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Speaker Mods

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by jdp1962, Jun 1, 2003.

  1. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 1, 2003]
    My A4 is a 99.5 saloon (sedan) with manual windows in the back. The stereo is the standard Concert system with six speakers. I don't like the location of the rear speakers in the parcel shelf, and am thinking of fitting new ones. What I had in mind was to mount new mid-range drivers in the lower part of the rear door panel, and small tweeters higher up. Has anyone tried this, and if so, how feasible is it? What size speakers will fit into the door panel? Can they be wired into the existing rear speaker loom, whilst retaining the shelf speakers, or would I have to disconnect the shelf speakers altogether & divert the cabling to the new ones?



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  3. excursion
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    excursion Member

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    [Jun 1, 2003]
    Hello there /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I'm not sure about the rear doors, that would involve a fair bit of custom work.

    I would advise you to disconnect the standard rear speakers when you fit aftermarket ones. If you don't there will be around double the loading on the rear channel (about 8 ohms). This will make the amp run very hot inside the headunit.

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
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  4. tobybutler
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    tobybutler New Member

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    [Jun 2, 2003]
    Sounds like alot of messing to me. I fiddled with various speakers in my old 95 A4 1.6SE and ended up sticking with the stock speakers as they sounded best!. The speakers in the rear shelf are made by Nokia i believe! and in my opinion don't sound too bad. I would look to upgrade whats in the rear shelf as the boot acts as a huge speaker box and resonates niceley. The rear doors however are not very big and i think you would be dissapointed with the sound that you get having butchered the doors. There are lots of places (even Halfords) that you can get Alpine, Sony etc replacement speakers that will sound alot better.
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  5. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 3, 2003]
    I would agree with A418TQS - don't bother putting them in the doors, they will sound pants in there. The best place is where they are in the shelf because of the volume of the boot area - just uprate them. You can get a standard size upgrade speaker with adaptors to fit them into the factory holes in the shelf. See Car Audio Direct....
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  6. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 3, 2003]
    That looks like a good solution. Thanks a bunch
    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

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  7. tobybutler
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    tobybutler New Member

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    [Jun 4, 2003]
    Speedy, just looking at your details. Where did you get your car chipped, did it make a massive difference ? - How much?

    Sorry to digress!

    Toby /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
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  8. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 4, 2003]
    I wanted to get AmD to do it but couldn't afford £550 + VAT, so when I found Upsolute at £305 inc VAT I tried them. I am very pleased with the result. The difference is AmD will tune your car on the rolling road, Upsolute just upgrade the ECU (chip) with no workshop-based tuning. Performance and torque increase is very noticeable. I also changed the diverter valve to an AmD Viper... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
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  9. RichA3Turbo
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    RichA3Turbo ...Watching you! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 4, 2003]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Speedy said:
    I wanted to get AmD to do it but couldn't afford £550 + VAT, so when I found Upsolute at £305 inc VAT I tried them. I am very pleased with the result. The difference is AmD will tune your car on the rolling road, Upsolute just upgrade the ECU (chip) with no workshop-based tuning. Performance and torque increase is very noticeable. I also changed the diverter valve to an AmD Viper... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Can you post a pic of the AmD viper valve? Is it exclusive to them?

    Cheers

    Rich

    (ps - where in oxford do you live speedy?)
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  10. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 4, 2003]
    I don't have a pic of the DV, but I think it's made by Turbo Dynamics and dual branded with AmD - apparentley they (AmD) had some reliability issues with the Forge ones they used to use and now prefer the Viper...

    I live in Bicester - I just say Oxford cos not everyone has heard of Bicester (unless they have been to Bicester Village of course).. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
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  11. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 4, 2003]
    Sorry, they said problems with Hyperboost not Forge /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
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  12. tobybutler
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    tobybutler New Member

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    Diverter Valve? - is this otherwise known as a dump valve?

    Does it make that blowing off noise when you back off the Gas, and is it needed with the chip upgrade?

