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spluttering and dieing on cold start (new twist)

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by voorhees, Jan 4, 2008.

  1. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 4, 2008]
    The stealers have had mine (a week) and have changed the coolant temp. sensor after nothing come up on the VAG-COM,they did compression test,fuel pressure in the day and first thing in the morning,all the readouts are correct as are from the throttle body.Also the turbo kicks in when the misfire starts!? Anyone had this?
    They are saying a new ECU but I thought I'd ask the question here with my fellow owners.
    #1
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  3. Clach
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    Clach A3 - 1.8Ts

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    [Jan 4, 2008]
    Sorry to hear of your troubles...

    I had a pug that done the exact same thing...it turned our to be a faulty fuel pump despite similar tests, four weeks at the stealers, and threats of changing the ECU. :notme:

    I doubt it is the same problem, but just thought i would say Good luck as I know it can be a pain...

    Clach
    #2
  4. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 4, 2008]
    It almost definately won't be the ECU, that's just a cop out as they haven't a clue how to fault find if their precious VAGCOM can't do it for them.
    Take it to a specialist with more experience on older Audi's.
    #3
  5. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    I would do that Andy but my motor is only 6 years old :eyebrows:
    #4
  6. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    That's old to most Audi dealerships. Remember these guys are only interested in warranty work, 3 years max. 6 years to most dealers is prehistoric.
    #5
  7. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    Year and miles ??

    Sounds like it could be something ignition or valve related. Plug gaps all correct, if one is too big or too tight, it may run rough til there is some heat in there? DO you also have stock plugs in there? I run far cooler plugs than stock and get about 4 secs roughness when started on a very very cold wet day.
    Also, undo your coilpack wiring plugs and spary a little contact cleaner in there, then when dry, a LITTLE WD40. My mk4 developed a nasty rough runnign after balttign along the autobahn in Germany for 2 hours at 100+ in horrid rain! ! ! ! Just got some damp i the coilpack plug, stopped at the services, boutgh some spray and it was back to full power!
    Also, could be a clogged or sticky injector I suppose, would be worth maybe having them ultrasonically cleaned, costs £50 and you tend to see better fuel consumption when refitted.
    Would also be worth some basic fuel filter and pump checks. HAve you run out or very low on fuel, or had to fill up from some hick town filling station recently! ! !?
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  8. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    Sounds like it could be a didgy plug or plugs. What are the years and mileage?

    Althouh if they did a proper compression test they would have had them all out, it would not surprise me if they never checked them!
    Do you have stock heat range plugs, some coooler plugsdont like cold starts/

    Have you run out or low on fuel or had to fill up at a hick town petrol station recently, (eg anywhere in East Anglia!!) lol!
    #7
  9. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    2002-69k
    It only hesitates for five seconds at the most
    Coilpack issues throw up fault codes but I will try that,plugs are still the originals I believe so I'll change them first,N75 might be another avenue.
    Haven't run out of fuel and the only stuff I put in it is v-power (and this is how it repays me!)
    I'll video it tomorrow
    #8
  10. dan_a3
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    dan_a3 Member

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    Can you just describe whats actually happening to me?
    #9
  11. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    on a overnight startup the car struggles and has started to rev to compensate I think the AudiTech mistook the sound of the induction kit for turbo!?
    #10
  12. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    Cgange the plugs, just straight NGK platinums, BPR6Q's I think. Iridium thin elctrodes can promote pinking. Dont be tempted to go for the cooler "7" rated plugs, these will promote the misfire potentialy more.

    IS yours the VVC motors, eg BAM ?
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  13. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    BTW, you say induction kit.......? What kit? Do you have an aftermarket DV, (forge or bailey pistom valve?)
    #12
  14. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    BAM and induction kit is a prototype ITG one but they supply one for LCR so I think thats not the problem Simch but also I am open for any suggestions but tis a bit strange...Aky has the same probs and I have spoke to him
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  15. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    When my water pump was on the way out it used to display these symptoms, the thing was so seized when we changed it that you couldn't even turn it by hand. It was causing such a load on the engine that it would stall everytime when cold (and sometimes when hot). A long shot though.
    #14
  16. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 5, 2008]
    Stock Dv still fitted? If not, fit one!! I had massive of trouble with my bailey valve in temperature extremes !!

    Start with new and properly gapped plugs, 0.8mm IIRC.
    #15
  17. Aky
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    Aky Aky

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    [Jan 6, 2008]
    As Voorhees correctly says I have the same problem & spoke to him yesterday about it. I've had the car on VagCom and it throws no fault codes up so I don't think its a coilpack issue. I've changed my Temp sensor, its had new cambelt and water pump, new MAF and spark plugs. I'm tempted to change the N75 and N249 valves next to see whether this has an impact. Does anyone know whether these could be the issue?
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  18. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 6, 2008]
    do you guys everhave to top your oil up? If so, how often and how much does it use?

