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RS6 Alloys seem to have caused a problem

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by 5hake5, Jun 29, 2006.

  1. 5hake5
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    5hake5 New Member

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    [Jun 29, 2006]
    I have just fitted 18" RS6 Alloys with 235/40/ZR18 tyres to my A4 2.8 Q Avant. Everything seemed fine and have driven some distance to work and back with no probs. Driving up the road though within 24 hrs of changing I have now noticed a slight knocking or clipping noise from the O/S front wheel the def was not there before. Are these tyres/rims too big for my B5? Can I cure with spacers? or has something else happened ie wheel bearings? They were a tight fit esp at the top!
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  3. easytease
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    easytease cheesypeas

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    [Jun 29, 2006]
    jack the car up and support it on an axle stand or something, then try and cimpress the wheel/suspension with a jack to see if it rubs anywhere (after you've visually imspected to check theres no sign of rubbing)
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  4. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 30, 2006]
    Whats the offset?? as 235 may be too wide depending on the offset of the rims
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  5. Anito
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    Anito Member

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    [Jun 30, 2006]
    Did you replace the wheel nuts? When I fitten them to my B5 I needed shorter wheel nuts.
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  6. The Slug
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    The Slug Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 30, 2006]
    Arnt the tyres 225/40/18 as the RSTT 18" alloys?
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  7. 5hake5
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    5hake5 New Member

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    [Jun 30, 2006]
    Ta 4 the replies. I dropped in to Midland Performance in Walsall and they had a look. Sold me some spacers which should bring the tyre away from the suspension arm. Was very close and when slowing down was touching the tyre slightly (we think!). 5mm spacer will hopefully cure the problem.
    Anito - Wheel nuts were fine
    Slug - No, they are def 235. 225 would have been fine I reckon without spacers. They came off a m8's S4 4.2 who has just gone for 19" Allys
    Mawhitey - O/S was abbrev for offside.
    I'll keep u posted and post a pic when I get a chance.
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  8. ZeroK66
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    ZeroK66 Member

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    [Jul 3, 2006]
    Is the S4 4.2 not et50?? No wonder its so close! I just bought a set of BBS alloys which were on an S4 4.2 & these were et50. I have bought a set of 15mm spacers to sort the problem.
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  9. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    Can somebody please explain how et numbers work, i have just fitted oem S4 alloys and i have a grinding/rubbing noise and i cant find where its coming from, i have read on here that these will be et20 (im at work so cant pull one off to check) and that i need et35, what would having et20's on do?? and how can i sort it so they run fine.

    There is loads of clearance from the arches and i cant see anywhere they are rubbing, also its all the time not just when turning. They were fitted to a standard A4 before.

    Also would i need longer or shorter wheel nuts??

    Ste.
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  10. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    the et number refers to how far the mounting face of the wheel sits off the centre line of the wheel in millimeters. Positive offset is most common and the smaller the offset the more the wheel sticks out from the bodywork, the bigger the offset then more likely it is that it will foul the steering arms but less likely to foul the wheelarch.
    Zero offset means the mounting face is bang on the centreline of the wheel.
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  11. Phantom_A4
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    Phantom_A4 Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    235 tyres are for the 19" version, they are too wide for the 18's mate. I have 225/35/19's on the front and it rubs on the inside of the arch on full lock. Not sure what the knocking is, i dont think its tyre rub if your going straight?
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  12. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    Hi, thanks for the fast replies, So if the et is 20 then it is further out so my only worry should be that it doesn't come out further than the arches, which it doesnt (just!) and its definatly not rubbing on the arches as the gap is really big.

    The tyres are 225/40ZR18.
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  13. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    OEM S4 alloys for the B5 S4 were only 17" so they aren't OEM, must be replica's, in which case the offset could be anything. You need an offset of 35 for the B5 A4 although you can go few mm's either side of this.
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  14. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    I thought they were proper audi ones!! im not happy now! I will take a wheel off in the morning and see if i can find an et number.

