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Project Shed

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by aragorn, Dec 15, 2010.

  1. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    As some of you may know, we'll be needing a second car in a few months time, as the missus uses the TQS every day for work.

    I dont have a huge budget to spend on this, so i was scouring ebay looking for an early A4 quattro, probably a 2.6v6 model, with a limit of £500. Clearly being in no rush i wasnt going to jump in, i was just patiently waiting for the right car at the right price to come along, the only real requirement being that it had to have quattro.

    So last week i'm doing the usual rounds on ebay, and i come across what i've now nicknamed The Shed. Its a 2000 model 1.8TQS Saloon in Metallic Black, and was advertised with "some accident damage" and a siezed engine. The guy wanted too much for it, but after chatting with mark, i decided to pop in an offer of £600, over my budget, but being a newer car and a TQS i decided it was worth that at least, even in its dodgy condition. He accepted my offer, and a few days later i have the sheddiest A4 in the world on my driveway.

    The plan is to spend as little as possible, and get it safe and road legal. Im not bothered about the cosmetics being perfect, although some panels will be changed where required.

    Looking over the car, and viewing the MOT history online, it seems the car was crashed sometime back in 2006, shoddily repaired and driven since then. Starting at the front, the lock carrier has been replaced, the nearside wings bent, and the offside wing has been replaced with a '95 model year one. The facelift bumper had been badly refitted, and the arch liners are mangled. The headlights were flapping around because the proper fixings hadnt been transferred over to the new front panel.

    The engine itself is a sludgemonster, wont turn over on the starter and the turbo is siezed solid. I have some spare parts from the old FWD engine, so the plan is to rebuild the FWD motor, with new parts where necessary and swap it in, although i will need to find a cylinder head unless the one on there is servicable.

    The middle of the car is more or less fine, drivers bolster is worn, both airbags have been deployed and then glued!! back together. Doors seem more or less damage free although the drivers one has dropped, that should be an easy fix.

    The rear ends taken a hit, presumably at the same time in 2006. Rear boot floor is a little crumpled around the bumper mounting on the offside, and the bumper itself is clearly the one that was crashed into, as it has a big split in it, and is hanging off at the sides, held in place by some nice self tappers. Rear lens on the offside is also cracked, and the offside quarter panel is dented above the wheel arch and looks as though its been beaten back out with a hammer.

    Importantly, all the structural bits like the front and rear chassis rails look good.

    So the plan is something like this:

    Sort the engine.
    Fit a pair of facelift wings (i have these already) and sort the trashed arch liners.
    Repaint the bonnet (its badly painted and flaking off, showing the kingfisher blue from underneath)
    Fit front bumper correctly, possibly replacing the brackets if need be.
    Find and fit a new rear bumper, with new brackets if required, and beat the crumpled boot floor with a hammer to straighten it as much as possible.


    Then there will no doubt be the usual service items you'll have when buying any used car, such as brakes, bushes, balljoints etc, although these will be very much replaced on a "only if required" basis.

    Some pics as it stands today (i pulled the bumper off last night):

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Will post some more pics once i get stuck into the engine.
    #1
  2. ScottD3
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    ScottD3 I want your faulty electronics

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    A shed build. Cool. :D

    TQS?
    Turbo Quattro sport?

    Talk to TonyA4, he has some bits left over from his Black Facelift. Most of the bits you need i think as well.

    Good luck and keep the progress coming. :)
    #2
  3. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Ye, our "main" car is a 1.8T Quattro Sport, as is the Shed.

    Tonys car is an avant, so the rear bumper wont fit. Might drop him a mail about the arch liners and other bits n bobs though, cheers.
    #3
  4. mwarrey
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    mwarrey Member

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    Hi, I'm looking forward to following this, I always enjoy following these types of projects.

    Can see you sinking in at least what you paid for it to get it up a running though?
    #4
  5. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    Funny, i was about to go and see that car last week but the crumpled boot floor area did look like it took a hefty shunt and i was wondering IF the 'bags deployed so it was a No-No for me ! I have bought "dogs" in the past but this is the mightest shed i have ever seen in picture ?! I reckon you paid a bit too much mate but there you go... Hope you're turning it to gold though, the Bolero alloys are worth a few hundred notes and you'll get double if you were to break-it !
    #5
  6. ian52
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    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

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    I seen that for sale. I was trying to buy a green avant TQS with the oil sludge issue but still ran for £500 but somebody got in before me.Im sure you could just get an engine and turbo cheap for it and just drive it.
    #6
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  7. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    mwarrey: yer i'd imagine i'll have spent the same again by the time its running maybe even a bit more, but its more or less all money i can get back.

    Adam: That was my thaught, its worth 600 all day long in bits, so even if the shell was scrap i wasnt going to lose out, and the money i put into rebuilding the engine i'll easily see back simply by selling the engine.

    The subframe pickups are all much further forward and the box sections running back are all streight, so i'm not fussed about a crumpled boot floor. The only slight issue is its in effect moved the bumper mounting on the offside, so it might take a bit of fettling to get the bumper sitting right.

