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Time for a build thread....big turbo

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by S3Alex, Oct 19, 2010.

  1. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Jan 31, 2014]
    Hi there.

    Yes I do look in
    and had a good look through yours and quite a few other threads too.

    You guys put a lot of far bigger cars to shame.

    Mine has 1 bar springs in the wastegate and just about holds 2bar but you can feel it losing boost as soon as it hits that or just under.

    We will go for 1.5bar and do the rest with the boost controller as it's well short of what the engine and turbo should be capable of.

    Please let me know how you get on...there's no substitute for other ideas and experiences to help set your own car up.
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  2. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 31, 2014]
    No probs... I only realistically plan to run 1.8bar max... with map switching I may have a dyno queen boost setting of course but I think at that boost on my hardware it should land power somewhere between 500-600hp but I will also look at trying a set of IE street cams... not looking at maxing mine tbh... was never about the figures... I enjoy doing the work as much as driving the car tbh... I like the fabricating side of things :)

    <tuffty/>
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  3. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Jan 31, 2014]
    That's superb.
    Remember the old V6 1.5L F1 turbos.
    1200bhp from that!

    I'm pretty sure that if it holds 2.2 bar it will easily top 500bhp as well as solving the torque roll off as the wastegate bleeds off boost right now.

    The new intake may help a bit as well.
    Then there's the valve gear which would allow a higher rpm limit.

    Like you,I love driving the car but also the technology.
    I'm rubbish at fabricating things but AMD do well to cope with making the plans work.
  4. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 31, 2014]
    Torque roll off will most likely be cams... didn't notice if you said you had any fitted but on 20v engines on std cams torque always falls away at 5.8k ish... doesn't matter what boost/turbo/hardware etc it just drops off... on Bills (Badger5) Ibiza race car his torque is still rising at its current redline of 8.5k... thats down to cams...

    All about the flow... on my old GT3071 setup I used a log manifold and was underslung like yours... this really compromises flow at the top end meaning more you need much more boost to get it working... the collector is quite and important part of the manifold and the log mani was rubbish so for this iteration I made my own tubular manifold...
    [​IMG]

    1.5" nominal bore fittings... will flow nicely...

    I guess inlet solutions are thin on the ground for TFSI applications... I made my own using a large plenum and the large port runners from an AEB A4 inlet manifold... I gained nearly 20hp at 15psi from just bolting it on...

    Here are a couple of pics of my stroker 20v... should be going back in the car in the next couple of weeks..
    [​IMG]

    ...and of course for the OE look...
    [​IMG]

    <tuffty/>
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  5. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 1, 2014]
    Now that I love.....it looks stunning.

    The TFSi is nowhere near as tidy looking,and really does look like a rat's nest by comparison.

    From what I've seen,the stock cams are OK out to around 6000rpm,but above that there does seem to be a marked benefit in some decent aftermarket ones,but as you've guessed,there are very few around right now,and the only ones seem to be the Cat Cams but right now what I'm not sure of is if the pistons needs to be pocketed to take them.

    There are basically 2 inlet manifolds......either the HEP or this beauty....

    [​IMG]

    Tubular manifolds are also a pain to come by......the BSH one appears not to be available.
    The BSH was going to be the basis of the Revo,which is also not available,and no one else is making them either.

    Yours' on the other hand,looks amazing,and also has roguhly the right sort of placement for the turbo on mine......it needs to be offset to the left,as you look from the front of the engine.

    The other problem is clearing the diff,and leaving enough room on the other side to get the intake onto the turbo.

    Torque is also an issue.....the gearbox is good for 450lbs,but I'm not sure how much more,so the torque limitation isn't so bad,I guess.

    My Romanian mate is getting 750bhp from his,on race fuel,but has limited the torque to around the same as I'm running.
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  6. Sevv
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    Sevv Pushing the limits..

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    [Feb 2, 2014]
    Force Fed Engineering has developed turbo manifold parts for many applications and we have no extended to the 2.0FSI.

