1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

TQS progress thread, From STD-Scroll-Eliminator.

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by Broken Byzan, Nov 14, 2009.

  1. ScottD3
    Offline

    ScottD3 I want your faulty electronics

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2010
    Messages:
    15,105
    Likes Received:
    1,012
    [Nov 16, 2012]
    I was going to ask that but I forgot the correct word. lol
  2. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Well she's a runner and on her second oil change. I now need to put some miles on it on actuator to start with and then work up to full boost.

    A few teething problems in so much as the painted block affected the ability of the engine mount to make an earth connection, this causes a smaller earth to get a tad warm on winding to prime fluids. I have fixed that. She was dead stubborn in bleeding the coolant system took a while and lots of squishing and random filling etc. I got there in the end and the new,low temp stat is keeping the temp steady at 86, whereas before it was stable at 97. Both of these stats showed as 90 on the gauge.

    Bill has kindly offered me an hour on the ramps, I'm going to use that time to stick the welded centre diff in to 2wd it. And knock a turbo support bracket ready for the tubular manifold

    I'll snap a pic of it in the bay tomorrow, I completely forgot to do it today.

    Only new thing i have bought...

    [​IMG]

    I couldn't resist,lol
  3. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Add that to me not bothering to check it before fitting it you get ^^ That piston rattly rubbish
  4. Soupie69uk
    Offline

    Soupie69uk Owner

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2004
    Messages:
    2,787
    Likes Received:
    6
    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Looking forward to hearing about when you drive it. I just got a black quattro front badge too.
  5. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Nov 21, 2012]
    ..but how will people know what engine you've got? :think: ;)
  6. Bradderz_1988
    Online

    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,228
    Likes Received:
    106
    [Nov 21, 2012]
    I have the same grill badge lol bit smaller than the original but looks alot better imo
  7. CraigG
    Offline

    CraigG Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2008
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    [Nov 22, 2012]
    you shoulda went for gen audi badges :eek:
  8. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,569
    Likes Received:
    313
    [Nov 22, 2012]
    I quite like that quattro badge, is it black with red font or chrome with red font?

    Not sure on the 2.0T badge though, sort of gives the game away doesnt it? I'd be tempted to put a 1.6 badge on there or something :p It also appears to be VW font, rather than Audi?
  9. Bradderz_1988
    Online

    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,228
    Likes Received:
    106
    [Nov 22, 2012]
    Agree you need the 2.0T badge from a B7 looks alot better than the VW font one, they are black with red font dont no if the rear is any different in size ?
  10. AR-rkon
    Offline

    AR-rkon Midlands regional Moderator Regional Rep

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    Messages:
    1,706
    Likes Received:
    78
    [Nov 22, 2012]
    [​IMG]

    Misleading but still kinda true :D 2L Turbo Direct Injection
  11. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Nov 24, 2012]
    It was all i could find, Link me fellas.

    As for the TDi or 1.6 nah, either none or 2.0 so peeps think huh, they didn't make that as a 2.0 etc, sad but hey.

    A little porgress today, but NEED to WB my car asap as I have had enough of my oddball ECU and trying to find the map locations within it to tweak stuff.

    I was getting a torque intervention2 code that drops the car to idle when it ping, not ideal at night in the rain. You can reset it with a ign on/off, but that stops the headlights and wipers :keule:


    Made use of this.
    [​IMG]

    ANd can now do this.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I forgot how **** 2wd was in the rain, and how much I hate torque steer. OMG one day in and I miss quattro already,LOL

    I also took the chance to finish hashing my turbo support bracket up( no pics) ready for the tubular manifold I'll get in the new year.