    Obviously its never going to make a minter, the quarters all rippled from what looks like a dent thats been beaten out with a hammer. But as long as the cars mechanically sound i'm not bothered.


    Tiny bit of progress today. Drained the coolant, and removed the front panel and the AC compressor/condenser/drier. Compressor is siezed, and the pipes were all busted, so will be going in the skip for some weight saving.

    Everything in the front end looks fine, bar the shoddy paintwork, so i'm happy enough with that end!

    Might see about pulling the rear bumper tomorrow and get a good look at whats underneath.
    #7
  8. tdia4
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    tdia4 TDIPOWARRR

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    Driveway build?
    #8
  9. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Ye kinda.

    I've got a garage, but the Defender is in there. Theres enough room in the garage to do the engine build etc though, which is good. I just need to get the engine out of the car.

    Pulled the rear bumper off today, nothing too surprising underneath really. Certainly nothing that makes me worried. I'll just have to spend some time tweaking the bumper alignment when fitting the replacement, and take a big hammer to the wheel well to make it round again!

    Removed the rest of the AC pipework from the engine bay and decided to stick it all on the scales. Compressor, drier, condenser and the pipes came in at 13.5kgs. Bit less than i expected tbh, but theres still a big bracket to come off the side of the engine which will add a bit more to the total.

    I need to get a long M10 XZN spline tool, so i can remove the cylinder head, but progress has been halted just now due to rain!
    #9
  10. Fraser
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    Fraser Member

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    are you saying you are able to get the original TQS engine running? and then will sell it?
    #10
  11. Foxmeister
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    Foxmeister Fired Up!

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    Like the odd wing repair, some folk just dont give a $hit do they!

    Reckon if you got it looking good enuff you would sell that for whatever you spend on it, still in demand and somebody will buy it when your done!

    By the way, have a rear bumper from a 97 Sport saloon, not sure if its different from facelift but its also red, let me know if you need it.
    #11
  12. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Frazer: i've got a spare bottom end thats in bits, so the plan is to strip the AJL from the quattro and find out whats actually wrong with it, then pick the best bits of what i have to build a replacement motor. I dont plan to sell it. The car will be used as a daily for me, with the long term goal of making it into a track toy once the defender is finished.

    Foxmeister: the whole cars been treated with that attitude mate. No antifreeze in the coolant, no oil changes, badly fitted replacement panels, broken bits not replaced properly.

    Not really sure why, as back in 2006 when it seems it was crashed it must have been worth a decent amount, and would surely have been worth fixing properly.

    Thanks for the offer on the bumper, not really sure what i'm doing with it yet, I kinda fancied fitting an S4 one, but thats kinda getting away from the budget build! How much are you wanting for the bumper, and do you have the side brackets, as mine are busted and different being facelift.

    Did a bit more yesterday, removing parts and wiring from the motor ready to lift it out. Got the turbo off, and the turbine housing is good so thats one nice thing, hopefully i can fit that turbine housing to the turbo i pulled off the old A4 with a broken wastegate and that will give me a good working turbo.

    Some more wiring and pipes need to come off then its onto removing the engine itself. Unforutnately its snowed here last night for the first time this year, so things will be on hold for a bit, although if i get bored today i might go out and remove the pipes and wiring and loosen the bolts so the motors ready to come out.
    #12
  13. Foxmeister
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    Foxmeister Fired Up!

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    Was advertising it at £40 but if you need it for yours just make it £20, includes bumper bar aswell.

    Thought the side brackets didnt differ between facelift and pre for rear bumper???
    #13
  14. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    From what i can tell, the Side brackets are different, just like the front.

    Pre-facelift is quite a simple flat thing, facelift is huge with ribs and webbing?

    I presume you dont have the brackets? i'll try n find out how much they are new.
    #14
  15. Foxmeister
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    Foxmeister Fired Up!

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    I have the pre fitted to my car, but im fitting a facelift s4 rear to mine, so i still have my originals fitted. If they are no use to me i'll have to change mine then.
    #15
  16. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    S4's use the pre-facelift brackets!

    Sent you a PM.
    #16
  17. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    So, another update!

    Decided to brave the cold yesterday and see if i could get the engine out!

    A bit of wrestling with the lower four bolts on the sump finally got i hanging in the crane:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Once i had the motor out, i discovered yet another problem, Broken transmission mounts:

    [​IMG]

    I can only imagine they broke when the car was crashed, it its been driven about like that since then!!!


    Managed to wrestle/drag the engine into the garage, and started stripping the block down.

    Pulled all the external bracketry etc off, then my Ribe bit arrived in the post allowing me to remove the cylinder head. So now i'm sat with a bare short motor.

    It was getting late and i was getting numb, so i left it at that.

    Will take some more pics tomorrow!
    #17
  18. ScottD3
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    ScottD3 I want your faulty electronics

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    Nice progress.
    bet it was fun moving that lift on the ice.

