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Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by calvin, Dec 22, 2009.
No worries Nick, just say when you want me to pop over and i'll be there.
just out of interest did your last clusters go to 170mph like your current ones or 160mph?
what engine code is yours?
right i think i have sussed it. the post 2000 cars use a radio controlled clock, and have 4 sockets on the back, the pre 2000 have 3 sockets on the back, i think we have fitted post 2000 to pre 2000 on Nicks.
Nick - can you get part number, year of your car and check to see how many connectors, the 4th one is a lot smaller and only has i think 4 pins on it.
Dash out again, pics of the stickers and rear of my new cluster are here (linky)
It IS a '98 cluster, there's a stamped datecode in the plastic that indicates 11-98.
The partcode on the sticker is 8D0 919 930 P and its designated a ver D15 on the other (top) sticker.
There is no fourth connector, only the 3 that I have the plugs for.
I also sussed the clock adjuster, I think I had forgotten to PULL the knob (ahem!) to adjust the time - so thats now not a problem.
Whilst out, I took the back off and checked that nothing was amiss and I dont think this has ever been tampered with at all.
However, I also had another go at the dimmer and I think its a faulty potentiometer - it does sort of adjust - at some stage if someone has a cluster with a working dimmer, I might strip it out and replace it, but that can wait.
That only leaves the radio (still got a clicking in the dash) and the brake pad fault alert.
Thats odd, ETKA shows the dash you have as being the same age as mine but being set in KM instead of Miles.
Something is afoot here !!
well we put the miles back in in KM and it shows in miles, so am happy that this is not a KM cluster!
(still happy to try your cluster for the sake of a couple of courier charges and screw removals...)
Yeh its odd, have you got vagcom handy?
Try recoding the S4 dash to 04462
mileage adjustment is always done in km's regardless.
i can pop over sometime and try that coding, i said before the coding it had looked odd but i thought i'd rather stick with that than change it, i was going to work out what i thought the coding should be, i'll look up the one you have given us Mark.
i have cluster coding codes from rosstech to be a bit wrong on european cars before so i never take it as gospel.
I find the WIKI one to be more correct and sometimes early codes relate to later cars and vice versa. All i have done there is remove brake pad warning from the soft code you had previously used.
My S4 dash prefered to be coded with the later codes despite it being a 98, strange hey !
ok thanks mate, been so long since i've done a4 stuff, it's a bit different to the VW clocks in the golf. things get enabled by other means than the softcode on vw.
I've never seen S4 clocks that look like that! The needles are all wrong, all the S4's I have ever seen have thicker more rounded white needles.
I wonder what could be added/removed by tweaking the dump files on the A4s?
Doesnt seem to be the done thing therefore info sketchy at best
I had not noticed that. Mine are as above
a facelift pic also u.s though
Yours look like they are black and have the needles from a prefacelift A4, but they have the S4 badge and got to 170mph....
one thing i did notice is that the eeproms are very small on the s4 clusters, much smaller than r32 clocks. i would like to takeget dumps of some more s4 clocks and compare them.
mark do you have vagtacho? are you able to get a dump and send it?
I just traced my wiring and think i have mine sussed, Good luck Nick,
That coding should fix your issue if Simon is willing to take a trip up or vice versa
I do yes, will have an attempt tomorrow. I have traced the offending connection i believe so if i remove the wire form the green plug from the CL pump i recon i am good to go. PM me your email addy please so i can send the dump to you. Does it come in a sendable form?
By complete chance, I just remembered that I took the dash out a couple of years ago to try and reseat the DIS connections in an effort to fix the lazy LCD (it only improved things a tiny bit) and... I photographed it all!
Sad, I know, but I've uploaded the pics here (is it just me who is having problems uploading directly from my PC with the forum upgrade?)
Anyway, from the pics I can just make out that the speedo reads to the same (ie 160 plus the extra lines to 170) and can see that my old dash did indeed have white needles. It is date coded 08/98 (new one is 11/98)
Also I can just see that the sticker on it is almost the same code as this new dash but is version is D07. (full code is xDO 919 930K ver D07 - cant read the first character - New one is 8D0 919 930 P and ver D15)
Mysteriouser and mysteriouser!!
I'm with Macca, if we could see an EEPROM dump from Mark's or another S4 cluster of a similar era, we might be able to work this out..
