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supagard

Discussion in 'Detailing' started by stressfrees3, Aug 21, 2007.

  1. stressfrees3
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    stressfrees3 Member

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    [Aug 21, 2007]
    Hi All,

    Waiting for my A3 sportback in phantom black build week 39...too far away.However, the dealer was offering supagard for £399.
    Q1. has anyone supagard their car and has it made a diiference
    Q2. is it worth it

    Any opinions much appreciated.
    #1
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  3. Clark@Polishedbliss
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    Clark@Polishedbliss Professional Detailer

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    [Aug 21, 2007]
    #2
  4. sean1098
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    sean1098 New Member

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    [Aug 27, 2007]
    wish i saw this earlier,just payed £295 to get mine done.:keule:
    #3
  5. WX51TXR
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    WX51TXR Polished Bliss

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    [Aug 27, 2007]
    For the benefit of those not wishing to click through, here is the text I posted in response to this question on the other forum...

    ---

    Supaguard and all other dealer applied 'long-life' treatments are simply average quality sealant systems... which should cost around the £20-£30 mark. Essentially, such systems are simply mechanisms for dealerships to make much more profit from every sale, so are best avoided at all costs. A much better option is to buy a decent set of products tailored towards your needs (durability, working by hand/machine, etc) and your car's colour (you can make the paint look quite different depending on what you use) and do the work yourself. A further option is to have the car professionally detailed from the outset, as new cars rarely come from the factory defect free. When we prepare new cars for customers we don't focus on the lifespan of the resulting finish (most finishes rarely last more than 6-9 months anyway, no matter how good the products), instead we focus on making sure the paint is defect free and has the best possible shine; hence why we now work with some rather expensive and amazing waxes! Whatever you do, don't go for the Supaguard; big waste of £300 in my opinion (and yes, I was sucked in 5 years ago when I bought the Leon, so I have experience of these products, and still rue that decision, hence one of the reasons why Polished Bliss was born!).
    #4
  6. sean1098
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    sean1098 New Member

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    [Aug 27, 2007]
    thanks for the info mate.
    #5
  7. Drmatrix
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    Drmatrix Vorsprung Durch Technik

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    [Sep 16, 2007]
    good infomation thanks
    #6
  8. big.buoy
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    big.buoy New Member

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    [Sep 18, 2007]
    I was reading this with some interest, I have bought through eBay a sachet each of stages 1 & 2 of Jewelultra's Diamondbrite.

    Having just bought my A4 Cabriolet I was a little disappointed with the feel of the paintwork a little rough.

    I have used a detailing block before and the finish is lovely, so too is Autoglym's Paint Renovator.

    So I intend to give the paintwork a "good seeing to" (pardon the expression) Autoglym's Paint Renovator followed by the Diamondbrite.

    Polishes concern me in that too many applications can ultimately dull the paintwork. Waxes require lots of regular applications which are time consuming hrmph!

    I guess that if the Diamondbrite doesn't last the course then I can always look to other ways, but I do like the idea of a piant sealant. Also I have some Conserver for the monthly maintenance which will help the Sealant last longer.

    What opinions do others have?? I would be keen to hear them.

    Regards

    Jason
    #7
  9. clcollins
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    clcollins Member

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    [Sep 18, 2007]
    I had Jewelultra's Diamondbrite applied at the dealers, sorry stealers, before I picked up my first A3, it really wasn't worth it, didn't provide protection or benifit above what I would expect from an off the shelf bottle of sealant / polish. Plus as stated above re supaguard, the cost of the materials is very cheap (you can find it easily on ebay) and what the dealer charges is unjustifiable.
    #8
  10. big.buoy
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    big.buoy New Member

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    [Sep 18, 2007]
    I agree, to pay the £££'s of pounds for the Main Stealer to put it on is really completely unjustifiable, but when you pay less then 10 Squid on eBay for the bonefide stuff it isn't such a bad deal and like all paint treatments, you need to maintain it which is why you apply conserver to the last wash.

    But it is convenient since you apply a small amount to the penultimate rinse and leather the car once rinsed.

    My Wife's Touran always looks really shiney after every wash, I think that as long as you follow the instructions then it should last a long time and it is very easy to apply...for those who are rather time limited!