    So when i get a spare few hours I'm pinning the WB swap parts in VVT amf the WB 02 sensor into one loom direct from the ECU and leave the NB pins ans connector taped up safe I think
  12. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,569
    Likes Received:
    313
    [Nov 24, 2012]
    nice one :D

    How did it do on the dyno?
  13. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,569
    Likes Received:
    313
    [Nov 24, 2012]
  14. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Nov 24, 2012]
    Nor me, It's why I bought the one I did, I spose I could get the 1.8T one and stick a + on the end...?
  15. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
  16. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Nov 24, 2012]
    Didn't do a power run as such, was trying to get to the bottom of the torque code, iirc at some throttle and aborting sub 5k it was 200bhp, but we wern't looking for outputs just yet. But she behaved which was nice.

    I will suffer boost creep by the looks, but once N75 is on and WB is done it can start being done


  17. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Nov 26, 2012]
    Personally I would go with no badges. As THE classic movie says..

    Sweet ride! Whatcha runnin' under there, man?...
    ...You're gonna make me find out the hard way?

    ...Hell yeah!
  18. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Nov 26, 2012]
    LMAO, problem is it loks the same from the outside.

    I'll nail it on seeing i have it, and decide what to do from there. Probably take me weeks to get around to it anyway tbh :(

    This weeks plan is WB I think , only 5 wires to plumb in and MAF and 02 sensor to change
  19. docurley
    Offline

    docurley Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2003
    Messages:
    3,859
    Likes Received:
    25
    [Dec 5, 2012]
    Nice work and going 2.0 nice, my oil pump dumped on me and killed my lump so I got to put another in.
  20. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 8, 2012]
    Dave I read about that, you know where I am if i can help at all

  21. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 8, 2012]
    Soooooooo, Had a little time to knock up a loom with the extra bits ready for the wideband swap. I am looking to ask Bill / Paul to code everything out except the VVT . I will then only need to pin that and the 02 sensor differences in.

    I chose to de pin the standard NB 02 sensor pins at the ECU end and pin my newly made loom in. I needed to remove 3 pins from pin 70,5 and 51 and replace them with the appropriate ones for the WB and then add one extra wire to pin 52 at ECU. I have chosen to use a blade fuse piggyback to power the VVT and the new 02 plug up..

    in short it was
    vvt to pin 115
    Wb 02 pin1 to ecu 70
    WB 02 pin2 to ecu 71
    WB 02 pin3 to 12V +VE
    WB 02 pin4 to ECU pin 5
    WB 02 pin5 to ECU 51
    WB 02 pin6 to ECU 52

    Wired it in and it started up immediately due to Tuffty building a basic map into my ECU already.

    Now while it was idling to ensure things were working while logging things Bill noticed that the expected condensation had some substance to it, typically it seems that the valve guides I didn't change now seep with the new found vacuum and boost. So a new head core has been acquired and now will be built up ready for a straight swap.

    Since tweaking the file to adjust basic running the car has developed a very bad lean misfire. We are not sure if it's related to the mapping or some coincidence and an additional faulty part.

    The misfire seems to be worst after a long cruise, slow down for a roundabout or whatever and the fuel trims will be swing from a few % to -27% and she will pop and bang. If I can manage to get around this the trims raise to 2% add and up to 20% on application of throttle, I assume that's normal enrichment taking place.

    I have logged some bits and we are going to revert back to a standard file to rule the tuned file out, I also think i will pressure test the fuel pump for peace of mind.

    The running seems to be the same with both the MAF and 02 sensors disconnected and much better by just swapping the NB ECU in as a test with no other changes.

    That's where we are at the mo. I am hoping Bill can find the time to tweak it some before the R-tech rolling road day on the 29th of December 2012 as it looks like it will be an awesome day.

    No videos or anything as there is nothing specific to show or report
  22. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,569
    Likes Received:
    313
    [Dec 8, 2012]
    Check valve or something leaking under vacuum?
  23. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 8, 2012]
    Dunno, I guess I could clamp some off for testing. Smoke test revealed nothing sadly
  24. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 9, 2012]
    Ive canged the n80 just in case and swapped out 2 check vlves just in case, still the same.

    TBH i am not 100% its anything map related, but mere coincedence and someting is about to bite me in the arse.