    Cheers,
    Toby
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  13. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    Similar but not the same. As far as I understand it (which is not very far!! - someone correct me if I'm wrong) a diverter valve diverts air back to the airbox, where a dump valve dumps it to the atmosphere (which is why you get the noise). But I am fairly sure a dump valve is not recommended on the 1.8T as it can cause all sorts of engine running issues. The standard diverter valve in the A4 uses a diaphram (which can leak) where the Hyperboost/Viper/Forge ones are piston. Upgrading the DV is supposed to make thing smoother when chipping, but is not essential. I can't say what difference my DV made because I had the chip and the DV done on the same day... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
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  14. RichA3Turbo
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    RichA3Turbo ...Watching you! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Speedy said:
    Similar but not the same. As far as I understand it (which is not very far!! - someone correct me if I'm wrong) a diverter valve diverts air back to the airbox, where a dump valve dumps it to the atmosphere (which is why you get the noise). But I am fairly sure a dump valve is not recommended on the 1.8T as it can cause all sorts of engine running issues. The standard diverter valve in the A4 uses a diaphram (which can leak) where the Hyperboost/Viper/Forge ones are piston. Upgrading the DV is supposed to make thing smoother when chipping, but is not essential. I can't say what difference my DV made because I had the chip and the DV done on the same day... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Spot on /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
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  15. tobybutler
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    tobybutler New Member

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    Nice. Cheers for that. May need a new clutch before that. Just gave it a load of welly from standstill with foot right off the clutch and it slipped like a Bi**h! Its only done 30k and not been driven particularly hard. Reminds me of Audi Girl's Signature!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif
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  16. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    The "slipping" isn't something to do with the Quattro system instead of the clutch is it? Reason I say this is that mine kind of slips but it doesn't feel like the clutch somehow, I assumed it was maximising traction somehow. Only happens when I boot it from standstill sometimes. Could be wrong though... Anyone know if the clutch on a Quattro is reasonable or stupid money? My girlfriends Peugeot just cost £315 + VAT fitted..
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  17. tobybutler
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    tobybutler New Member

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    Felt more like slippage. Normally pulling right or left out of a junction is ace as it doesn't wheelspin just masses of grip. I haven't really served it up though really hard. Any nutters out there who regularly put these things sideways or can shed more light on Quattro systems?

    Luvverly,
    Toby
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  18. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    Excuse me, guys, but remember me? I've just logged on hoping to find some feedback about my speakers, and I seem to have been hijacked by your new thread. Not wishing to be rude, but you're a little bit off topic, wouldn't you say?
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  19. Simon
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    Simon Member

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    [Jun 5, 2003]
    you will find a big differnce in sound if you upgrade your fronts, if you want to leave the rear speakers in just fade them down a bit.

    in my 96 A4 I have focal utopia in the front and nothing in the rear at all - although most of the time I do have a sub in the boot.

    The replacement DV is usually more responsive than the OEM valve and can be fitted with a stronger spring when running higher boost in chipped engines, they are serviceable and generaly last longer than the originals.

    because Audi use the MAF to meter all air if you use a vent to atmospshere dump-valve it can lead the ECU into running to lean/rich which will ultimatly affect performance.

    Simon
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  20. Drystone
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    Drystone Member

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    [Jun 6, 2003]
    [ QUOTE ]
    jdp1962 said:
    Excuse me, guys, but remember me? I've just logged on hoping to find some feedback about my speakers, and I seem to have been hijacked by your new thread. Not wishing to be rude, but you're a little bit off topic, wouldn't you say?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Jeff,

    Chill out. Post hijacking happens now and again, you still got some good responses. Just shows how keen people on this forum are to post and interact. It would be a **** forum if it the opposite were true.

    Christian

    PS Welcome to the forum, good to have you onboard.
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  21. Speedy
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    Speedy Member

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    [Jun 6, 2003]
    Oops, got carried away! Sorry Jeff! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
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  22. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 11, 2003]
    Also bear in mind that some A4's have "active" rear speakers, i.e. they have their own amp fitted to the nearside speaker. I own a 1997 A4 2.8 Quattro, and upgraded the entire sound system. You cannot simply replace the original speakers in this car (Pioneer do a custom fit unit), as you need the amp. There is no power to the rear speakers just a line out. This is then amplified by the speakers amp. So if you retro fit new speakers you need to buy & fit an amp as well, you will then have to adapt the wiring. I would leave well alone, unless you are looking to replace the whole system. A better upgrade option is the front speakers, Pioneer do a custom fit set (mid/tweeter) which just slot in behind the front door panels. If you are looking for more bass, you really need to go for a sub woofer/power amp in the boot.
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  23. a4audilove
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    a4audilove New Member

