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Quick turbo question

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by gaz71, Oct 16, 2010.

  1. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    When referring to turbo specs (in the sticky thread A4 KKK Turbo Specs), a compressor and turbine is mentioned.

    Which is which in relation to air intake and exhaust :confused:

    Would I be correct in assuming that the turbine is exhaust side and the compressor is on the air intake side?
    #1
  2. evilscotsman
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    evilscotsman Space Cowboy

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    yep spot on mate.

    Also kinda like being married for years, they're joined by a shaft but separated by a bush :lol:
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2010
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  3. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    Thanks for that.

    How much of a job would it be to get an affair going on between a compressor off a K03-005 and a turbine off a K03-0029? Got my grubby hands on a shiny new 005 and a slightly used 0029 and was wondering whether it would worth them getting together?
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  4. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    for about £430 scroll will do you an sp51x and as most turbo place would want around £70 just to check a turbo let alone replace any worn parts
    #4
  5. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    Have you got a link to their website?
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  6. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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  7. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    What's the Jetex exhaust like as want to do mine but not sure whether to go custom 3" or off the shelf
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2010
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  8. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    i really wouldnt bother trying to combine those two turbos, theres just not enough between them to bother about.
    #8
  9. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    The Jetex seems ok. Not that loud but I'm running stock downpipe and cat so might be a bit throatier with larger downpipe and sports cat/decat.

    Pretty good for the money I'd say but that's just my opinion, others may disagree. It all depends on what your looking for. I wanted to replace the stock with something a little larger without making it sound like a Chav-bucket :eek:)
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  10. SteVR
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    SteVR Member

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    I ve got a K03-73 off a A4 190 sport. Its a rare turbo as I ve not seen another come up for sale, its like a mini k04 but with the improved compressor blades. It has some end play so will probably benifit from a rebuild. Pm me if your interested.
    #10
  11. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    SteVR - PM sent
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  12. jcb
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    jcb Active Member

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    thing is the 005 is limited by its puny turbine and becomes an exhaust restriction at higher revs and the 0029 has a better flowing turbine but still has a puny compressor that becomes a hot air pump above 10psi.

    your "bastard hybrid" might free up some exhaust flow and top end with a decent map but you are still going to suffer some serious charge temps if you try to get tricky with boost levels.
    #12
  13. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    So you reckon that the K03-0073 might be the better option?
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  14. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    how much you paying and how much to get it refreshed verses an off the shelf hybrid
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  15. jcb
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    jcb Active Member

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    no, a GT2871 would be a better option.....
    I think if you are going to go bigger either go up a noticeable size difference, (IMO KO4 is the smallest step to make it worthwhile) or alternatively go much bigger
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  16. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    heres what scroll sent me about 6 months ago although you would have to check current prices, i think now i would always buy a new unit over a second hand one unless you new thw person selling it




    We offer two K04 upgrades for the K03-005, both require a core for the re-profile work. All options consist of new components cast/spun in the UK. The turbine manifold will be reprofiled to the K04 50x42mm shaft for both upgrades. We re-use the turbine manifold and wastegate valve from your donor. All turbochargers leaving our facility endure realtime VSR blueprinting to insure longevity.

    K04-SP51X $650
    K04-SP56R $900

    What are the differences?

    SP51X aka Outlaw is based on a 51mm trim compressor wheel. This may not seem like much but utilizing "extended tip technology" our compressor wheel tip actually exceed the 51mm trim reaching 54mm while retaining the 51mm footprint. (54x39.5x5mm)

    SP56R is more involved, first the standard compressor housing inducer inlet is machined off completely. Using a 65mm alluminum billet we then machine a custom inducer inlet to fit the ridiculous 56x44mm (RS6) compressor wheel then fit the two components and reprofile to the new wheel size. This is a unique product and one you will not find elsewhere for the money.

    These are simple estimates based on other clients successes.

    X=230hp 20psi
    R=280hp 25psi
    #16
  17. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    Sounds good,

    Got a donor unit knocking around (k03-0029), I guess that would do just as well as the 005 unit on the car. Plus would keep me mobile till new one arrived.

    What about fuelling? Obviously I would need a remap, but would I need uprated injectors as well?