    I have no easy way to check fuel pressure, but it's pumping fuel and the fpr seems clean, Sigh. this is supposed to be the end of this, not the begining of more prtoblems
  25. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 13, 2012]
    It turns out that something within the ecu code was intervening, so Bill reverted the code to stock and worked from there.

    All of the new Tiv code was applied and the hunt for perfomance was started...

    [​IMG]

    First attempts showed immediately where the problem was going to be, even in inertia mode we still had issues with heat build up.

    [​IMG]

    It seems the hotside is more restrictive than it would at first seem. This is causing the air to just back up and create heat.
    The fueling is doing exactly as it's being asked, I love wideband..

    [​IMG]

    Ironically on actuator the overall power is much the same as it is with n75 connected due the the restrictive hotside causing boost creep.

    The daft thing is that given the flow it was showing 291gs of air, so there should be a good 360 BHP there, but it's just being converted to hot air.

    Timing was added, but then reverted to almost stock which is not as expected from a large port head and big IC pipework/FMIC.

    If we glance at the graph, we can see the power being made at relatively low revs due to the air flow just bogging down and it being wasted as heat.

    [​IMG]

    Also noted was that the new short engine was working perfectly, but the old head core now it has proper compression and vacuum seeps oil down the valve guide seals causing it to smoke on the over run and on long term idle. So a new head core has been acquired ( thanks Kev) and it will be built with Supertech valves for a one off repair.

    While that's being done I will rip the turbo off and see if I can convince Bill to port it for me, and I'll add a tubular relentless style manifold. I cannot really do any more that this, WMI may be added, but i do not want to become dependent on the Meth.

    Torque comes on quickly and falls off almost as quick as it went. Graph to follow.

    Map switching was also added to allow to be tried out in the real world. I will report on how this goes as I spend some time with it
  26. Bradderz_1988
    Online

    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,228
    Likes Received:
    106
    [Dec 14, 2012]
    Engine bay looks sweet mate, hats off to you really makes me wanna do a 2.0 but dont have the time/cash at present, first thing for me is get the exhaust manifold/turbo replaced doug can do me the F21 upgrade under the no fault replacement with comp housing so is slightly bigger than my F4.

    The only doubt i have is these cast manifolds cracking, i may go down route of heat wrapping it or i may go down the route off a tubular stainless jobbie cant decide.
  27. Welly
    Offline

    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2009
    Messages:
    10,699
    Likes Received:
    117
    [Dec 14, 2012]
    Some more to come from this Mark me thinks, that torque should be more sustainable that that with some choice tweaks, or is it hardware limitation?
  28. badger5
    Offline

    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

    Joined:
    May 28, 2004
    Messages:
    7,326
    Likes Received:
    694
    [Dec 14, 2012]
    of the assorted files, currently it thinks its a TT.. lol, previously thinking it was an LCR on tufftys version.
    thats been parked for now, and known decent working platform code used to dial in.

    also using it to test the new map switching code, for gear based boost... ideal for the wet weather and a 2WD quattro :p
  29. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,569
    Likes Received:
    313
    [Dec 14, 2012]
    Any thaughts on whats holding it back bill?
  30. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 14, 2012]
    A quick test of the gear related boost today, it's quite useful for non quattro cars.

    25 % boost in 1st
    35 % in 2nd
    45 in 3rd
    and whatever you have your boost capped at in the rest of the gears.

    While testing I thought my clutch had bought it, but turns out she will spin in 4th too, damned Torque, might have to limit that for now,lol
  31. CraigG
    Offline

    CraigG Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2008
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    [Dec 17, 2012]
    i doubt you will have any such problems when you get the car running 4wd, bit of a waste of effort doing all that while its in FWD mode, just cutting yourself short when you reconnect rear wheels!
  32. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 17, 2012]
    I agree, but the car is being used an alternative test mule while it's 2wd because it's avaiable. Once it's quattro I want it all, everywhere.

    She won't be 4wd'd till i have finished getting it tuned because I want it right and not fecked up by using someone I don't trust just because they have a 4wd dyno. All the gear and no idea......

