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Prosport Rolling road day results

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by phantom, Jun 28, 2008.

  1. Sundoo

    Sundoo Member

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    Very interesting thread....Isn´t it Aiculedtzu, who has a custom map from Superchips? His car is making 380+ hp and at the moment I think he has the fastest 8P S3 on this site.
    You should all do a QM run and 60 -100 / 120 mph. run to see the difference:icon_thumright: between the cars. Dyno plot is allright if you want to see before/ after gains of mods, but its on the road that matters.
     
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  3. phantom

    phantom On Boost

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    That tells me that the figures for the Std cars are correct.

    p
     
  4. L60N

    L60N Guest

    Exactly. Jamie hit the nail on the head and nipped in the bud this idea of the RR being optimistic.

    And no Staz, not "you would think so" it simply has to be the case... Either the the RR setup is optimistic or pessimistic simple as... :)
     
  5. The911SC

    The911SC Active Member

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    If someone can be bothered to type in the figures into Excel, you would be able to overlay all of the graphs...
     
  6. The911SC

    The911SC Active Member

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    and... why is everyone skiving work and so active on this thread!!!!.. 5 posts in the last few minutes!!!!
    :busted_cop: :laugh::laugh:
     
  7. dipstic

    dipstic Member

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    I have had three trys at adding to this thread and can only say
    "RR are a good day out" to meet other like minded folk :yes:
     
  8. The911SC

    The911SC Active Member

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    I kind of agree... who here has access to VAG com to do some run plots... its not that hard to do, you just need a person to click the mouse when you hit the gas!...
     
  9. Staz

    Staz is a retronaut
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    Or you could be missing the bit of info that Iggu has unearthed about that company that has the better figures. But I'm not going to make accusations.

    If you really believe that the bluefin figures are lower, or even only a little higher than the standard figures than you are more than welcome to try my car (when I'm in the UK that is) with and without.


     
  10. Sundoo

    Sundoo Member

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    I Denmark and Germany the stock S3´s have around 275-285 hp, so yes it has more power from stock. As I can see on the pictures from the rolling day, there isn´t any fan to cool down the cars. This can effect the output of the last cars rolled, cause of the air getting hotter. Another thing I noticed is the dyno graph...why not roll the cars till they hit the rev limiter? It only like 500 rpm more, and why not start at 2000 rpm?
     
  11. dipstic

    dipstic Member

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    In a nutshell
    ALL RR optimistic
    Std cars, Std bhp
    Mapped cars max bhp not as claimed but better torque through rev range
    Odd ill car:ohmy:
    Johnny c car only one that has had additional mods.
     
  12. mitch78

    mitch78 Active Member

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    :thumbsup:
     
  13. The911SC

    The911SC Active Member

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    Lets not turn this into a 'my car is faster than your car' argument... I think these results are interesting. Also, I think the no fan thing would make for worse performance as a car heats up right?..

    Anyway, I am up for ragging Staz' car around for free !!Great offer..:jester:
     
  14. dipstic

    dipstic Member

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    Form a queue after me:p
     
  15. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    Will be next week hopefully - just need to find the right time to throw a sickie !

    One of these 3 things will happen IMO:

    (1) SC will run a RR and hand me a different looking graph accompanied by a lot of technobabble which I don't understand. Which graph you then end up believing will be up to individuals (I'll post the second one as well) - but this will show that RR measurements are VERY subjective and down to all sorts of conditions. One day your car is 250hp but on a different day and on a different RR it could be 320hp.

    (2) SC will say that there was indeed a fault with the map and that it hadn't worked and retune it to deliver the quoted figures. Very unlikely given how differently it drives with it on - been experimenting all week and the difference is like night and day.

    (3) SC will say that my standard S3 is around 250bhp and so 291bhp is the chipped figure. In which case the variation on standard cars is over 50bhp.

    None of them look very likely do they ? Bit of a mystery really.
     