(I have a mate with a late S4 Avant, I'm gonna tap him up to see if I can borrow his dash to decrypt - perhaps we could solve this if it wasnt for those pesky kids!)
So where did the s4 cluster with the red needles come from? Looks like a mod/fix to me.
Its deffo got a grey background, not black, I've just taken another pic which i'll upload in a mo.
As I said, it doesnt look like anyone has ever touched the dash, all the stickers were intact and over the clips etc, so I cant see that someone has had it to bits JUST to change the needles, although I do notice that the rev counter starts below zero.. (so does one of Byzan mark's tho)... not impossible to think its been changed tho.
maybe I have a massively rare, hugely valuable one-off factory option!!!?
Ok so being new to Vagtacho, i read the cluster and saved it, but the file size is minute, is that right?
yes, should be no more than 521bytes according to the dump we took from mine. teeny tiny!
Well FWIW is this what you want?
I disconnected the wire i thought was causing the prob, no good. However with no dash at all alarm works fine.... So will play in day light
cheers that is the file i need mark.
first characters should be 8D0 for all b5 stuff, 8E for B6 etc etc. that last letter is important as they can mean completly different items.
i will look them up on EPC. and have a fish around elsawin.
ok dumps are same size but very different, there are bits that are the same but most of it different, i might do some dumps as i make changes on nicks if he lets me, that way i can then trace back what is being changed.
all fine by me - try away!
(more coffee this time WITH biccies methinks..)
more info, the 930D is obviously correct part for your car. the 930P is from a slighty later car from chassis 8D-X-200001>8D-X-400000, comes from correct engne code though. the saga continues, they swapped them over sometime in 1999.
930K is a pre-facelift dash
930P is a facelift dash
yeah but when did they switch over to just digital clock, i think they had them in b5.5 as well.
yeah checked above is correct, thanks Aragorn.
Marks is a 930K, and he needs a 930P.
Get them swapped!
Oddly, as you say they changed to digital clock some time in 00, but this doesnt seem to reflect as a change in the part numbers?
i did find them in etka 7.2 but started cross referencing at vagcat.com as i haven't all the updates in etka, but weird. must admit i am feeling very tired and have a headache from hell, so can't focus on job in hand as well as normal. it lists the 930P's upto model year 2001 which would be the change over to B6. maybe different countries had different options. anyway as you say the swap over maybe the better option, i don't really want to code stuff out, rather get it right.
looks like we have this nearly cracked anyway, and atleast we got Nick's S4 running which is something.
Blimey, thanks guys - have been looking for my ETKA disks to install and try and work out myself, and asked elsewhere, but you've beaten and bettered me..
(one thing this doesnt explain is the 1998 stamped datecode on the rear plastic, unless they carried on using that into the later clocks.. I need to look inside at the ink-stamped datecode on the back of the LCD panel, maybe I was chasing a false lead there)
For Sale - lovely set of facelift clocks in immaculate and tested condition! (fully working DIS too) (code 930P)
Wanted - Pre-facelift clocks in same condition or better please! (code 930K)
Pssst - Mark - wanna chat?!
i wouldn't jump to say Mark's will definitly fix the issue, but atleast we should have the right hardware then. it might be that if i dumped mark's eeprom into Nick's clocks it may work and that is more or less what the difference is. but is too risky to try as i may end up unable to talk to them afterwards.
oh and i think they were used from late 1998 onwards, as i have an october 98 car and it is one of the very last B5's before the b5.5 started getting produced, don't forget parts sometimes get made a few months in advance as well.
You recon i can pull the dump from my TQS dash and stick it into the S4 one? or physicaly swap the chips?
I so like the look of the white needles and the dark grey Looks ace !!
i would say no, very risky even trying, probably end up bricking them.
as for 903k to 930p, maybe able but still too risky.
Not what i wanted to hear,lol
Maybe pull Nicks eprom, i am willing to risk it on mine, nowt to lose. I have been coding everything i can think of but the alarm still activates. I recoded the CL pump to be sure but no good, deleted all the keys from the pump and only added the one i am using atm.
one of the stupid/daft things i have also noted, is my OE TQS clocks are coded 07742 that should make it an Austrailian 4 cylinder petrol car.. The S4 dash didnt like that coding either
There is a set of clocks for sale on audisrs that are a mix of s4 clocks and rs4 dials. Looks interesting. Would have too see what they look like lit up to see properly.