    Highlights of our parts for this application that make out products better than the competition are the following.

    Our manifolds are easier to install and much more straight forward. Our manifolds remove the wedge block lower clamp and use the studs alone.

    Our head flanges are CNC machined and taper out to the ID of the materials proven across the industry to be the standard for performance results.

    We have developed these manifolds to go above and beyond the mediocre alternatives with small ID runners and ill fitting design.

    These manifolds are available in several configurations.

    They come standard in T3, T25 and Tial Vband connections. They come standard with either Tial MVS 38mm vband or Tial 44mm wastegate applications.

    If you are looking to purchase a manifold for your FSI or TSI please call us before ordering to discuss turbo chargers and application options

    price tag $1,099


    your only problem would be having to get some custom fabrication for the DP


    http://store.forcefedengineering.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=FFE_Street_Topmount_2.0T
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  7. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 3, 2014]
    I think what I'll be doing is my usual incremental(or maybe just mental) approach.

    Do the inlet manifold,get it all running,get the other parts sorted,and then back for another bite at the exhaust etc later.
  8. kylej1
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    kylej1 New Member

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    [Feb 19, 2014]
    are you still interested in the carbon wings, im looking into getting some carbon wings made that will be OEM lines but 30mm wider so you can run wider tyres
  9. kylej1
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    kylej1 New Member

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    [Feb 19, 2014]
    Im at the point where id love more power over the stage 2+ or the cars for sale in the summer, I have big brakes and suspension to suit but noticed youd have a APR GTX2867 kit, does this kit need built engine?whats yourreasons for saying this? is it cause its developed and shouldnt have as many issues. Id love 500+ but i see even your struggling with this and my pockets aint deep enough lol
  10. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 19, 2014]
    Hi kyle.

    The APR kit doesn't need a fully built engine,as it doesn't go beyond the stock rods torque limit,or at least what we all assume that to be,at around 440-480lbs.

    The reason I recommend that kit is that it's a complete,bolt on solution,and comes with all of the parts etc that you'd need for a good,fast car,with around 440-460bhp.

    The current alternative for more,would be the CTS turbo kit,with a GTX3076.

    Now mine is an ATP turbo kit,with a lot of extra bits,such as an auxiliary fuel pump,WMI kit,and an Owen Developments GTX3076 with uprated bearing carriers etc.
    The reason I've not got beyond 500bhp currently isn't anything other than not having the time to have the uprated wastegate springs fitted,which will allow the car to run 2.2bar without the wastegate opening.

    Other than that,it's fine,and all of the other plans are down to my usual project planning for the year.
    I want the intake manifold and injectors ready for a bit more fuelling and power,the valvetrain in place,and then I can attend to the exhaust manifold etc.
    My method is to do things safely and incrementally,so that we know parts work,without grenading the engine.
  11. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Oh well...took the plunge and coughed up for the intake manifold today.

    Made by Boulekos Dynamic in Athens.


    Tuning & Motorsport - Boulekos Dynamic



    The one with the extra fuel rail and injector ports,and fingers crossed that delivery all goes as planned.

    There's a choice of 4 colours for the rail(!) so I thought red went well with petrol.


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    Shiny shiny....
  12. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    At least it should keep the backs of your inlets clean :)

    Very shiny... will need lots of engine bay shots once its in lol (I would have probably painted it black though ;P)

    <tuffty/>
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  13. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Hi there!......yes,once the extra injectors are in use,it should keep those valve stems clean at last.

    I would probably have gone for black if that was an option but it only comes in shiny ally,but I can't complain as the rest of the engine bay is either black or dirty right now!

    What I want to do is to get it installed first,with the injectors and rail fitted but not fuelled and just get it running as a baseline,before doing anything else.
    I know where to go for the off-board injector controller,and also would need a small swirl pot and some fitting work on the LP fuel lines,but as before USP Motorsport seem to have pretty much all of those bits that I would need.
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  14. S.
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    S. Well-Known Member

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Lovely manifold Alex.
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  15. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Thanks very much.