    Any ideas about where to get remap? I live in Devon and have the older ECU (non-plug and play).
    #17
  18. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    Possibly injectors as the standard ones max out at about 240bhp I think but some of the more experienced people will confirm this, as for ecu mines the same and I got a superchips one but see who does what in your area and what others have used
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  19. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    I have emailed Scroll to inquire about hybrid options using the k03-0029 as a donor.

    Shall wait with interest for the reply.....
    #19
  20. slappy_dunbar
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    slappy_dunbar Let's Do This

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    An old, weak actuator salvaged off a K03 is not going to be up to the challenge of handling the boost pressures or hp quoted.

    And "guinea pig"? Hrmph. So where again is the data from the testing they've done? :unsure:
    #20
  21. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    Here's the reply from Scroll;


    Hello,

    We offer the K04-SP54X which is capable of 245HP/270fttq this is a bolt on upgrade that doesnt require any additional component other than a quality tuning program or custom tune on a rolling road. Horsepower claims are based on previous client reports, this may be modest as there are many tuning programs depending on your taste.

    I have the K04-SP54X in my Audi A4 1.8t AEB and there is a noticeable gain when compared to the K04-015 most people purchase from KKK direct. In addition all of our hybrids have the revised bearing system with twin-feed journal bearing, high performance 360 thrust system and step-gap piston rings. The K04-015 doesnt have any of these refinements all of which come on the new B/W turbos found on the late generation diesel and the twin turbo Porsche VNT turbo(s).

    Pricing for this unit is $850+Ship.

    If you are looking for more power we offer the K04-SP56R (280hp) or the K04-SP60R (295hp) this turbo build requires significant build time as the machine work is extensive. 56R=$1300>60R=1500+Ship.

    Depending on workload we can normally build & VSR test the K04-SP54X in about 3 days.

    Let me know if this helps,


    No mention of needing a donor unit.

    I think I need to sit down, relax and weigh up the options.

    Of course, if I could find someone to bastardise the new K03-005 I've got lying around holding down paper then I'd be a bit happier :eyebrows:
    #21
  22. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    PS sorry about the font, lol
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  23. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    Guinea pig was meant as he would be the first of us in the uk to try not a statement against the product itself
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  24. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Email turbotechnics or turbo dynamics and see what they can do as a hybrid for the new turbo or the used one you have laying around?
    #24
  25. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Marks running a 51X (or 54x they've mabe renamed it to) and has fitted a 3" maf housing and bigger injectors.

    His ECU is untouched, but the bigger MAF and matching injectors ups the power by around 30-40%.

    You cant really go too far with that "pikey" setup as the ignition timing remains standard, and the boost can become a bit spikey, but it gets things going until you can sort out a proper map.

    My only concern would be if your cars already mapped, as it would add the 30-40% to the mapped figure.

    IE +35% on a 180hp standard ecu is 243hp, which the 51/54x should be able to handle, however if you've remapped it already to 205hp, then the +35% would be trying to make 275hp, and if left to its own devices the ECU would keep requesting boost until the turbo broke.

    I guess the other option would be a manual boost controller of some description along with the MAF/injector swap, but ideally your needing a proper tune.
    #25
  26. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    My car is pushing 14-15psi boost with around 200bhp from a postal remap.

    Obviously I would be looking to get a new program for the ECU to match the turbo and larger injectors.

    I've emailed Turbotechnics to see if they could use the k03-005 I've got spare to create a hybrid.

    Also been looking at Frakenturbo site, seems a good deal (manifold and 3"Maf included for $1099), could be tempted.
    #26
  27. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    Just a thought, what effect would putting a 3" MAF housing and uprating the injectors have on power for my car (with the map I already have)?

    Would there be an issue with overfuelling due to the larger injectors?

    What injectors is Mark running and where could I get hold of a MAF housing?
    #27
  28. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    As i said above, if you fitted a 3" MAF you'd effectively have scaled the fuel map by 35%. The MAF alone would make the engine run lean, as its detecting 35% less air than is actually entering the engine, and due to the way the management system works, the ECU would turn up the boost until it sees what it thinks is the correct airflow entering the engine, resulting in 35% more air than standard.

    By increasing the size of the injectors proportionally, you will end up with a 35% gain in power and the correct amount of fuel so things dont melt.

    This is exactly what mark has done with his stock ECU.

    The problem is, because you've already mapped it, you'll find that the 35% gain is simply too large for the size of the hybrids your talking about. It will still work, but you'll need manual boost control, otherwise the ECU will request more boost than the turbo can safely provide.
    #28

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