    Just wondering if a little piston ring blow by is oiling your plugs a litle when cold, but it all stops when warmedd up (expanded!).)
    #17
  19. Aky
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    Aky Aky

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    [Jan 6, 2008]
    I have to fill the oil. Normally a couple of glugs out of the bottle. Prob be about 100ml maybe a little more every 1000 miles.
    #18
  20. simch
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    simch Active Member

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    hmm, not massive ammount but more than I need to add!

    I wonder if there could be some wear on the rings or valve stems that could be causing some oil seeping into the combustion chambers and founling the plugs slightly on start up. (A small turbo seal leak maybe also......?)

    Maybe leave the car overnight, then next morning, disconnect all the coil pack plugs, turn it over for about 10 secs obviously without firing, then remove the plugs and have a look at them......?
    You guys losing any coolant at all?
    #19
  21. jesters3
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    jesters3 Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    Sounds similar to mine issue. Recently had new cambelt and water pump, new MAF and spark plugs. Had a remap done as well but I don't think that was the issue as it only started last week after I left it in the garage for a couple of days. Have scanned for fault codes thinking it was the coilpacks misfiring but nothing has come up apart from 17705 - Boost leak - Check DV/N249. As a result I have checked all hoses, checked DV and N249 for leaks and nothing.

    I cleaned the TB thinking that may help, but nothing. Next on the list is to change the DV (got a spare one in the shed) and rescan, failing that temp sender then N249.

    Coolant is all good; though every morning I see a little pool (tastes leke water though) on the inside of the bumper from the lower left - could this be a radiator leak?
    #20
  22. h100vw
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    h100vw Member

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    That code needn't just be the DV or N249. The ECU throws those explanations as it has to assume that all the boost hoses are done up. The only things it has control over that could be broken, as far as it is concerned, is the DV and N249. By all means check them out further but don't be surprised if they both prove serviceable.

    I had the same code on a Leon Cupra and it was a slack boost pipe that was only leaking when the motor was cold. Once warmed up, it just wouldn't do it.

    Gavin
    #21
  23. Aky
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    Aky Aky

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    My old man has listened to my motor and he seems to think its the auto choke not working properley i.e. not kicking in quick enough/ Maybe its just the cold weather (minus figures) than you need to give it a little gas for 15 seconds until everything is combusting properly.
    #22
  24. h100vw
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    h100vw Member

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    No carbs these days tell him... :think:
    #23
  25. Aky
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    Aky Aky

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    Whats that got to do with Auto Choke?
    #24
  26. fingermouse
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    fingermouse thats me

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    well injection work slightly different to carbs but I know what your dad means.

    I believe injector fireing time are altered for cold starts .....


    I maybe also wrong
    #25
  27. fingermouse
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    fingermouse thats me

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    on another note when mine does this its only when its been parked outside at work in the v cold and im scraping the windows.

    its never done it out of the garage.............
    #26
  28. jesters3
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    jesters3 Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    Ta, thats why i cleaned the TB as well as the RossWiki mentioned it. I'll still change the DV but will check the boost hoses again. I changed the upper ones to Samco ones and have them well 'clipped on' so don't think it will be them. Is there any easy way to check the lowers or is it a bumper off job again?
    #27
  29. ChriS3
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    ChriS3 hud at ye bam

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    [Jan 7, 2008]
    I have a similar issue to this on my old S3. Happened just as I sold it so I'm helping the guy sort it. There were no fault codes showing up and about 10-15 secs of revs seemed to sort it.

    I got a code a few days after it first happened - 17535 - Fuel Trim; Bank 1 (Mult): System too Rich, and 17536 - Fuel Trim; Bank 1 (Mult): System too Lean. A few days later I checked again and got 17608 - Boost Pressure Control Valve (N249): Mechanical Malfunction. I've ordered a new N249 to see if it fixes things and keeps the engine light off. Might not be the same issue, but judging by the way the car was generally feeling before that I'm beginning to think the N249 can do a few funny thing to the car when its on its way out, before it shows any codes in VAGCOM.
    #28
  30. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 8, 2008]
    I was going to check the n75 for loosened connections on that and all the forge hoses I had recently fitted but am unsure now.
    Stealers told me my car was covered under warranty for the work they carried out even though they never fixed it? It was 730 quid FFS (at least **** Turpin had the decency to wear a mask when he robbed you)
    #29
  31. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jan 12, 2008]
    went to Stealth yesterday and had my coilpacks changed but alas this morning its still the same!
    Vince found two fault codes-16486-MAF-intermittent,-17695-Boost Pressure Control Valve (N249)-intermittent
    he has cleared them and is going to look next friday in the meantime I'll clean the MAF and might put the original induction back on,the stealers told me they took the MAF out so that might be the reason it showing but the N249 looks firked
    #30

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