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S tronic Vs Manual

Discussion in 'New A3/S3 (8V Chassis)' started by rizzoface, Mar 11, 2014.

  1. Itguy
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    Itguy Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    I don't get that problem with my 6 speed S-tronic in our new S3, but our Golf GTI mk5 DSG is slow then explodes with wheelspin / traction control everywhere

  2. PilotAudi
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    PilotAudi New Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    The joys of the 'quattro' ;-)
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  3. Daz Auto
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    Daz Auto Active Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    So after 5 pages - there are pros and cons to both gearboxes. And people have different opinions.

    Look at the pros and cons - look at your requirements - have some test drives - buy the car you want - be happy :)

    The auto has more pros FOR ME - the auto fits most (not all) OF MY requirements - I LIKE driving both gearboxes - I AM happy with MY CHOICE of gearbox :)

    On Wednesday I spent 5 1/2 hours driving my car. Left home at 7am. Returned home at 8:30pm. On my way home (when I was knackered) I realised that - unless I change my job - I will be getting another auto box.
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  4. Stephen C
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    Stephen C Active Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    That sounds more like the difference between FWD and AWD! I'm sure I read somewhere that the slow launch is a deliberate limitation done in the S tronic's programming. I guess I'll get used to it!
  5. Joetidman
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    Joetidman Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    I think the two are linked. As Audi know that FWD will get some wheel-spin, perhaps they built in some slowness initially on the 7-speed, to avoid it, and the traction control kicking in and braking the driven wheels. The 6-speed doesn't seem to have those issues, but is linked to quattro, so doesn't need to as the grip will almost always be there
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2014
  6. Stephen C
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    Stephen C Active Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    That sounds logical. My old one did wheelspin, but I had learned to touch the accelerator just the right amount to launch fast but avoid spin. I guess most people would rather have a slower but smoother launch?!
  7. 0B1001001
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    0B1001001 Active Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Naw, most people would rather have quattro :cool:
  8. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    My current A3 is a 2.0TDI-170 front-wheel drive with the 6-speed s-tronic and I have no trouble get going quickly and also no problem with wheel spin. I personally think those who have trouble with a lot of wheel spin on the front wheel drive A3s need to learn how to drive them a little better. Pushing you foot flat to the floor is not the best way of getting going, even if you want to get going quickly. I usually can beat most cars away from the lights without any problem and without any wheel spin.
  9. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    And with the s-tronic you can have an auto for such situation and still have manual mode for when you are just driving for fun.
  10. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    But that's so much middle of the road, the manual isn't real manual i.e. optimized for driver control. You can't e.g. shift from the sixth gear direct to the second with paddles, can you (correct me if I am wrong)? But still, auto gearboxes may be more convenient on standard roads and standard conditions.
  11. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Depending on your meaning of 'direct', then yes you can, and without dumping power/acceleration/forward motion.

    And depending on the speed of one finger of your left-hand, most probably faster than with your left leg and arm flailing about, which will eventually get tired... Don't get me wrong here, I like cars, and engines, and tyres, and gear trains, etc., and have been doing so since the late 60's, but the DSG is truly amazing. :jump:

    But hey, in 10-years time you'll not be able to purchase a manual gear-change car, everything will be DSG, as the Brussels know it alls are already legislating for that - emissions, etc.

    So enjoy that manual while you can... :yes:
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  12. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    I don't generally change from 6th to second but changing two gears at once is just like a double-click on the mouse. The only time the s-tronic changes a lot of gears at once is for example if you come to a stop still in 5th gear. It changes instantly to 1st as soon as you stop with you needing to do anything.

    There is the only thing I forget if I drive my wife's manual A1. Trying to pull away at a roundabout in 3rd or 4th gear is not a good idea!!
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  13. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    That's so funny! And TRUE! :sadlike:

    I had EXACTLY the same issue when going from the RS3 to the wife's A2, so many stalls (forgetting to dump the clutch) it was ridiculous. So the A2 went and a 3.2TT with 6-speed DSG arrived, later changed for a MK2 TT with 6-speed DSG of course...

