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So if David knows his way around ( I have watched Superbikes and BTTC there), its back to the driver topic again surely although I accept your comments on confidence and familiarity with a particular car.
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Fair point...but making rash statememts based upon 'taking on' an S3 at Knockhill should have perhaps been made with some insight into the driver and his ability!
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As for humble pie, Davids comments about objective comparison ring true for me... At the end of the day I do believe that the S3 will be a quicker car.
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A slightly different view than your comments of the last few days suggested...however...
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The thing I am curious about is the difference betwen the two, hence following this thread.
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But as I said...Knockhill is the worst case possible for a TDI driver to use to gauge the performance vs a petrol car of a similar type.
It's not as easy to drive on the throttle with a diesel - at least I don't find it so - and a track is an environment where a road car that revs will come into it's own.
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We can't check this out on the road, speed comparison there is not on. Who knows what the other driver is doing as we exit a roundabout etc etc. Dyno's charts show a cars potential but can that be exploited in more than a straight line as discussed.
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Surely the driver that goes well, drives to the virtues of his car...so holding the revs high on a car that revs, or short shifting on a diesel...in this case the driving style at roundabouts etc is dictated by the need to get the engine into the meaty part of the power delivery (versus grip!) at the earliest opportunity...so I could reasonably predict which way a driver is going to take a roundabout based upon his car.
As for dyno charts...the area under the graph is king. The more the area, the faster tha car. That's just the way it is.
Now, gearing, grip and weight come into play...but basically if you have a big area under the curve, you will have a quick car on the road.
In this instance, an S3 has 2000RPM more to play with compared to a TDI...hence the total area should be more - as long as the S3 is running well - as the diesels power and torque tail off quickly...especially true of chipped S3s
So, if you hold onto all available revs, an S3 will be faster on a flat out drive - as driven on a track...hence my comments about picking your battles!
On the road, this is not always the case as an S3 can be caught off boost (on a track it is unlikely to be caught like that) whereas a diesel will pull hard from just off idle.
I know my father's Golf GTTDI will mug my Golf on a roundabout if we are both in 3rd gear....he'll just pull away. Same for 3rd, 4th or 5th gear roll-on's...he'll just go.
But allow me to drop gears and wind the 16v above 4000RPM, and I'll pull him in.
With him driving in a typical diesel way, and me keeping the 16v above 4000RPM I can pull away anywhere I want....it's all proportional to the revs I use.
His car has 130BHP / 220lb-ft...mine 150BHP / 135 lb-ft..according to common diesel missconception his should be faster for everyday driving - and it is. Lazy, short shifting, town driving when you aren't ragging the life out of the car...it's faster. Period.
But, drive the Golf like a GTI and use the 7000+ revs...and the TDI can't stick with it...that's the area under the graph again.
Lazy everyday driving, the diesel is faster...true.
Driving to the strengths of each car...the pertol is still faster.
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As interesting would be if the two pilots swapped cars on the track, on the day......The fixed reference point to measure against would then be the driver themselves.
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Indeed...I suggest the S3 would be substantially faster in both sets of hands. Lot's so..