    I looked at the very few alternatives there are around right now.

    The IE one isn't even available for sale at the moment,and that leaves this beauty,and the HEP,which is now only from the US as far as I know,as Sorensen no longer seem to be carrying them.

    Plus...the really good selling point was my mate who has one on his bonkers Golf R.

    I couldn't get a better recommendation than that.
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  16. grchmason
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    grchmason Member

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Great work Alex!

    Just spent a hour going through all this! A truly superb read, I will hopefully get to see this beast in the flesh at some stage or when I get a chance to get mine booked in at AMD!

    A real credit to you fella

    Cheers
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  17. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Thanks very much indeed!

    To be honest all I do is to get the ideas,and find the bits,whereas the real credit should go to both AMDTuning for making the ideas work,and to all my friends here and on VAGOC,who are always there to help when needed.

    Anytime you're thinking of going to AMDTuning,drop me a line and I'll see if I'm around.....then you're welcome to see what they can do to an S3.
  18. grchmason
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    grchmason Member

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    [Feb 25, 2014]

    That would be great Alex really appreciated!

    I'm just getting all my bits and bobs on before they get there hands on it for the stage 2 remap!

    My best mate lives in Rainham so i'm down that way quite a lot i'm only a 50 min drive from AMD and have only heard great things about them.

    Speak soon, cheers
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  19. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    They've always done superb work for me,and given me something fast and reliable.

    They also have plenty more work to do this year!
  20. stetheo
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    stetheo Active Member

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Ohhh more car porn :jump:

    Very shiny manifold, I like the contrasting red as well. Can't wait to see the benefits.
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  21. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    Neither can I!

    This thing comes very highly recommended to me,and whatever else,I don't want VAG's finest plastic OEM manifold cracking on me one day,and leaving me with a long slow drive home.

    It's already dealing with 2 bar,and I think that much more is going to be testing it a bit,whereas aluminium isn't going to crack.

    I like having a few projects for AMD each year,and this is the first for this year.

    After that's fitted,we have to get the injectors up and running,and then maybe get down to the head and valvetrain depending on time.
  22. stetheo
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    stetheo Active Member

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    I must say I'm surprised that the OEM manifold car withstand 2bar that actually quite impressive. This new one though will take that 2 bar easily in its stride!

    Sounds like this year is going to be a gooden then, if you can get all that done it's going to completely change the car.

    Man, it makes me want to take my car further. Trying to be sensible this year though...trying being the all important word in that haha.
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  23. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    I was going to be very sensible when I bought this car.

    It wasn't going to be modded in any way etc etc......now look at it!

    I'm quite surprised by the OEM manifold as well,but the flow characteristics can't be the best,and the plenum chamber is pretty small compared to this.

    Plus...it looks a bit better.
  24. Kelza
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    Kelza MODERATOR Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 25, 2014]
    WOW WOW and WOW great work Alex :arco:
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  25. Audi S3 freak
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    Audi S3 freak Member

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    [Feb 26, 2014]
    s3 alex you are to blame for me being up until this god forsaken hour!! haha awesome build buddy! when I go past the current stage 2+ I will be using all these 23 pages as a guideline :) thanks again for keeping me up all night and the awesome info which I will now pester my car doctor (brother) with!! haha
    I too used amd to do my stage 2 on my 8l s3 which took them almost 7 bloody hours!! well worth the wait although I did give them some stick for making me spend more than what their bill was in lakeside on **** I didn't need! :mad:
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  26. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 26, 2014]
    Thank you!

    I'm only doing to other members what was done to me!

    I arrived here as an Audi noob,having driven Cosworths for some years,and many here and on VAGOC who are now good friends persuaded and led me from the path of non-modification....

