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Questions, questions questions....

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by Mucko, Jan 6, 2009.

  1. Mucko
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    Mucko New Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    First post so hello to everyone!
    I currently drive a MKiv golf and am 90% decided on moving to an A3 shortly but am somewhat puzzled by a few things.

    I have the first generation PD engine (AJM). Started life as a 115 then got a remap and after blowing the VNT15 turbo I upgraded to a VNT 17. Been very happy with the running of it for the past years but its time to freshen up.

    Seems that even with current prices the A3 seems to hold its value quite well. I am pretty sure that I would be going for a 2.0TDI 140BHP and would like to spend as close to 8k or under as possible.

    Ive been reading up on the various engine types and am still unsure how the hierachy works and how to identify them...

    • Am I correct in saying there are 3 various 2.0TDI engine types from 03 on? A PD 140 16v and then a Common rail 140 8v and 170 16v from 05-06 on?

    •I know that the 170 has chrome tail pipes but with the 140 do all the second generation 8P (facelift big grill) use the CR engine as opposed to PD or do/did they also use PD?

    •I would intend on getting the car remaped and would like to know the how the CR engine differs from the PD injection when it comes to remapping? Which makes better gains and how is the day to day life with them? I know my PD is noisy. Is the CR much different?

    •When it comes to the clutch. Which would cope with a remap and extra torque better.. The DSG or a standard?

    •Anyone know if the DSG/standard clutch in 170 is stronger?

    I would love to get a 170 but would also rather have a nice trim spec and am not going to get both under 10k. My golf was 180bhp on the dyno last run and would like similar or more. I like the fact 140 falls in lower tax/insurance bracket but if the engine is allot different (8v vs 16v) then I may put the emphasis on saving for a 170 and sorting out the trim myself in time. The trim levels also slightly confuse me..

    Can someone please elaborate on basic level differences for me? I know each can have add ons

    SE - base spec?
    Sport - Front fogs, sport cloth seat?, 17" alloys? slightly stiffer suspenson?
    S-LINE - 18" alloy, stiffer suspension?, Leather sports seats, S-line badge steering wheel and more use of aluminium interior? Bose? Rear Spoiler? Exterior badges.

    I may be completely wrong on allot of this stuff and would appreciate someone to steer me in the right direction so I can get an idea of what I can expect for my cash.

    Thanks! :thumbsup:
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  3. VRStu
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    VRStu Just Looking VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    I don't have time to answer all of your qestions before I go to work but here's a couple of things -

    You won't get a CR for under 10K IMHO, it's quite a new engine. Also remapping is a little new on those and a newer ECU means some expensive equipment for tuners.

    Again, given your budget I don't think you'll be getting a facelifted front model (Larger grille) or a 170 so you're looking at the bottom end of the 140 market.
    #2
  4. leighharris
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    leighharris Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    It's not quite as simple as that. The SE trim is the 'luxuary' trim level with lots of toys as standard - Auto lights/wipers, interior lighting pack etc etc.

    The sport model loses some of the toys, but you get sports suspension, sports seats etc

    The S-Line is the sportier sport model with still not quite as many toys as the SE.

    There's also a base model that comes with next to no equipment.

    That's my understanding anyway! :)
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  5. Mucko
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    Mucko New Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    Thanks for the info
    Well im not totally limited on the budget and usually will spend more than I should to get whats desired so am flexible

    When did the CR engines appear in UK?
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  6. Lee_R
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    Lee_R Active Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    Pretty sure the CR engines are 08 onwards? They are quite new because the tuning companies have only just got round to doing them.

    However I may be talking rubbish! :rolleyes:
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  7. Igdos
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    Igdos Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    Believe the CR engines came in only with the facelifted model so only from about August 08 onwards.
    #6
  8. Staz
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    Staz is a retronaut Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    Yes CR is new to VAG since last year. Before that they used their own version of CR which is the PD. They did it because they had to pay license fees to use the CR principle. There's a lot more about it on Wiki but it's been a while since I read up on it so I may have a few things muddled.

    With the 8P A3 there was originally the 140 PD, then the 170 PD joined it, and now there are new CR versions of both engines. All are 2.0 though.

    There's also a new 1.9 isn't there?

    Dave (H5DJR) is the best man to ask as he's had a few A3 TDIs.
    #7
  9. Mucko
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    Mucko New Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    Yeah wiki gave a 140 8v and 170 16v from 06 onwards though. Doubt I will get anything younger than 05.
    Spent most of day looking various styles up.
    Before the front facelift in 05/06 it seems 03/04/05s there is very little difference in styling between the SE-SPORT-SLINE when looked at from the front.
    The have same bumper and apron and grills. Only difference being fogs on sport and sline and sticker on sline.
    Really not keen on the split grill in pre facelift models and havent seen any good aftermarket big grill conversion kits.

    After the front facelift the exterior differences between SE-SPORT-SLINE are a bit more defined it seems
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  10. Staz
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    Staz is a retronaut Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    There's more info about trim levels in this thread:

    http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/showthread.php?t=64976

    But yes on older cars the exterior differences weren't much unless you paid the extra for the kit. So you had to pay for S-Line but then pay again for the bodykit.
    #9
  11. kaz219
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    kaz219 Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    Hi and welcome

    The DSG clutch are stronger than standard manual clutches- a member on here has his standard running 240bhp/340lb of tourqe :D

    The PD will make pretty much the same noise as your golf but the cabin will be more refined in the A3 compared to the golf.

    And all a3's up to the latest shape (58) use the PD engines.

    And 2003-2005 s lines come with 18 rs6 alloys, lowered suspension, s line sterring and gear knob, black headlining, s-line door sills, s line half/full leathers and exterioir badges.

    For your budget, your going to be getting pre-pre-facelift a 2.0 tdi pd 140 (dsg if you want it).

    HTHs :D
    #10
  12. daveyjp
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    daveyjp Member

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    [Jan 6, 2009]
    The 140 8v was never fitted to the A3 - IIRC it was only used in Skoda Superbs and there were problems with it. All 2.0TDi engines in A3s are 16v.

    You will be lucky to get a 170 for 8k. They were released for late 56/07 reg - first ones are coming up to 2 years old.

    If you can stretch to it find an early 170 they are much more refined than the 140.
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  13. Mucko
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    Mucko New Member

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    [Jan 7, 2009]
    Thanks for that.
    What are the mechanical differences between the 140 and 170 PD then?
    Map, Turbo, Injectors, Intake?
    #12

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