    I believe Diamondbrite was the original paint sealant and is the only 2 stage system. My wife's car felt silky smooth with a slightly plastic feel to it and the water ran off it without even beading which I have never seen after applying it and it still does 6 months on.

    I have read that Waxes especially during the summer soften and absorb road dust which then acts as an inhouse etching compund and they evaporate off the bodywork when warm so there is a more labour intensive issue with waxes, but they do give an absolutely amazing initial finish especially the wet look ones.

    As with everything there are pluses and minuses and everyone has different experiences using these products.

    Is there such a thing as the perfect finishing product???:think:
    #9
  11. WX51TXR
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    WX51TXR Polished Bliss

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    [Sep 20, 2007]
    Diamondbrite is along the same lines as Supaguard, a waste of money really....


    And polishes shouldnt dull your paint mate, if they are then you're obviously using the wrong technique to apply it or using one thats too abrasive. You shouldnt polish your car too much anyways as you are removing paint each time ;)
    #10
  12. WX51TXR
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    WX51TXR Polished Bliss

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    [Sep 20, 2007]

    I would get yourself over to www.detailingworld.co.uk as this will open up your eyes to a whole new world in car care, then it'll probably make you realise that there are FAR better products that DB etc :)
    #11
  13. big.buoy
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    big.buoy New Member

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    [Sep 20, 2007]
    Thanks for your views, I did visit detailing world and I found this link

    http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=18025&highlight=diamondbrite

    It was good to read that there are quite a number out there who are prepared to be a bit more open minded about how they feel about DB.

    I really don't want to upset or cause umbrance to professional detailers so please forgive me.

    As I mentioned, my wife's Touran was DB'd but fist of all it was clay'd using Meguiar's Quick Clay, this gave the paint a nice silky feel to it. Once the two stages were applied, I left them for some time to react then buffed off using a microfibre cloth.

    The finish was really lovely and the feel of the car was like "plastic coated". After 6 months from application, water still runs off in sheets leaving the paintwork dry and bird poo, insects etc wash off really easily.

    I use conserver once a month and leather the car dry. All in all it cost me £7 on eBay for the 2 sealed sachets and pence for the maintenance. Best of all I actually get lots of people admiring the finish and although not as good as a wax the maintenance is much less so I get to drive my car more!

    I struggle with having enough time to spend polishing, waxing etc, which can take several hours, so for the above it is worth it.

    I know I may seem like a Phillistine to the hardened professional detailers, but when you work as a professional using waxes, of course your going to knock the unconventional stuff. DB is good if it is applied in the correct manner, sadly it isn't always, it is also made out to seem like an indestructible permanent coating by the dealers who should know better. If it isn't applied in the right manner it won't last and it will show up the imperfections. This is why it gets bad press. Also, the wax manufacturers prey on peoples gullibility and deliberately slag off DB...because they know it actually works.

    Detailing is very obsessive and never ending, leaving you like slaves at the weekend. Waxes are basically esters of long chain alcohols, they are organic rather than mineral, they evaporate off paintwork and worryingly when warm they absorb traffic dust which can etch paintwork.

    So think about this...if you spend say £200 - £400 having your car detailed then where is the ultimate value of this when the waxes need re-application, the car will look really good initially then 4 - 6 months down the line you need to re-apply the wax. The finish will only be as good as the owner is at maintaining it.

    This is a very passionate part of car care and every one has their favourite compunds, I'm inspired by Clark's detailing on the RS4 Avant, :icon_thumright: I'd love my car to look like that and dealers PDF never reaches that level purely on the time it takes to complete a job like that although that Audi dealer should have taken much more care.

    I used to be a real wax fan and swore by Mother's Carnauba Waxes which although not expensive were still good concentraton of Carnauba. But I found that the beading used to diminish really quickly.

    This hasn't been the case for DB, and yes I know how to apply waxes etc but their longevity isn't impressive for the costs involved.

    There was another post on the above forum, check this out:

    http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=163885&postcount=10

    He makes loads of sense and explains the reason why people "discriminate DB out of ignorance" as he bluntly puts it.