    Thanks,
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  15. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    They could be proper ones, but off an S8 which had the same Avus style but 18" IIRC. They'll have the Audi rings embossed on them somewhere if that is the case.
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  16. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    i thought OEM s4 avus were 18"?
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  17. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    Not sure how to post pics so i have put a pic of the wheels i have in my avatar, i was told they were originally off an S4 but now im not so sure!!!

    I will check the wheels properly in the morning.

    Thanks guys,
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  18. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    No B5 S4 was 17's as standard, don't think there was an optional upgrade to 18's. 18's were only fitted as standard to the RS4 B5
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  19. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    No B5 S4 was 17" Avus alloys as standard, don't think there was an optional upgrade. 18's were only fitted to the B5 RS4.
    Ste are you talking about RS4 9 spokes as pictured in your sig?
    These may well be OEM and will probably rub as they are designed for the bigger wheelarches on the RS4.
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  20. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 3, 2006]
    Yeah its the ones in my pic, where will they rub and how can i stop it???
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  21. QuantumJohn
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    QuantumJohn Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    OEM RS4 wheels are et20. You'd know if they were et20 becuase they would stick out past the arches by a long way and look very, very ....silly.

    They are either replica RS4 wheels or OEM ones off a later model audi that had these style wheels on as an option with the correct offset.

    And to clear up....
    The B5 S4 had 17" wheels as standard (no 18" option) that had an offset of et45 with 225/45R17 tyres.
    The B6 S4 had 18" wheels of very similar design running 225/40R18 tyres.

    Some people have 235/40R18 tyres on their 18" wheels because they are 8.5" wide as opposed to 8" wide.

    If you want to run 18" wheels on a B5 you will need an offset of approx et35 (can be a few mm either way especially if you are running BIG brakes on the front) as they will probably be 8" wide as opposed to 7 or 7.5 wide for the lower diameter wheels.

    And relax....

    John
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  22. QuantumJohn
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    QuantumJohn Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    Steve,
    Get a wheel off and somewhere on the back will be the et number stamped into it. Also the size of the wheel, probably something like '8Jx18'.
    If it is an 8J i.e. 8" wide wheel you will want an et of 35. If the et number is higher than this you'll need spacers to move the wheel out a little.

    If it is only doing on one side sounds like you just need small spacers 3 or 5mm

    John
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  23. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    Hi, i pulled a wheel off and cleaned off all the dirt to find the writing!! it says replica 8jx18 H2 ET 35 LK.

    So these should fit perfectly?? Now im really confused.
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  24. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    That's exactly the size reps I've got on my A4 2.8Q with 225/40/18's and absolutely no rubbing. Are you sure it's the wheels?
    If it's a scraping then have you looked at the wheel bolts, as you need to use the ones that came with the wheels.
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  25. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    I have checked all the bolts and i have 2 wheels with black ones with an audi logo on and 2 with silver ones, i also got a load of silver ones with the wheels, the weird thing is the silver ones are longer than the black?? I have put the shorter black ones on the front as i thought it might be the longer ones grinding on the hub but its still doing it??
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  26. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    I posted about this problem on audifans.net and a guy on there says that by putting the longer bolts in i will have killed my wheel bearings!! So thats probably what it is.

    Its just confused me how if i used the bolts the guy gave me how come he didnt have the same problem??
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  27. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    Mine needed the longer wheelnuts that came with the wheels, also remember to chuck a set of the original bolts in with the spare wheel as if you get a flat you can't use the same bolts on the spare wheel. (This is how I found out, luckily at a tyre place who gave me some shorter bolts to get me home).
    What sort of noise are you getting - scraping, knocking, rubbing, screeching?
    #26
  28. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    Do you think maybe the short bolts in the front could be the problem??

    Its a sort of grinding noise and gets louder when braking, also got a bit of wobble on the steering wheel.
    #27
  29. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    If it's grinding then you should be able to take the wheel off and see what the problem is. Anything grinding will have left its mark somewhere.
    If you jack the car up and rotate the wheel does it spin freely?
    Is it onboth sides?
    If only on one side can you swap the wheels over using the same bolts and see if the problem moves to the other side.
    Is it present at low speeds?
    Wobble on the steering wheel might only be that the wheels need rebalancing. If the wobble kicks in at 60mph or above (and is worse at a specific speed) then the wheels are out of balance.
    If the wobble is at all speeds then I'd get it checked out pretty quickly as you could be doing all sorts of damage by driving on it.
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  30. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 4, 2006]
    I have checked everywhere and there is no sighn of anything grinding at all.