  16. dipstic

    dipstic Member

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    Never worked in sales then :hubbahubba:
     
  17. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    LOL ! Tried it once - when I was 19. Got sacked for being cack. If a customer said "Is it the best on the market?" I'd be liable to say things like "Probably not."
    Does that tell a story ?
     
  18. Staz

    Staz is a retronaut
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    I knew I shouldn't have started on this subject! lol

    I know it doesn't, but also I don't think all the chipping companies would claim to make peak power gains when actually they don't.

    same peak bhp figure + same peak torque earlier = faster car lower in the revs

    I just think you should all take the figures with a pinch of salt with regards to the standard figures. Instead, most of you have taken it as gospel.
     
  19. mitch78

    mitch78 Active Member

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    :thumbsup:
     
  20. jamiekip

    jamiekip Guest

    Hi Staz,

    It's a healthy debate hey! ;)
    I'm not sure anyone is taking them as gospal - everyone knows there is a lot of variance with RR's, same car in different RR's could have huge differences.
    All this RR day demonstrated was that the gains from maps is not as great as everyone was expecting.
    All the standard cars we're showing much greater than stock
    All the mapped cars we're showing lower than what they are promoted at.
    Whether the RR was optimistic or pessimistic, the variance between standard and mapped is much smaller than anyone would have thought.
    For example, on this RR if the results had shown say Phantoms produced 265bhp, Iggu's would still have shown as 260bhp - same situation different numbers!

    I'm sure someone ssaid before, surely these maps are tested by the manufacturers (Superchips, GIAC etc) on the car they are developed for before going to market?
    So they know a stock cars does X and their map delivers Y. A bit misleading to quote the manufacturers figure versus their map figure!
     
  21. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    Except REVO - which showed more. ProSport are agents for REVO ....

    I agree with this - but it a great thread to keep going !
     
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  23. jamiekip

    jamiekip Guest

    The plot thickens........... :)
     
  24. The911SC

    The911SC Active Member

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    Yep, its great; havent got any work done yet!...
     
  25. S3IZZO

    S3IZZO Guest

    My car showed higher peak BHP at Awesome GTI a few months ago against GIAC and APR...Awesome are agents for APR.

    I've become a little tired of this thread now....."I'm out."
     
  26. jamiekip

    jamiekip Guest

    I was only kidding about the whole 'conspiracy' suggestion!
    :sorry:
     
  27. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    No but it LOOKS like you're working doesn't it ?
     
  28. phantom

    phantom On Boost

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    Two rolling road days , but only one result.....fact.

    At Awesome Revo made more BHP , GIAC made more lbft......fact.

    Std cars made roughly 286-296bhp.....fact.

    At Awesome remapped cars made 15-20bhp more than Std cars.....fact.

    Prosport did have a fan......fact.

    Revo made more BHP GIAC made more lbft......fact

    Std cars made 285-294bhp.....fact

    Mapped cars made 15-20bhp more than Std.....fact

    People ( plural ) have voiced opinion on Bluefin over Std in a few threads....fact

    Dyno's can't be optimistic and pessimistic from one run to the next at the drop of a hat.....fact.

    If people want to ignore the facts than thats up to them.


    IGGU , just spoken to Peter at Prosport give him a call to book your car in for a free run on saturday morning if you want. ( he was shoocked that there was even a debate about it )

    p :icon_thumright:
     
  29. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    I wasn't insinuating there was any kind of conspiracy here - more that maybe ProSport are REVO agents because REVO is the best map. The ambiguities of cybertext ....

    That's a very generous offer - but I wouldn't want him thinking I'm off down there with my Mulder and Scully hat on trying to expose some sort of "conspiracy agenda". Just not me. And jamiekip was only kidding - he said so.

    I'm just curious and want to understand more about it.
     
  30. Staz

    Staz is a retronaut
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    Ok well they're not all facts Phantom. Some are results from a machine that uses one figure to predict another.

    I've put across my arguement in a clear, concise and calm manner. If you chose to disregard it that's fine. All I'm saying is take the figures with a pinch of salt, which you are clearly not doing:

     
  31. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    Phantom - tell you what.