    But yes, I remember that, so embarrassingly well...
    :blush:
  14. veeeight
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    veeeight I am a very pretty girl

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    This video demonstrates a direct DSG shift from 5th to 2nd





    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2014
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  15. Joetidman
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    Joetidman Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Blimey that's fast!
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2014
  16. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Also in manual mode?
  17. CraigI
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    CraigI Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Personally, and purely from a driving enjoyment point of view, I think the S3 would drive better if it was front wheel drive and had a proper diff/suspension set up than it does with the current Quattro.
    Not enough going to the rear to make the Quattro brilliant in the S3 when it comes to very spirited driving.
    The Quattro in my previous S5 was perfect and the S3 would benefit greatly from a similar set up.

    edited to apologise for veering off topic.
  18. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Hopefully there will remapping available soon? If Audi lived in the 2100 century, they would understand that customization and personalisation is the way to go and offer different remapping alternatives themselves.
  19. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Yes in any mode. As soon as you stop 1st gear is selected automatically.
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  20. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Audi are in the business of mass manufacturing cars for 'normal' users. I think they are quite happy leaving the small market for remapping of engines and gearboxes to the specialist tuners such as ABT and MTM.
  21. cuke2u
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    cuke2u Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Yes but they could endorse a tuning company like ford do with mountune and offer it at selected dealers with the warranty intact...
  22. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Yes but ABT have a very close relationship with Audi and worked with them in the DTM racing.

    Here is a comments from the ABT website "This unique competence and experience, in addition to intensive cooperation with the technological leaders Audi and VW, will keep us moving in the future as well". I'm sure a lot of people looking for modifications for their cars would rather deal direct with ABT than through an Audi dealer. ABT themselves offer their own 2 year warranty.
  23. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 14, 2014]
    Sorry, my previous post was put in the wrong thread by mistake, but as we are speaking of it, I definitely agree with Cuke2u. Nothing speaks against it, others manufacturers do it. If there is a empty niche to exploit without jeopardising brand, why not fill it (and increase the number of satisfied customers, which more likely stay with the brand)? E.g. allow people get 50/50 quattro, by paying for the mod.
  24. royalsteve68
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    royalsteve68 Active Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    if you spend most of your time in traffic like me that stronic is a godsend....however I still hate the auto for parking as I don't feel it - the creep function - precise enough at low speed
  25. royalsteve68
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    royalsteve68 Active Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    lol, I drove my peuegot 307 last week and forgot it was manual at the first junction, cue red face :keule:
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  26. Mjs
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    Mjs New Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    I have a manual as a company car, only because it was cheaper! The manual is great so why pay the tax man £26 a month? Keep the extra £312 a year in your pocket and treat yourself to something else. If it was my own personal car I think I would have had the auto box, but I'm not paying the tax man for the privilege.
  27. Battlekrapz
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    Battlekrapz Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    I hope the stronic lovers realise that the manual lovers have given up on this thread ages ago, this thread has become a monologue :D. There's no point discussing this as some people here cannot accept any divergence of opinion.
  28. veeeight
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    veeeight I am a very pretty girl

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    It swings both ways.

    There are ample posts littered across the forum from manual gearbox evangelists proclaiming that you're less of a man if you choose an S-tronic, or that auto boxes are for people with, quote, - "special needs", and that somehow a manual gearbox makes you more involved.


    At the end of the day - if you like 3 pedals and changing gear with a stick - choose a manual. Otherwise choose 2 pedals and S-tronic.
  29. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Personally I think the same is true of Manual gearbox lovers. They refuse to accept that anyone can enjoy driving just as much with an s-tronic gearbox as with a manual gearbox.

    If you prefer a manual then enjoy it whilst you can. An increasing number of Audi's, especially their top of the range and more powerful versions, are now being made available as 's-tronic only'. Some of the new developments like the e-trons are also s-tronic only and I'm sure this trend will continue whether we like it or not.
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2014
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  30. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Agreed Dave, as the hybridisation of engines continues it makes no sense at all to be changing gear when so much of the rest of the vehicle is driven by electronics. The S Tronic removes one additional variable from the process that doesn't need to be their.

