 2 on the BEX and that's excacly what I'm getting. So I don't think the claim is an idle one.

    BUB
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  22. bubstar
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    bubstar Member

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    They run rich because they are still capable to do so. When I say rich I mean 'safe' not lean. If they can still dump fuel at the top end then that's fine, why do I need to upgrade? I've been told by more than one tuner the reason some quote for injectors is safety rather than power, you don't want a lean top end do you? What's the point of 'detuning' some S3 injectors when the BEX ones are more than capable?

    It's all about saftey isn't it? If I wanted my car to be blown to pieces every six months I'd push the turbo to it's limits. It's running about .85 BAR and peaks at 1.0 BAR which is qiute enough. I'm getting better MPG than ever, even better than a mate who's just bought an Astra 2.0T SRi!! I'm sure if you pushed the turbo even harder and fitted the injectors more power could be had but at what cost? I don't just mean money either.................

    Yes I now have a Cat' back Milltek. I wanted it more for a bit of 'character' than anything else. But it definitely helped with spool, smoothness, midrange torque. It's a great exhaust, loud enough for people to 'know' but qiuet enough not to notice on the motorway.

    BUB :thumbsup:
    #22
  23. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Oettinger stage two does match your stage two, but i noticed that oettinger used bigger injectors :w00t:

    And has you say Oettinger have one of the best reputations!​

    I guess butting bigger injectors, just stops smaller injectors been stressing past there design tolerance.​

    Either way both should do the same job at around 233 bhp :icon_thumright: ​

    Here are K04-15 Dynos with miltek exhaust.

    [​IMG]

    Bubstar setup still runing KO3S/TIP/remap.

    [​IMG]

    i guess the above thread confirms, that you olny gain around 9 HP extra by adding a K04-15 on the 190bhp.​

    But you do get an extra 30 ft-lb of tq which i guess is not to be sniffed at.​

    I know a guy how told jimbo at awesome, that the APR Ko4 kit was a waste of time, because of the small HP gains upgrading from k03s.
    Jimbo then give him a test drive in a clients octavia VRS with the ko4 kit on.
    The guy soon changed his mind when he felt the torque kicking in early.​

    cheers stephen
    #23
  24. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    Thanks for the link, I haven't heard about this mod or this company. I would like to see any feedback from someone who is using it.

    From what I have read, ppl that were using the other hybrid you mentioned - the E05 - have had a lot of issues.
    #24
  25. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    Then our expiriences differ. I have many friends that got remap from MTM, Oetinger, ABT etc. and many of them had problems reaching the advertised numbers.

    But do not get me wrong - I'm not saying it is not possible. Waht I'm sayimg is that you should always take tuners claims with a grin of salt.
    #25
  26. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    link to turbo dynamics in the uk.

    http://www.turbodynamics.co.uk/index.html

    I beleive most of the UK tuners get the hybrid KO4 turbos from there.

    All the UK tuners say there KO4 hybrids are a closley guarded secret.

    Not any More :thrashi:
    #26
  27. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    I guess the miltek exhaust and sports cat, will do little at 233 bhp

    But i spoken to JBS, star, Amd AND MRC & non of them will even entertain a ko4 or k04 hybrid with out a new exhaust (most sell miltek).

    There for at 270 bhp a ko4 hybrid, with full mitek exhaust system should make a difference, especially at high revs where more air is trying to escape in a shorter time period (due to greater accellaration).

    So i guess the miltek exhaust, preformance wise, is all about controlling the correct back pressure to the turbo, rather than bolt on HP gains.

    Also on the oem turbo or the ko4s, should both gain some spool-up benefit, as the back presure is offset with new exhaust / sports cat.

    that my theory :shutup2:
    #27
  28. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    Did you ask about the cat delete file ? If they do have one, then why bother with the Milltec HFC ?

    Test pipe is 10x cheaper, and in strong contrast to HFC, actually offers some gains. Shure it is not enviroment friendly, but so what - who cares.

    95% of the BT guys in the US run a testpipe instead of HFC.
    #28
  29. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    I have thought about it, i guess its just the effort off putting it on and off for every MOT.