    If you know Peter reasonably well how about you put this to him:

    On Saturday morning I pay him a repeat fee of £40 but this time for a "with" Bluefin RR and a "without" Bluefin RR readout (it only takes 15 mins to install it). Then Saturday afternoon I can post ALL 3 of my RRs up here and then all the reasons for the discrepancies suggested in ths thread must then be made clear (time of day, how many cars had been tested before mine, Bluefin is weak, Standard cars are 40hp over VAG, blah blah etc. etc.). That would hopefully put it to bed. I'm happy to do that just to satisfy my curiosity.

    Think he'd go for it ?
     
  32. phantom

    phantom On Boost

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    No mate i know you wasn't , i spoken to Peter about maybe doing a REVO group buy , and mentioned it. his words were " the Bluefin wasn't better than Std , i pulled it ( ran it ) three times , if he wants to come down and run it again on Saturday morning for free tell him to book it in " he wasn't being funny or anything ,he just wants people to be happy with his service thats the type of bloke he his.

    TBH. it might be a good idea anyway , see if the rollers are Kosher ( i know thet are ) coz it may save you a trip to Superchips HQ.

    p
     
  33. Staz

    Staz is a retronaut
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    Sounds like a good plan!
     
  34. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    Phantom - see my post below (crossed with yours I think).

    If he'd go for that we'd have answers !
     
  35. simon-s3

    simon-s3 Member

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    mine went on the RR a few months ago with a Bluefin and was 306 BHP mapped and 262 standard. So I got good gains for the money and it feels like a different car to drive.

    PS I run Shell V-Power
     
  36. EAGLE79

    EAGLE79 Member

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    Gents,

    I am booking in my car at Pro Sport next weekend to have it RR'd. Will see what mine comes out at (standard) and compare that to all your results.

    From what i've read and what i've seen i don't think you can say the RR is out. As previously stated if it was giving out high figures on the Standard cars it would give them on modified cars.... and vice versa.

    I can believe that standard cars are coming out the factories with high outputs then stated. I've had a tear up with my mates bluefin'd S3 and he couldn't get away....

    Also there are many more factors involved than the ECU set up put in at the factory in Germany! So its not a case of the 'robots' putting in pic 'n' mix ECU's! Every engine is different, things bed differently etc etc.

    So anyway i'll go next week and we will see. totally different day, different conditions, different car etc etc. Will post my figures that day!
     
  37. phantom

    phantom On Boost

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    Sorry mate , but your arguement is clearly opinion.

    My argument is factual.

    I'm not gonna let opinion get in the way of the facts.

    It's only in your last two posts that you have mentioned " pinch of salt " before that it was a lot more " no way , can't be correct " feel to your posts.

    I don't see why after three visits to rolling roads i need to add any salt to my car's rolling roaded output.

    p
     
  38. EAGLE79

    EAGLE79 Member

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    Iggu,

    If you wait until the following week fella i'll come over with ya!

    What do ya say??
     
  39. phantom

    phantom On Boost

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    Hiya mate , just spoken to Claire ( Peters wife ) booked you in for this saturrday 5th July 9.30am for your runs, Bluefin on and off , is that ok?

    I'll come down for a noesy as well. :)

    leon
     
  40. The911SC

    The911SC Active Member

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    If i was closer, I would come too. I would love to put mine on the rollers now it is (nearly) run in..
     
  41. EAGLE79

    EAGLE79 Member

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    Phantom,

    Make it the following Sat so i can come, get my car done, see yours on the lower springs and also get to meet a few peeps from here!
     
  42. Iggu

    Iggu Active Member

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    Phantom - that's great. Hopefully we'll get some answers. Maybe this post from SimonS3 will be the answer - some standard cars are down in the low 260s. And if RRs are showing a spread of 262 to 304 for STANDARD cars that is something which prospective S3 owners (not to mention Audi themselves) should be aware of.

    We'll have done a good service to the ASN community then !
     

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