1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

So Manual isnt really manual on a DSG

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by imported_S_Line, Feb 2, 2006.

  1. imported_S_Line
    Online

    imported_S_Line Guest

    [Feb 2, 2006]
    After some extensive testing today i have found that the Manual Mode on the DSG isn't at all Manual.

    In Manual:

    It changes down gears when you put the throttle right to the floor

    It changes UP when it reaches the red line

    It changes down while slowing down.

    Mines a 05 - does this happen on the 06 models also ?
    #1
  2. Ads

    Ads

    [Sep 21, 2014]

  3. god_thats_quick
    Offline

    god_thats_quick Numptie of the highest order

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2004
    Messages:
    2,507
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    I think that happens on all of them, I new they changed up for safety (of the engine) - I'm kinda surprised about the kickdown though, but I guess that helps the idiots that pull out without enough space in the wrong gear.

    When you say it changes down on slowing what do you mean? changes before it hits idling speed or before higher up the rev range?

    edited to add... you've clearly been having a good laugh this afternoon playing with your car! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
    #2
  4. slimbloke
    Offline

    slimbloke Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    298
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    It changes down while slowing down.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Would you rather it stall? I find this a huge advantage, as it gives you a very smooth change down when coming to a stop in traffic for example.
    #3
  5. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    It's the same on the 06 models too. The only bit I don't like is the kickdown when you're in manual mode, but as kickdown is way down its not normally a problem.
    #4
  6. simonl
    Offline

    simonl Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2005
    Messages:
    268
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    Mine only seems to cut in when it otherwise would be a problem, like a stall, or a rev limit.
    I have to say, i've not experienced the kick down, not at all. I'll poke around on the GTI forum for some feedback!
    #5
  7. arthurfuxake
    Offline

    arthurfuxake Controversial & Contradictive

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    1,308
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    Here we go again, quick, someone call Bowfer /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cry.gif
    #6
  8. TDI-line
    Offline

    TDI-line Uber Post Whore

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2004
    Messages:
    9,055
    Likes Received:
    37
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    BOWFER!

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
    #7
  9. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    I agree with LeMan. Mine only kicks cuts in when would be a problem, either to stall or over rev.

    It can be very useful when in 'manual' (personally I prefer to call it tip-tronic) mode for it to change up at the red line when pulling away quickly as, with the 2.0 TDI engine, the change from first to second and second to third come up very quickly.

    But S-Line, did you not know how it behaved BEFORE you purchased the car ?
    #8
  10. OutLore
    Offline

    OutLore VOIP Dude

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    1,206
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    Mine only kicks down if you plant the throttle enough to click the "kick down" switch.... other than that nothing, it will try to accellerate from 1100 rpm in 6th without changing at full throttle.....
    #9
  11. cosmicblue
    Offline

    cosmicblue Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    320
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    You just know that this thread will run and run don't you?
    #10
  12. imported_RedSportback
    Online

    imported_RedSportback Guest

    [Feb 2, 2006]
    Until March delivery I'll have to walk and walk before I express an opinion!
    #11
  13. OutLore
    Offline

    OutLore VOIP Dude

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    1,206
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    You just know that this thread will run and run don't you?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Hehe yeah - wait til Bowfer sees it /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
    #12
  14. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 2, 2006]
    Yes, that's odd where is Bowfer?

    BOWFER!!!!!
    #13
  15. imported_S_Line
    Online

    imported_S_Line Guest

    [Feb 3, 2006]
    Hey don't get me wrong, i just thought may be things were a bit different on the 06 models.

    I never knew it Kicked down a gear when in Manual when you plant your right foot, until yesterday when i took it out for some extensive testing /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    Also did you know......... Its quicker to take off from Tick-over than it is from using the Launch Control on the 3.2


    As there is a micro fraction of a delay when using launch control, when you have your right foot fully planted with your left foot on the brake (i know it feels weird) when you lift your foot off the brake there is a 0.5 second delay before drive is engaged.