    But i guess this is not to hard, a its just a could of bolts either side.

    http://www.ecodetuning.com/shop/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=370

    http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=ATP-VVW-139&Category_Code=VVWTK


    notice most guys are running some sought of non-fouler to avoid Cell light

    http://forums.audiworld.com/a4/msgs/2511177.phtml

    wheres the best place to buy a quality test pipe?

    I sure with the octavia and seat cupra, they where drill out there cats!


    cheers stephen.
    #29
  30. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    IMO they are all the same. Get the one which is cheapest. I have seen the ecode one beeing sold for 129$.

    Ppl seem to have mixed luck with non-foulers. Sometimes they work, and sometimes they don't. That is why it is best to have the second O2 sensor deactivated on a software level. My Sportec software does just that.
    #30
  31. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    I never really heard of Sportec, where do you get it from?

    cheers stephen
    #31
  32. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    Sportec is a reputable tuner from Switzerland. They mostly do Porsches and Audis.

    www.sportec.ch

    Their K04 stage II kit (235hp) for BEX engine is 3500 GBP and their Stage III kit (250hp) is 6000 GBP.
    #32
  33. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Audi Hybrid Turbochargers

    Brief Specifications: -

    Stage 1 – MD159

    Hi flow K04 compressor wheel, cnc machined compressor housing , cut back turbine blades, lightening of turbine wheel for faster ‘spool up’,modified turbine housing, ported wastegate, uprated turbine seals.
    Other ‘blueprinting’ modifications. APPROX 200 - 220 BHP


    Stage 2 – 5304-988-0015

    K04 retrofit drop in turbocharger, as made by KKK for Audi Tuning Germany with other ‘blueprinting’

    modifications. APPROX 240 - 250 BHP


    Stage 3 – MD178

    K04 retrofit drop in turbocharger, as made by KKK for Audi Tuning Germany with Hi flow T28 compressor wheel, cnc machined compressor housing , cut back turbine blades, lightening of turbine
    wheel for faster ‘spool up’,modified turbine housing, ported wastegate, uprated turbine seals. other
    ‘blueprinting’ modifications. APPROX 260 - 270 BHP


    Stage 4 – MD417


    High flow “K04” compressor wheel, C.N.C. re-profiled compressor housing for maximum
    flow, modified seal plate assembly, 360 degree “Heavy Duty” thrust bearing, left hand
    thread turbine large trim K04 wheel assembly, Hi-temp turbine end piston ring fitted,
    C.N.C. modified turbine housing, fitted with standard actuator (0.4 Bar), uprated actuator
    optional. Approx 270-290 bhp potential.



    Stage 5 – 5316-988-6717


    K16 retrofit turbocharger, as made by KKK for Audi Tuning Germany, this unit requires aftermarket manifolding, pipework and exhaust system. APPROX 350 - 380 BHP

    Options: - All the above turbochargers can be fitted with any of the listed options by request/ special order and at extra cost, if not part of the standard specification. One off specifications and turbo matching also available.
    1. Uprated wastegate actuator
    2. Uprated actuator bracket
    3. Larger wastegate valve


    Retail Price List


    Type Part No. Current List Price – Brand New Units


    Stage 1 MD159 £815.00

    Stage 2 5304-988-0015 £1025.00

    Stage 3 MD178 £1100.00

    Stage 4 MD417 £1150.00

    Stage 5 5316-988-6717 £1578.00
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  34. bubstar
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    bubstar Member

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    Stage 3 sounds interesting!!

    Better start saving..........

    BUB :wacko:
    #34
  35. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Stage 4 (importing turbo):-

    Import ko4-015 turbo from kineticmotorsport

    895USD (£442.87) shipped to you door,

    clay said he would send normal post, so you should dodge import tax.

    post turbo to Turbo Dynamics in UK £10.

    cost of stage 4 working on your own turbo £495.00 + vat = £581.63

    Total cost for stage 4 = £581.63 + £442.87 = £1024.50

    Stage 4 (buying off the shelf):-

    £1150.00 + VAT = £1351.25

    Total Saving when importing:-£1351.25 - £1024.50 = £326.75



    or import Blouch Hybrid k04 Turbo 270 bhp

    £591 + £86.60 = £677.60


    http://www.blouchturbo.com/turbos/K04_18T_1/
    #35
  36. Elberoth
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    Elberoth Member

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    I'm still a bit suspicious. If it is that good, why nobody use it ?