    I think the difference between tuners like AMD and other good companies,is that they spend time checking the car over before doing anything to it,and then load the software or do the work,and then check it again before handing it back to the customer.
    Many simply load a generic file and off you go.

    After it's engine build,for instance,Shaun drove my car for a few days on his daily commute to ensure there were no leaks or other issues before it was handed back to me.
    That's the sort of attention to detail that I like,and it's what keeps me going back to them.

    This thread has sort of become the car's blog,but it also helps me pass back info which might be useful to anyone else thinking of this sort of thing,and hopefully saving some money or some left turns into the bargain.
    Audi S3 freak likes this.
  27. Granta
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    Granta Member

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    [Feb 26, 2014]
    Ha ha you saying it wasn't going to be modded! I was reading through Andy and the black stealth s3 build thread and one of your posts was on there Alex and it said something like stage 1 and I'm more than happy with that! Fast forward 4 years and look where you are!! Good on you mate
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  28. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Feb 26, 2014]
    We all get led astray....

    Frankly,once I'd decided to keep the car for more than a year or so,it really wasn't fast enough.

    Now,it's got a decent bit of power,and it drives better than ever,even if the ride is a bit hard,but I'm OK with that,so it's become another hobby.
  29. stetheo
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    stetheo Active Member

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    [Feb 26, 2014]
    Yeah it looks, well a little bit better I guess...

    Yeah the OEM manifold has coped to this point but definitely won't have the best flow. Going to be very interesting to see this all fall into place!

    I was planning on being sensible, staying stock for as long as possible (which lasted a week!) and not going past Stage 1. Yeah not going to happen...
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  30. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Mar 2, 2014]
    Due on Friday......can't wait.

    Then need a time to get the car back in for a holiday,and get this fitted.
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  31. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Mar 4, 2014]
    Getting closer.


    It's been through Athens,left it's home,been to Bologna,and seen Milan.

    Coming soon to a post box nearby.


    [​IMG]
  32. wuta3
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    wuta3 Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 4, 2014]
    u r bonkers alex
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  33. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Mar 4, 2014]
    Nicest thing anyone has said to me all day......

    Thank you!

    More bonkersness to come I can assure you.
  34. wuta3
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    wuta3 Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 4, 2014]
    lol it was a compliment. Just don't ever pull up beside me at the lights.
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  35. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Mar 4, 2014]
    Honestly,I took it as such,and appreciate it very much!....it's good to be bonkers for the right reasons at my age.

    Wait until the manifold,wastegate,and fuelling are sorted before anything else......!
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  36. Audi S3 freak
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    Audi S3 freak Member

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    [Mar 6, 2014]

    your very welcome Alex! planning on hitting a fair few shows this year so fingers crossed I stumble across your car! I too am a noob as I spent years modding gsxrs and supermotos. the audi was kept pretty standard for years until I decided it was just too slow. mines a 8l facelift so after the basic stage 2 I went hybrid turbo and ran far too much boost despite my brother telling me not to drive it until I got rods.....the car was too fun to leave sat there at his garage so after 3 months of beating her senseless she went bang! now the dead 1.8t is out and a 2l s3 tfsi is currently awaiting for me to fit her! its stage 2+ revo currently so will do for a year or so until I have the funds for a big turbo and internals which will be when I pester you for advice on bits ;)
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  37. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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  38. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 6, 2014]
    Watching this with interest; hope it all goes well Alex. Love to see this car in the flesh one day, do you ever go to any of the shows?
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  39. S3Alex
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    S3Alex Rarely neutral

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    [Mar 6, 2014]
    Thanks Warren.

    So do I!
    I've been assured not only by the manufacturer but also another mate with a Golf R that it fits and works so we will see soon.

    Last time I went to one of the shows was the VW Inters a couple if yrs back but it would be fun to go again.
  40. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 6, 2014]
    Last did inters in '08. Used to be a regular (from '96) but after it moved from Crowthorne I didn't enjoy it as much.

    I try and do ADI in October at Combe but that's about it now.

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