    I've used DB on My wife's car and I'll be applying to my brand new A4 Cab and I'll upload the photographs for all to see.

    Rather than slag it off, read the links and make your mind up objectively.

    It's mostly common sense.

    I really hope no offence is taken btw!:meeting:
    #12
  14. WX51TXR
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    WX51TXR Polished Bliss

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    [Sep 21, 2007]
    No offence taken, healthy debate is always a good thing! A couple of things to point out...

    1. I have personally experienced Supaguard's system, which is very closely related to DimaondBrite and Lifeshine and all other long-life sealants. It was good for 6 months... like most other decent quality sealant systems. Then I had to top it up... and six months later the same thing happened... the level of protection disappeared. So, whilst I don't doubt that these products are decent quality sealants, they are in my opinion no better than other sealants out there that do not purport to such durability claims. I have also found that many other sealants give a much nicer finish, in some cases very close to a wax finish.

    2. It would be a fallacy to think all we and many other professional detailers do is use waxes. I would say we finish at least 25% of the cars going out of our studio with synthetic sealants (usually either by Blackfire or Jeffs). We like sealants a lot, and they have their place in our line up.

    3. In my opinion, it is a complete myth that waxes (once cured) soften to the point that they can absorb contaminants. I have never seen this, and don't expect to. You mention the dirty tricks the wax manufacturers have used to smear sealant products; in this case, the idea of waxes behaving as mentioned is likley a counter smear issued by the sealant manufacturers. One the solvent carrier has fully evaporated, many wax coatings are as hard as nails, and not prone to softening unless heated to extremes.

    In summary, and going back to the original point of this thread, I believe that both waxes and sealants have their place in the modern car care world, and testify to this view in our guide to last step products on our site, see here...

    http://www.polishedbliss.co.uk/acatalog/guides_protect.html

    However, paying a dealership £300 of your hard earned for application of so called long life protection systems is in my opinion and experience a bad idea and a waste of money. Far better to do what you have done and source and apply the products yourself, or choose other products based more on issues like the look you want for the paint, etc, rather than durability alone. About time the dealership cash cow was retired methinks!
    #13
  15. big.buoy
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    big.buoy New Member

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    [Sep 24, 2007]
    Thanks for your reply about this and it was interesting to read. I really do agree with you that I would be gutted if I paid £££'s for the pleasure of a paint sealant especially Supaguard being applied thru' the dealer

    Compared to waxing, I prefer the idea of DB since it is a 2 stage process that produces a x-linked polymer shell. You can feel the plastic coating it produces, I believe that it can also help reduce the potential for small stone chips on the paint...due to the flexion of the polymer layer....although it's better not to drive so close to other cars at speed really!

    And the clincher for me is that I really struggle to find more than 3 hours to wash and then polish the car since I work away and I have to prioritise so many things...


    You can also build the layers of DB, I would recommend 2 or 3 applications. My wife's Touran (yawn) looked well good following 2 applications...which still took no more than 2 hours to complete.

    I think that as far as sealants go and I appreciate your comment about "me going down the way of buying the sachets and applying myself....", since at less that £10 (which is still a lot of money for what you get compared to say Autoglym etc....) they are still way way more cost effective than getting someone else to do the job for you and probably not as well either...dealers please take note!

    I am not so sure about waxes not evaporating though, since they are only long chain alcohols which mean that rather than being chemically bonded to themselves and the paint, they lie like spaghetti over each other and rely on their attractive forces to hold them together. When they warm up, these forces weaken due to their movement from their increased thermal state.

    Any wax by nature, will melt when heated and Carnauba isn't much different.

    What waxing does though is give a really deep finish and nothing can compare to this but they do require replenishment more frequently than sealants....as stated in your link above...which is fisrt class by the way.

    Whilst on this subject.............
    I would like to metaphorically kiss some arse :scared2: .... Your "How to..." advice threads are absolutely excellent and reading your detailing blogs (and I'll mention it again...) the RS4 Avant was inspiring!

    I have enjoyed this debate and guess that although we do have slightly differing opinions, I do concede that waxing gives a really amazing finish when done correctly, but disagree that DB isn't any good....It's the way it is sold! Perhaps Jewelultra should think about bottling them and selling it in Halfords for £10 a pop.....they'd probably sell millions! After all Mr. Motorist is very fickle about car care!...crafty marketing is what seems to sell especially new and improved ones that aren't really new and improved....except perhaps the design on the bottle!