    I have took a few people out in the car and they all agree the noise sounds like when you spin rope really fast.

    The wheel wobble is only very slight.

    I have tried putting my old wheels back on and there is no noise at all so its not the wheel bearings.

    I am using all the bolts gave to me with the wheels so they should be ok as they were on a standard A4 before.

    The tyres are a bit of a mis match in makes but none look damaged and all have good tread.

    The only thing i can think of now is maybe a damaged wheel??

    I suppose i need to bite the bullet and take it to a garage, only problem is after buying the wheels i dont have the money!!

    Unless anybody else can think of anything i will just stick the old wheels back on and get these ones checked next month.

    Thanks for all the suggestions guys,
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  31. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    "Its just confused me how if i used the bolts the guy gave me how come he didnt have the same problem??"
    The hubs are different on different models of A4. What A4 did he have?
    I know my 97 2.8Q will have beefier brakes than a 2.6 so it could just be a subtle difference between yours and his.
    #30
  32. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    I have just checked and they are off a Quattro, not sure of engine size though.
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  33. VaulterTim
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    VaulterTim In a world of my own...

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    Ste, what car do you drive? I don't think you've actually mentioned that yet...

    Have you checked the inside of the wheels for scoring... at an outside guess they may be fouling very slightly on your brake calipers, doubtful though if the wheels are ET35 and are fitted to an A4 of pretty much any description...
    #32
  34. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    It a 2.6 (fwd). Is no marks on anything at all, they are miles away from the calipers, too far out to rub anything on the suspension and the car sits too high on them to have any problems with the arches?

    :uhm:
    #33
  35. VaulterTim
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    VaulterTim In a world of my own...

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    And the sound is definately from the front of the car?
    #34
  36. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    Its hard for me to tell, but i have had people in the car and they all say sounds like from the front.

    listening to it on the way to work this morning and the noise sort of pulses?? Like if something is rubbing/grinding its not doing it all the time.

    With the front wheels off the disc seems a bit stiff to me to turn, but with the old wheels on the noise is not there so im assuming this is normal.
    #35
  37. VaulterTim
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    VaulterTim In a world of my own...

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    The discs will not move completely freely due to the brake pads holding them in place but they should move... if they are stiff to move then I would suggest checking your brake pads for wear. Fitting larger wheels with lower profile tyres can sometimes amplify problems that are waiting to happen. A bit of a long shot but it seems we are struggling here and without being in front of it and not being able to hear the exact noise you are describing it is obviously a little difficult to diagnose things completely... sorry if that is of no help!
    #36
  38. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    One other long shot is that you've got one tyre that's knackered. I had this on my old Golf, whereby the tyre had heavy wear in 4 places equi-distant from each other and this causes vibration and a horrible whirring noise at speed, sounded like a the wheel bearing was shot.
    You said you had a right old bunch of different tyres, I'd swap the wheels around and try and ensure you have 2 of the same make/wear on the front. The rears are much less important.
    #37
  39. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 5, 2006]
    The brake pads are new so might be why they seem a bit stiff.

    I will try swapping the back for the front, i just picked the best make tyres for the front, looking at it now the 2 fronts are very differant tread depths and patterns, i will swap those after work today.

    Its definatly a head scratcher this one, cheers for sticking with me on this one guys!!
    #38
  40. ste8270
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    ste8270 Member

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    [Aug 7, 2006]
    Hi, well i swapped the wheels around, with the front on the back the noise was still there but no steering wheel wobble, after a bit of swapping around i found which wheel it was, got a mechanic to take a look and the wheel is bent, not by loads but enough that the tyre is not sat in its bead properly so the wheel is snaking as i drive!!

    Im just in the process of trying to get a refund on the wheels.

    Thanks for all your help.
    #39

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