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S3 8L vs A3 2TFSI 8P

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by JD09, Jun 1, 2010.

  1. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    #1
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  3. Boydie
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    Boydie Boycie VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    2.0TFSI S-Line Quattro with Revo remap = circa 250bhp

    With opportunity for a lot more/better power with the introduction of a TBE, Intake, Stage 2+ etc... bye bye 8L S3

    Win win there!!

    No arguement from me at all, 8P all the way!

    8P is more more modern, better equipped, fresher etc...
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  4. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Modding is all very well, but TBE, Intake, stage2 mapping etc is easily achievable on the 8L.

    But your points about a newer, fresher car are interesting. What about the "S" over the "A"? Genuine question!
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  5. antmax7
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    antmax7 Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    i own a 2.0t a3 quattro and it'll walk all over the 8l s3 and it has done.
    much better all round car
    but you are compairing the top model of the 8L model against the 2/3 tier 8P model
    if you want the S3 badge get the S3!
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  6. beanoir
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    beanoir Sharpest Tongue in the West

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Difficult on actually, I quite like the 8L S3 and you get the exclusivity of having an "S" model.

    The 8P model is as said above, more modern etc etc which also counts for a lot.

    For me it would be down to how I used a car I think, if it was a weekend low mileage requirement I'd be tempted by a nice late model good condition 8L S3, if I was running to work in the car and putting the miles on and needed reliability then I'd probably opt for the 8P.
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  7. BeatmasterB
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    BeatmasterB New Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Interesting Q... i loved my old S3, and i wouldn't have swapped that for an A3, they are just too common and dare i say 'normal' :) I still turn my head when i see an 8l, they still look good, in a pumped up beefy , kinda dated classic way... where i live id have a sore neck if i turned round to look at all the suit bods in company s lines :)

    Having said all that, and i still wish i had mine hiding in my garage just for the hell of it... but, the trouble with the old 8L now is they are too cheap, i seen a few iffy looking dudes in a couple round our way, puts me off... thats why i got rid of mine, 2 sterio pumping 'rude bwoyz' eyeing my up in exactly same car (except for additional all round tints) at the next pump on the petrol station forecourt -> missis just didn't feel special in it after that ;) - classic reasoning just didnt wash after that :(
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  8. Ads
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    Ads License to drive

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    From standstill with the always perfect DSG upshifts..... I'd be confident in mine, everytime.

    Then when flicking up and down between gears.... manual mode. Not as confident, but still quite confident.
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  9. akash_sky1
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    akash_sky1 Active Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    I have one which has been modded, to correct the guy above it actually has a 2.0TFSI specific K03 not a K04 turbo unfortunately.
    In standard form with quattro you can definately feel the extra weight and drivetrain losses having their effect at higher speeds and not as sprightly as a mk5 GTI. However the engine is virtually lag free in standard form, makes a good noise and revs quite freely and smoothly.
    A 'stage 2' 8L S3 (2001 >) would easily beat a similarly tuned 2.0TFSI- it has well over 100 kg less weight.
    Mine is modded obviously, and now it has a decent GIAC hardware specific map , with my heavy wheels and extra weight from the sportback I reckong it would hit the 1/4 in low 14s at best. ( After having already ran 14.7 with a shitty map). A stage 2 8L could hit high 13s easily.

    To the person who said he can walk all over an 8L S3 is must have been an earlier 210 BHP model and poorly driven.
    A 225 with map ,TBE and intake can easily get 280 and like I said is a lot lighter, so a walk over it would not be my friend!

    Are you comparing for the sake of it or because you want to upgrade? Have you been in the 8P S3? whole different ball game.
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  10. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Fair enough fella but the figures don't suggest that, standard that is. Is yours modded? Manual or DSG?
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  11. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Interesting insight, thanks for this. A remapped 8L hits 250. Stage two (FMIC, TBE and downpipe) is 270. Are these the figures you guys would look to get? With 197 standard would they need uprated fuel pumps/injectors?
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  12. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Oh and to answer the last question, having been next to one I wondered how much the S badge added to the price tag, possibly putting an A3 with a decent engine in my bracket.

    Newer car, lower miles etc. Would be the 2tfsi quattro if any!
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  13. akash_sky1
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    akash_sky1 Active Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    After scouring many forums and GIAC's website, most people in the states ,where tuned K03 2.0Ts are common, most are hitting about 235-240 WHP on average for stage 2, without HPHP , with HPFP and uprated FMIC ( we already have one) they can are manage 270 WHP. note this is for 2wd A3/GTIs.

    Yet to dyno mine since new software, but I would expect 260-270 at the fly hopefully. If I keep it next year will stick a FMIC and HPFP on and get the GIAC HPFP map. Mines quick, bit quicker then R32 but a remapped S3 is another ball game.
    To get over 275 -280 ish lb ft torque reliably and smoothly ,and for better top end, a HPFP is a good mod for the 2,0T. With the K03 boost peaks at around 3.5 k on a mapped car and here the standard pump can struggle to give enough fuel for a mapped car ( in some cases), so a pump is a good mod. Much more mid range torque can be unlocked having one fitted. In the states, on good dynos ( mustang & dynojet) stage 2 with HPFP are able to get 300lb ft + wheel torque! not bad eh.