    Compare this time with the car in S mode with traction control OFF, the engine ticking over (at the lights) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    then plant the throttle Its instant all ahead full !!

    Had all 4 wheels spinning their little socks off today while slowly moving sideways ! LOL ! something my ole WR1 used to do LOL !


    BOWFER !!!!!
    #14
  16. Amchlolor
    Offline

    Amchlolor Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2005
    Messages:
    5,604
    Likes Received:
    3
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    HURRAH !!!!!!!

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/groovy.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dancing.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/woohoo.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yes.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ok.gif


    Let's sue Audi !! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/MexWave.gif
    #15
  17. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    Don't you just love it when Bowfer's happy?
    #16
  18. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    If you want 'manual' gear-changing, buy a car with a manual gearbox.

    If you want 'power-assisted and intelligent' gear-changing buy a car with a DSG.
    #17
  19. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    I prefer the smarter version, but its all down to personal choice.
    #18
  20. tinka
    Online

    tinka Guest

    [Feb 3, 2006]
    i think the only major benefit the dsg has over most ather gearbox's is the speed it changes gear,which is impresive,and what the hype was all about when it came out,and the reason it has two cluthes is for this purpose alone,

    most of us know its auto with manual control,and there are a few about like it ,but dont change as fast,

    i still like it,as i cant be bothered with a manual any more,and its as economical as a manual too,so im happy,that aside im sure the debates on this forum will go on and on,untill a fully manual one with no software interuption becomes available,

    it does make for good reading sometimes,and the thought of bowfer getting wound up,its like being around the mess table at work.
    #19
  21. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    I very much doubt if Audi/VW will ever produce a version of the DSG with no software interuption. Whats the point - the present version is so popular with most drivers (Bowfer excepted) as it is. It gives most of us the best of both worlds. I personally much prefer the 'software interuption' version just as it stands especially with the short rev range of the 2.0 TDI engine.
    #20
  22. Amchlolor
    Offline

    Amchlolor Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2005
    Messages:
    5,604
    Likes Received:
    3
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    I very much doubt if Audi/VW will ever produce a version of the DSG with no software interuption. Whats the point - the present version is so popular with most drivers (Bowfer excepted) as it is. It gives most of us the best of both worlds. I personally much prefer the 'software interuption' version just as it stands especially with the short rev range of the 2.0 TDI engine.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    It's not 'just' the software interruption though David and you're,pretty much,the only person I've seen that doesn't have any sort of quibble with DSG at all (or not that I can remember you admitting to,anyway).

    Only last night,I found myself coming to standstill traffic in manual mode.
    I forgot to slip it into D,so when the traffic started edging forward I just gently pushed the throttle and throttled off when it slowed again.

    Jesus,the 'whiplash' when I backed off actually threw me forward in my seat and must have had the people behind thinking "bloody idiot".

    If I'd had a passenger,it would have been MEGA embarrassing.

    It's not acceptable and it's not peculiar to my car.

    Then there's the DSG..................delay at junctions.

    If I concede I'm 'wrong' in buying DSG,will you concede Audi are wrong in using the term manual ? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ok.gif
    #21
  23. tinka
    Online

    tinka Guest

    [Feb 3, 2006]
    what im saying is, it will still be classed as an auto,untill that happens,but like you david im happy with it the way it is,

    some people will always want full control of the car,and change gear when they want,at the revs they want,but for reliability vag have to use the software,for the same purpose as the rev limiter,i guess?.
    #22
  24. Amchlolor
    Offline

    Amchlolor Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2005
    Messages:
    5,604
    Likes Received:
    3
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    but for reliability vag have to use the software,for the same purpose as the rev limiter,i guess?.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Why ?
    Why not just have the rev-limiter like the manual car ?
    Do they assume DSG drivers are incapable of changing up themselves and need help ?

    I've yet to see a plausible excuse for the auto max rev change up,other than Audi deliberately using such short 1,2+3 gearing,in an attempt to get an impressive 0-60 time(to try and tease buyers into thinking it's a performance option),that changing gears manually would be a pain.