    I look forward to reading further threads.....and this site is all-round excellent!

    Regards

    Jason

    :friends:
    #14
  16. kev_a3
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    kev_a3 New Member

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    [Nov 23, 2007]
    well im sitting in the supaguard is sh#t camp and its a bit crowded:friends:
    #15
  17. mwarrey
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    mwarrey Member

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    [Nov 23, 2007]
    I don't think anyone is saying that supaguard or diamondbrite are bad products, its just that they are unlikey to last more than 6 months and are certainly not worth £300 for a single application.
    #16
  18. jasonS3
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    jasonS3 New Member

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    [Dec 23, 2007]
    thanks
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  19. TDI-line
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    TDI-line Uber Post Whore

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    [Dec 30, 2007]
    After just buying my 18 month old silver sportback which i just paid a few hundred sheets of money getting her Supaguarded, does anyone have any suggestions on what i could or should do with future protection.

    I mainly use Meg's products, but are open to any suggestions?
    #18
  20. RGBArgee
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    RGBArgee Guest

    [Dec 30, 2007]
    Never bothered with Superguard or Diamond stuff, generaly reckon just clean well, rinse and use decent polish, Mer, AutoGlym etc.. no doubt the pros with have other thoughts but seems to work well for us on our Met Black motors.

    Cheers

    R:detective2:
    #19
  21. mwarrey
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    mwarrey Member

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    [Dec 30, 2007]
    I have just started using Jeff's Werkstatt Acrylic (from Polished bliss). I am very impressed with it. I have used lots of different polishes over the years, the last being Swissol and I have to say that Jeff's is the best one I've used.
    #20
  22. White220
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    White220 White 220

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    [Jan 16, 2008]
    My car was "Lifeshined" for free when I got it and it was superslick to touch for the first 5 washes then i started to notice it wasn't so slick.
    I was given a nice wee bag of Autoglym goodies with the car too and am still unsure if I should dispose of them before I have finished using them in order to justify buying some Jeffs Werkstatt Acrylic. i also noticed at its most recent wash there is tar on most of the panels below the trim and alot more on the near side.

    The Lifeshine "Certificate" seems to read like the guarantee for the scotchguard on our couch, and suggests that if there i am not so satisfied with the shine anymore it will be re-applied. Has anyone done this and do you recommend it?

    I Love washing my car I would have to seeing it's white. So don't think I would feel easy about sending it back, but a free polish might be a free polish????

    Wheely-bin the Autoglym or hold them to the Guarantee??
    #21
  23. WX51TXR
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    WX51TXR Polished Bliss

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    [Jan 17, 2008]
    As I mentioned above, the same thing happened to me with Supaguard; good for a while, then it wore off, well before the manufacturer said it would. No doubt if you kicked up a fuss they would reapply it for you... however, my view is the less time a car spends in the hands of the dealership the better, so my advice would be to consider a decent set of aftermarket products that are going to make your car look significantly better for 3-4 months at a time. :yes:
    #22
  24. White220
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    White220 White 220

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    [Feb 18, 2008]
    Rich, I'm sure it was similar with you, but the weather here in Oldmeldrum was Brilliant on Sunday, so both cars got a well deserved wash (we live in one of the new building sites, sure you're familiar!).

    I decided to concentrate on my Golf (mkV Reflex Silver) so I polished and then sealed it. Most of the paintwork looks fantastic now.

    However overall, a couple of things are letting it down at the moment;

    The headlight lenses, are cloudy when dry can you suggest something to rectify this, and possibly something to stop the Audi going the same way.

    All of the glass is showing its age when it's raining, I have used Autoglym Fast Glass and the glass polish up until now, and am really anal about not washing any glass with the bodywork shampoo. Can you suggest something to restore this?
    (I have some rainex here but I think the glass is in need of some "correction" first).

    It looks like my efforts have used up a fair amount of my AutoGlym goodies, so when I detail the Audi on a similar day I may just have to come visit for some better products.
    #23

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