    Then you can get 280bhp with a FMIC as well. With TBE and intake of course.
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2010
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  14. antmax7
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    antmax7 Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]

    mine is standard 2.0T quattro sportback manual apart from a remap
    8L S3 are plentyful around sheffield dont get me wrong they are a quick car just not a patch on the 8P in my opinion as i stated it's a much better allround car
    but as has been said you don't compare top model against 2/3 tier next generation do you!

    8L S3 is pants compared to the 8P S3 end of.
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  15. akash_sky1
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    akash_sky1 Active Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    basically performance wise not a huge difference, everything else- wise as you'd expect there's no comparision 8P 2.0T > 8L S3
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  16. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Eh? Why not lad? Same price bracket. That's what I'm comparing; Is it worth technically "downgrading in badge" for a newer car but less horse power.

    And again, you're comparing an 8 year old car vs the brand new model which wasn't the question lad :) pants is a little strong/one sided!

    Not wishing to start an argument, but sportback running 198bhp (standard) vs 225 hatchback is a no brainer!

    But you say you are mapped, so . . . 245/50 bhp?
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  17. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
    Agreed. More toys etc!
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  18. antmax7
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    antmax7 Member

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    [Jun 1, 2010]
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  19. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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  20. beanoir
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    beanoir Sharpest Tongue in the West

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    Read the OP post, no mention of 8P S3 is there?

    Cut the guy some slack! He's asking perfectly genuine questions for somebody looking to change their car and looking to the folk on 8P to provide advice.
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  21. BeatmasterB
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    BeatmasterB New Member

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    seems a perfectly reasonable question/comparison to me... i personally would not buy a standard A in favour of the older S3 (red one is lovely btw).
    I would look elsewhere for something a little more exclusive/top of range in another bracket instead.... just my two cents.
    but then im near commuter london where A3s and BMWs are plentiful, its nice to have something a little different.
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  22. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    My apologies I wasn't trying to bait/cause arguments as I am sure antmax realises. It was just the realisation that maybe I could have bought an 8P, newer car with less miles, and still get the quattro/build quality/go of my S3 . . . perhaps I've paid a premium for an "S".

    I am not exactly a showey person, so the badge has no say in the matter. It just rang home a little when I barely managed to pull away from the TFSI in the first post!
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  23. chrissy1502002
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    chrissy1502002 Member

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    I had exactly the same dilemma when I bought mine in January. The major deciding factor for me was the interior. I had a Seat Ibiza Cupra before, and the only reason I sold it was to get an A3 with a really nice interior as I now travel 60 miles a day to and from work. I can definately see the appeal of the "S", but it just was not enough to sway me.

    See my sig for my Mods. But out right pace of my A3 is substantionaly quicker than my friends solely remapped 8L S3.
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  24. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    Thanks chrissy, is yours mapped then? Could I ask the region that you paid for your car, relative to age?
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  25. chrissy1502002
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    chrissy1502002 Member

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    I have just noticed that I need to amend my Signature lol, yes it is mapped on a stage 2 from AMD.

    I paid just over £11k for mine on a 06 back in Jan of this year.

    If you want to know anything else, just ask mate! :)
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  26. N8
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    N8 Kowalski Details VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    I just find the 8L interior DATED now. So 8P adl for me.
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  27. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    N8, did you not have an 8L as well? I was hoping for someone who had owned the 8L and moved on/up/down, which ever way they look at it!
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  28. N8
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    N8 Kowalski Details VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    No I didn't, Nigel has moved up, although he still likes the 8L, I'll take you out in mine when its back, that'll swing your vote!
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  29. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    Ha, I bet! Especially with those seats! Where are you based pal?
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  30. N8
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    N8 Kowalski Details VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    Not far from you lad.
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  31. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    That sounds good to me pal.
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  32. MintyS3
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    MintyS3 Works 60% the time, Everytime.

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    You need a map in your life....Few choice mods to the S3 and you'll never think twice about getting an 8P A3... :eyebrows:
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  33. N8
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    N8 Kowalski Details VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    Wait till he sees my interior then his will be up for sale....
    #32
  34. MintyS3
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    MintyS3 Works 60% the time, Everytime.

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    You gonna sell him your interior if he buys an A3? lol.

    Some aspects are dated but I guess because mine is such a low mileage example it doesnt seem too dated to me. Its still a solid, nice place to be.
    #33
  35. N8
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    N8 Kowalski Details VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2010]
    Ha Ha - 8P is even nicer.
    #34
  36. JD09
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    JD09 I'm not modding, I'm improving VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 3, 2010]
    Apart from the interior?
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