    That's not a good reason.
    That's working around a problem they've given themselves.
    #23
  25. tinka
    Online

    tinka Guest

    [Feb 3, 2006]
    i see your point bowfer,im only assuming,that the software is there for that purpose,i dont know?,

    im sure that the tuning companies soon enough will be able to modify the dsg software to over come the problem,maybe the torque limit has something to do with it,again i dont know,just assuming again.
    #24
  26. bacardi
    Offline

    bacardi Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2005
    Messages:
    1,139
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    i see your point bowfer,im only assuming,that the software is there for that purpose,i dont know?,

    im sure that the tuning companies soon enough will be able to modify the dsg software to over come the problem,maybe the torque limit has something to do with it,again i dont know,just assuming again.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Half of the reason I guess is the libel cases, if it bounced off of the rev limiter and didnt change up and someone couldnt avoid an accident they would prob sue, with this or they tried to pull out of a junction after slowing down from 70 with the car in 6th, then get hit by a lorry because it hadnt changed down..... guess its not too politically correct? Now for the flames!

    BTW Bowfer, I too don't like the shunt when in Manual in slow moving traffic either, though if you did the same thing in a manual you'd kangaroo everywhere too (Its just that you'd cover the clutch in a manual) so you cant really blame the box for that?
    #25
  27. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    Bowfer I'm not admitting to any quibble with the DSG as I have none. I love it just the way it is. I think Audi have done the right thing in making the DSG change up at near max revs. It works extremely well with the TDI engine and the short rev range. Pull away quickly in 'manual' mode, let the box change up almost immediately into second and the third. Needing to change up manually so quickly would be a pain.

    You say about the 'whiplash' effect when in 'manual' mode. I drive my car in 'manual' mode almost all the time, in traffic queues as well sometimes and have never experience any problem of the problem you describe. Perhaps I'm a little gentler with the throttle I don't know, but I get no such effect from my DSG either when I or my wife is driving.

    You're just driving the wrong car !
    #26
  28. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    I agree with Dave here, I've not had any driveline shunt problems, even with the remap its still easily controlled on the throttle.

    My only quibble with the box is the downshift on the kickdown in manual. But I only discovered it yesterday as I rarely tread on the throttle that hard.

    Its still the best gearbox I've used in 35 years of motoring (closely followed by the MX-5 gearbox).
    #27
  29. stevieboy
    Offline

    stevieboy Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    What the hell, I'll chance me arm at making a comment, after all I'm here on my own, no one will ever know.....

    I have no quibbles with the DSG box either - never have and never will (unless it packs in altogether........)

    I drove (I think) every A3 derivative whilst deciding which one to buy, manual, DSG, petrol, diesel, SE, Sport and S-Line.

    I purchased the DSG knowing it wouldn't really be a manual nor an auto. A 'best of both worlds' in my opinion which suited my needs perfectly.

    So there, I've said it now......
    #28
  30. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    Bowfer - I think I may have found just the car for you. In this weeks Auto Express is an article on the new Jaguar XK. Part of the report reads:

    " The Jag gets a six-speed auto, but this is no ordinary auto. Slide the lever into Sport mode and the car comes alive, holding gears when cornering and downshifting to the red line with an accurate blip of the throttle.

    Better still is the paddleshift manual mode. Changes are supremely fast, even swapping cogs quicker than the VW Group's class leading DSG sequential manual."

    All you have to do is persuade your MD to allow you to spend £64,995 for a covertible or a mere £58,995 for the Coupe. Good luck !
    #29
  31. Eeef
    Offline

    Eeef Lord of War

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2004
    Messages:
    1,607
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    To be honest, I'd prefer it to be more manual but with exceptions.

    In an ideal world it would not up-shift unless you did something daft like bounce off the limiter for 5 secs.
    I'm quite happy with the down shifts though, if it stalled you'd have to come to a complete stop, put it in P before restarting.