    I'm preparing for this by accepting I'll have to drive what's available day to day, and saving up for a classic 2 seater sports car that has that smell of the vintage leather, oil leaks and carbon for the weekend (not decided what yet, but it may be an early 70's 911).

    As I've said before, I'm about to embrace S Tronic in May, but as I've grown up with a family who owned an engineering firm manufacturing bespoke parts for classic & 60's/70's F1 cars I don't feel compelled to kick previous generation tech to the gutter because the next best thing has arrived; I have an open mind I will continue to appreciate the best bits of everything for what they can offer.
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2014
  31. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    I was afraid of I having to read exactly this. Doing a great amount of parking in the tight spaces I am happy I chose the manual, thanks.
  32. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Ever heard of consumer power? So if you are not disabled or stuck in traffic jams all day, why not going for manual? ;)
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  33. NICK-C
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    NICK-C Nick

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    I am not too bothered either way but sway slightly towards autos now. I used to only drive manuals and said I would never have auto, mainly because they used to be slower and less economical but that has changed now. My A5 was s-tronic and my first auto so I was a little apprehensive at first but combined with the 3.0tdi I was impressed and thankful when stuck in traffic I didn't have manual. However, there are pros and cons for both and as people have said it's and all down to perfrence.
    I currently have a manual while waiting for my new car to arrive and I have to say I am enjoying the extra 'involvement' but I know when I get my new one (SQ5) this will all be forgotten because it's the engine I was sold on this car, so I wouldn't be bothered if it was manual or auto.
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  34. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Equally why spend all day pushing a clutch pedal when you can be just as involved by choosing all your own gears without one. As far as consumer power is concerned all the companies in the VAG group who sell DSG/s-tronics are showing an increasing number of customers going for the DSG/s-tronic. Eventually they will have to decide if they want to continue with the costs of developing two different gearboxes for each new model. I think economics will decide No and they will choose the more modern DSG/s-tronic. That is exactly the decision Audi have made with the R8 which can now be purchased with s-tronic only and most if not all of the quattro models with longitudinally mounted engine. Quattro = s-tronic in a lot of cases and personally I think this trend will increase.

    Personally I very rarely get struck in traffic jams because, being retired, I don't have to drive at busy times but I will always choose the s-tronic for the shear pleasure of driving in manual mode and not having to keep pushing a clutch pedal together with all the other advantages of the s-tronic. To me it is well worth the extra cost.
  35. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    I respect your view but we are back on "pressing the clutch", for most people that is part of the joy, skill and control and not at all tiresome (apart for extended periods of slow cueing perhaps).
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  36. Joetidman
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    Joetidman Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Just watched an S3 review and they quoted that Audi only expect 4% of sales globally to be manual! There must be a lot of markets where they only sell Stronic
  37. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Yes there are! Lazy Americans and not so well co-ordinated Asians ;) Who cares? :)

    But the figure is lower than I expected. However, Audi is in many market almost playing in the luxury segment, hence automatic is what they think people with money/ambitions prefer. Audi make more money on s-tronic buyers, hence if they can, they sell cars where you can only chose s-tronic.
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2014
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  38. felsby
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    felsby Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    I drove a 2007 Porsche Boxster with manual transmission in the swiss alps. Don´t make up your mind before you have tried it. It was an overwhelming pleasure to drive - so responsive and simply fun.
  39. GreatBallsofFire
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    GreatBallsofFire Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    It came to my mind that you Brits have to change gear with the left hand while steering with the right, well that is a tricky thing to excel in, I can understand if you guys go for a automatic gear box. Must also be hard to write letter for the majority if you have the nav-pack..
  40. J6YAK
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    J6YAK Well-Known Member

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    [Mar 15, 2014]
    Not really any different to changing gear with the right hand and steering with the left!!! Not sure I get your point?
    I've driven right and left hand drive cars and yes it's a bit odd for the first few gear changes but then just begins to feel normal after that.

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