    Expensive error on my part choosing MRC and I will do my best to spread the word on the rubbish they told me and the poor customer service i received from them. They mainly got chosen due to the 4wd dyno and apparently some experience in 1.8t's, sadly no.
  33. CraigG
    Offline

    CraigG Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2008
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    [Dec 17, 2012]
    i thought the test mule bit might have been the reason for this, but wont that mean you will need to get it remapped again, once going onto 4wd? is that going to be done on the road?
  34. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 17, 2012]
    Mapping will not be affected by qty of driven wheels. Load is load.

    Once the head is changed, manifold changed, exhaust housing on turbo ported and IC replaced, i am hoping the combination will allow more timing due to decreased AITs.

    The greater flow should then allow the engine to breath properly and turn more of the injested air to power/ flow.

    Reverting to quattro will just allow me to get it to the road, but will make no odds on the engine mapping.

    Oh, your sig is wrong,LOL
  35. CraigG
    Offline

    CraigG Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2008
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    2
    [Dec 18, 2012]
    ok so your not keeping your map to be 25% boost in first, 35 in second etc etc?

    so you will be doing the map with boost limiting to see it working on a FWD car, then "fixing" that map to suit your correct wheel drive setup?

    and yes, my signature is indeed wrong... although technically i do still have an Imola S4, and all of those mods, they just arent connected to one another :D
  36. docurley
    Offline

    docurley Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2003
    Messages:
    3,859
    Likes Received:
    25
    [Dec 20, 2012]
    Thanks for that but the AA cover coverd the bill and shes back-up and running.

    I've lost at whats in your motor and what turbo your running may be add a little info in your sig as im lost.:keule:

    It would be interesting to find out how much a custom map costs these day shame but then I'm also quattro.
  37. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Dec 24, 2012]
    I attmpted to capture the no lift shift and launch control in action from inside, but the amount of spin makes it hard to capture. Every time i NLS it just lights up the wheels and the spin hides the pop from the change. It was a bit drier on the test road today and when i hooked it up in 4th and 5th the clutch started to slip so I aborted it there.

    Will try again over the next few day or so, maybe from the outside on a drive by or something. It seems a go-pro or similar will inevitably be required to capture it properly nailed on the outside near the exhaust, I have seen this in a vid and it captured it very well

    [​IMG]
  38. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Jan 8, 2013]
    [​IMG]

    A few bits are arriving, wellycooler will need some pipes welding to it, the manifold looks ok, but will have some additional tabs welded to it to add strength. The WMI will be set up as an additon to cooling, rather than required
  39. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,597
    Likes Received:
    273
    [Jan 14, 2013]
    [​IMG]

    Next stage of the build will be happening shortly as the idle smoking from the guide is getting worse.

    So the valves are going to be changed for these drop in replacement performance valves.

    So to scare the car out of breaking down, I've got hold of an ARP head stud kit.

    Thanks to Gops for the coil pack adapters, I will stick them on when I do the head swap.

    I was giving the car some beans yesterday and while giving it some I encountered a really odd noise from the back of the engine ( at least that's where it sounded from from my seat)

    When I shut the car down and restarted it she threw a code and put the engine light on, upon scanning the code, it came back to set point not reached from the damn chinese copy VVT. So I have had to bite the bullet and buy a new OEM unit. Hopefully that's what the noise was.

    I found while the light was on and she was in semi limp, the spool up had changed later up the rev range and the misfire I had at low revs had reduced..

    It would seem that the vvt is active quite early on and has a profound effect on the way the car drives.

    Research needed on revs it's active.

    Hopefully the head swap and build will get rid of the smoke and the new VVT will stop the car making silly and frankly, quite scary noises
  40. Bradderz_1988
    Online

    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2010
    Messages:
    3,228
    Likes Received:
    106
    [Jan 14, 2013]
    Wheres that manifold from mark ????

    Chop chop and get it done i wana see what powwwaarr she makes lol what you hoping for or should i say what do you want out of it ?? 400bhp ??

Share This Page