    There are likely more than 100 ppl on AZ and AW running K04 setups, and noone uses K04 hybrid :think:
    #36
  37. Kingfisher
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    I've just read all this, interesting!
    I haven't heard about these particular hybrids ( I know all about hybrids from S2 RS2 engines)
    It sound a bit daft importing these turbos and then spending even more £££ on them etc etc. Why isn't it possible to buy this version in the UK? - or is it exchange only.
    Sounds like a group buy could be in order !

    Oh, the clutch is inclined to give out after about 235 + ish so be prepared !! Don't tell me you'are gentle koz it it's there we all use it sooner or later !

    Bub, Hi ! not seen you for months
    If Oettinger says x it will be x minimum ,the Law in Germany sees to that, they cannot risk it being tested and showing less, it's also part of the TUV regulations I believe.
    #37
  38. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    There not much information out the on the BEX 190 turbo, but i found this taken from i guy how works for


    http://www.gpopshop.com/kkkturbos.html


    It reads to me like the KO3 Sport is better than the k04-015 bar the jornal bearings and wastegate.

    See what you think info below, enjoy:-



    After
    2002-12 the A4/B6 1.8t motor used a different turbo its part # is 53039880073 and the reference # for this turbo is 06B 145 703 B. This turbo has the same a slightly larger compressor wheel than the K04-015 turbo and the same size turbine wheel. This turbo is probably the biggest reason that this model makes 190HP instead of the old 150HP version. We would think that this last turbo listed here is what is call the K03 Sport turbo, although Borg Warner/KKK do not call it this in any of there information.

    February 1995- April 1998 Audi A4/A6, Passat 1.8T used K03-005 turbo

    May 1998- December 1998 Audi A4/A6, Passat 1.8T used K03-025 turbo

    January 1999- November 2002 Audi A4/A6, Passat 1.8T used K03-029

    December 2002- up Audi A4/B6 (Quattro) 1.8T used K03-073

    From what we have seen and learned about these turbos is that if you have the -073 turbo on your vehicle, you actually have a turbo that can match or exceed the K04-015 by adjusting the wastegate. The only down fall of these turbos (-073's) in the stock form is the journal bearing.
    The K04-015 is the only one of these turbos (that we are comparing) that comes with the heavy duty bearing system in stock form.
    The K03-015 compressor housing (cold side) is dimensionally the same as the K04-015 other than the internal bore.

    Additionally, the turbine housing on the k03-029 and the k03-073 is the same. Also, the compressor wheel for the K03-073 is actually a little larger than the K04-015 turbo and uses Borg Warner's extended tip technology. This makes the wheel more efficient, and has a wider map.
    The fins are longer, and more curved than the K04-015 compressor wheel.
    #38
  39. Elberoth
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    This a very good info ! It confirms what I have heard from one tuner here in Poland.

    The BEX turbo has a bigger turbine with BIGGER INLET diameter.

    From what I have checked at ETKA, that turbo (06B 145 703 B) was only stock on BEX engine though. All others models (pre and past 2002) were equipped with the smaller turbo (06B 145 703 J).
    #39
  40. powertuningltd
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    powertuningltd couldnt fix your brakes,so I made your horn Louder

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    Its been identified above that the wastegate, is weaker on the KO3 Sport.

    Wouldn't ECS RACE N75 Valve make a massive difference to the KO3 sport turbo.

    http://www.ecstuning.com/stage/n75-info.html

    quote: what is an ECS N75 valve, what does it do, where can I get one and how much? ​
    The N75 valve is a stock part and controls the operation of the wastegate on the turbo, (essentially controls your max boost levels with inputs from the ECU ) The ECS "Race N75 valve is hopped up version of the stock allowing you to run slightly more boost than your ECU would normally allow. http://www.ecstuning.com/stage/n75-info.html sells them.

    It should suddenly get gains like Ko4-15?
    #40

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