    That being said, I knew what the car did when I bought it and I'd rather have the DSG with it's little irks (to me) than not have it.
    #30
  32. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    Perhaps one day it will be programmable by the driver by VAG.com or something similar, but I doubt whether that will be just yet. By all accounts the software side of the box took a very long time to develop.
    #31
  33. Amchlolor
    Offline

    Amchlolor Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2005
    Messages:
    5,604
    Likes Received:
    3
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Bowfer I'm not admitting to any quibble with the DSG as I have none.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Something rings a bell about you admitting to the 'DSG delay' though.

    Didn't you once admit you 'work around' the problem by trying to keep rolling at junctions ?

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

    I'll get you on something,I will... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
    #32
  34. cosmicblue
    Offline

    cosmicblue Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    320
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Only last night,I found myself coming to standstill traffic in manual mode.
    I forgot to slip it into D,so when the traffic started edging forward I just gently pushed the throttle and throttled off when it slowed again.

    Jesus,the 'whiplash' when I backed off actually threw me forward in my seat and must have had the people behind thinking "bloody idiot".

    If I'd had a passenger,it would have been MEGA embarrassing.

    It's not acceptable and it's not peculiar to my car. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ok.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I believe this 'lunge at the horizon' problem is down to Audi's engine management software' as my TDi did this badly - big complaints from passengers. The Revo remap fixed this - the lunge is still there but occurs in 2nd gear which isn't a problem....more of a huge grin actually as one mutters F F S!

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/groovy.gif
    #33
  35. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    F F S - Fairly Fast Sir?
    #34
  36. cosmicblue
    Offline

    cosmicblue Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    320
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    F F S - Fairly Fast Sir?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    For F sake actually Mike
    #35
  37. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    No REALLY!!!!

    Well F M O B. ;-)
    #36
  38. mikep
    Offline

    mikep Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    591
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Feb 3, 2006]
    How's the car John?
    #37
  39. cosmicblue
    Offline

    cosmicblue Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    320
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Feb 4, 2006]
    [ QUOTE ]
    How's the car John?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Whizzing along just beautifully Mike, that Stage1 map is the absolute business - 55mpg indicated and a true 50mpg on the brim to brim check @ 80ish on the motorway so better than standard.

    Pure 'drivability' is just so improved from std - especially the punch coming out of corners - there really isn't much that can keep up cross country,

    The Pirelli P-Zeros aren't doing so well though.....about half worn at the front in 7000 miles....
    #38
  40. h5djr
    Offline

    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2003
    Messages:
    7,519
    Likes Received:
    573
    [Feb 4, 2006]
    Maybe, bowfer, but that's not really a quibble it's just a characteristic of the DSG which is easy to overcome. It's a matter of adjusting your driving to suit what you have.

    The main reason I originally wanted to test drive a car fitted with a DSG was that the manual gearboxes on my previous four A3s were so awful. They were the worst part of an otherwise excellent car. The thought of driving a diesel and having to change gear even more often using such a box did not appeal at all. The DSG has proved, in my opinion to be a vast improvement and made the A3 even more enjoyable to drive.
    #39
  41. imported_S_Line
    Online

    imported_S_Line Guest

    [Feb 5, 2006]
    Got to say the reasons i bough the DSG was the Super fast gear changes with the 0-60 times quicker than the manual version /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I thought the idea of eating ice cream and the car changing gear for me was a great option.

    I found myself leaning a new way to drive the car, as its very different from a manual.

    In the city i find myself in Sport mode allot, if there are alto of roundabouts, where you need to be in 1st gear before you get too them for a super slick Merge with other cars already going round the roundabout, then back into D after the hectic stuff has passed, then back into S if i find myself at the front of the lights, and then the Traction Control then has to be switched off /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    Using Manual mode i find myself catching it out more, changing down more than two gears at a time and wanting the gear NOW !!!! doesnt happen. It needs to be changes down like a manual, coming into bends and junctions i have found.

    One year on and i have nearly mastered it /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
    #40

Share This Page