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    [Jul 7, 2003]
    hello just wanted to let you know with some custom work it should work fine . if you leave you factory rears hooked up just make sure to wire them in a series circuit=(8 ohms)
    your factory deck will not get hot. your deck will only get hot if you wire your speaker in a parrallel circuit= ( 2ohms)
    bye the way i have a 98 audi a4 quattro and in the process
    of fiberglassing my rear door panels to fit 8inch subs hope this helps

    does your car have bose
    if so your front speakers run off the deck power but the rears have a small amp that you will need to use
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  24. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jul 8, 2003]
    Sub woofers in the doors? Love it.
    You know you've got a perfectly good boot for just that purpose? You'll never get chest rattling, nose tickling bass out of a door, whatever you do to it.
    Love to hear how you get on though.
    Also by wiring 2 speakers in series (8 ohms) you will be compromising the power output & thus the sound, as the amp is expecting to drive 4 ohms and will need to work harder to drive an 8ohm load, it's not a good idea for good sound.
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  25. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jul 8, 2003]
    Many thanks for all the contributions. I've listened to everyone's advice and, having thought long and hard, have decided to leave things as they are for thw time being. I'll re-visit the idea in the autumn, but have new tyres to buy just now. I generally only listen to the radio in the car, these days. I keep the serious musical stuff for thededicated music room at home.


    Thankls again everyone.


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  26. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jul 8, 2003]
    If you've got a good system in the car, it is the perfect music room. You can listen at any volume, without disturbing anyone, you can sing at the top of your voice, if that's you're bag, and generally the sound is better as it is confined to such a small space, so no acoustic problems as long as you have the power to overcome road/engine noise. If I want to really listen to music properly, my A4 is the place to do it. I hardly ever listen to music at home, too many distractions. But I guess it depends what you're into. If you've ever heard a great system in a car I'm sure you'd be converted. But you would have to spend at least a grand to get something decent, quality does not come cheap. There's always ebay!
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  27. nethawk
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    nethawk New Member

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    [Jul 10, 2003]
    Interesting posts on the topic so far. What I do have to agree is that the A4 makes one good listening room. Not ideal, due to the relatively small volume of space in the interior but well dampened and isolated from external noise.

    I've really spent some dough upgrading the sound system in the car though. I have a 97 1.8 model, and have changed out the standard 4" mid-drivers up front to 6.5" ones. This involved cutting off some of the door's ABS bracket hooks inside the doors to fit the speaker... Otherwise it will never fit anything larger than 4". Separate drivers for the tweeters higher up the door panel in the original housing, of course.

    The back shelf runs component speakers as well. 5.5" mids with 1" tweeters. The nice low-freq booms come from dual 10" units in a sealed box in the trunk. Given the volume of the boot, this gives some good, tight bass.

    There you have it. 10 speaker drivers in all, running off 4 amps and a digital crossover/21-band EQ/digital delay unit with a cassette head unit up front and a 10-disc changer in the back. All running on Sony-ES components.

    Not trying to brag, but just to show how you can really get a semi-audiophile system really going in your Audi. Dunno about you, but when it's on, I will try to take the scenic- cum-longer way home... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

    But I'll tell you, wiring the whole thing is a pain... Took 2 fulls days just to get the wires sorted out properly. But the results were well worth it.

    But the other posters are definitely on the money: Forget the rear doors, upgrade the fronts, use the back shelf for surround-space effects (on lower volumes) and for some good bass, use a box in your boot... Enjoy.
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  28. A4Steve
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    A4Steve Guest

    [Jul 27, 2003]
    Fit focal components (polyglass up) into front doors and you wont go wrong
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  29. forsythsteve
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    forsythsteve New Member

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    [Oct 10, 2003]
    can anyone confirm who maks the Audi Concert head unit? Is it Bose?
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  30. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 10, 2003]
    No. on pre 99/2000 models it is Blaupunkt, after that it is Matsushita aka Panasonic. They're both sh*t, although the Panasonic units are less sh*t than the Bluespot. Bose just do the speaker/amp/sub upgrades and a change is made via VAGCOM to the HU to drive the different setup with Bose installed. But you can't polish a turd!
    #29
  31. forsythsteve
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    forsythsteve New Member

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    [Oct 14, 2003]
    any recomendations on a good upgrad to the HU. Car is 1999 on an "s"
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