    More please sir.
    really interested in the engine build and well the rest of the project. :D
    #18
  19. rasA4
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    rasA4 Four Rings Mafia Specialist

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    Good on you matey hopefully the damage isnt too bad in the engine
    #19
  20. pjw
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    pjw Member

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    Do you know if the mounts on the 8v turbo engine are generally used throughout the 1.6s and 1.8s?

    Ive got an engine to go in at springtime to replace this gutless 1.6, but not sure if the mounts will cause a problem.


    Hows access for getting the bellhousing bolts out and leaving the gearbox in situ?

    Keep up the good work mate. If you need anything give me a shout, im sure ive got one of the headgasket sockets you could have borrowed but im sure theres two different ones..
    #20
  21. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    8v turbo?

    Afaik, the gearboxes are the same on all models. The 1.8T (or a V6) will bolt streight up to your 1.6 tranny.

    Bellhousing is easy enough to get at, i did the lot without even venturing underneath the car, although some would have probably been easier from underneath, i couldnt be bothered crawling around on the floor.

    If i need tools i tend to buy them, as it means they're in the box for next time.

    Up north visiting folk for christmas just now, so nothing else happening just now.
    #21
  22. GSB1
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    GSB1 Member

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    So I have some perspective when following progress of this project, what might a straight but not cosmetically perfect, but otherwise safe and road legal 2000 model 1.8TQS saloon typically cost?
    #22
  23. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I paid £1200 for mine and had to do some work for the following MOT on a 1999 early facelift.

    Slightly shorter or dented ones have gone for as low as £700 but you are taking more of a chance unless you look first to be sure what you are buying
    #23
  24. ian52
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    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

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    Anywhere between £1500 and £3000 normally i would say but most seem to be about the £2000 mark.
    #24
  25. pjw
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    pjw Member

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    Thanks for the info on the bellhousing. When you do the engine change do you just unplug the engine loom from somewhere then replace it with the new loom?

    Its just a few questions before i venture into getting a 1.8t into mine.
    #25
  26. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    As mark says, he paid £1200, and it needed a front bumper, exhaust, some suspension components and some other bits and bobs if i remember correctly.

    Our Avant, which is cosmetically sound, but was bought with a short MOT and an ABS warning light on the dash cost £1900.

    pjw: the engine harness all plugs in inside the ECU box, and should be more or less a streight swap, if you use a 1.8T harness from a similar age car.
    #26
  27. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Aye on the road with New MOT and Tax was 1800 IIRC, so similar money i spose but i had a known quantity then once i had completed her.
    #27
  28. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    So some pics of the engine insides:

    [​IMG]

    Hardly surprisingly, the crank is fubar. Main bearings 1 and 2 were mangled and 3 wasnt far behind, bigends 1 and 2 had properly disintegrated, with 2 welding itself to the crank, the rest of the bearings looked okish, but not great. So the crank is scrap, as are rods 1 and 2. Rod 3 seems to be binding very tightly on the gudgeon pin, so that needs more investigation.

    I have a full set of pistons/rods and a crank from the AEB i stripped anyway, so no major issue there.

    [​IMG]

    The block itself looks more or less fine. The main bearing caps and journals look fine, with no scoring etc. Similarly the bores are alright, although they will really need measured before we can say for sure if they're streight/round, unfortunately i dont have an internal micrometer, and i have a feeling they're one of those tools that costs a billion pounds and is used once in a blue moon.

    The block IS covered in sludgy-mank, so ideally it needs a bath in degreaser or solvent. Might see if i can find a local engineering shop that can do that for me. I'm also contemplating pulling the core plugs out of both ends of the main oil gallery, and using a pipe cleaner or similar to clean all the **** out to ensure nothing can make its way back into the new bearings!

    Next job is to measure up my spare crank and spare pistons to see if they're still within tolerance for standard size.
    #28
  29. Foxmeister
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    Foxmeister Fired Up!

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    Quick progress, far too cold for me to bother with mine, maybe tomorrow! lol

    You still wanting this bumper for rear???
    #29
  30. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Aye still after the bumper, just need to work out when i can collect.

    I have a mate who lives in denistoun, whos also offered to help paint it, so perhaps we can arrange it to be dropped off at his and i can paypal you the cash?


    I've thaught about it for a bit, and i think i'm going to buy a set of rods for it. The rods are the weak part of the motor, and i dont really fancy mix-and-match old and new ones, but at the same time i dont want to use the four rods from the AEB, as they've done just shy of 200k, and high mileage weak bits arent really what you want to be fitting to an engine.

    I'm going to get the block into a local shop, get them to measure the bores, and if they come out ok i'll get it thoroughly cleaned and honed.

    I will also probably get them to polish the crank journals on the AEB crank, although in the mean time i'm going to get myself a Mic and measure the crank journals and also the pistons to check them for wear. One of the pistons in particular (cyl2) seems really bad, with heavy scoring on the thrust face.

    I've also ordered myself an engine stand, so waiting on that arriving too.

    I might tidy some space on the bench and see about stripping the cylinder head next.
    #30
  31. ian52
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    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

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    How about throwing a 2.0L crank in there while its stripped down? Not exactly sticking to using bits you have but would be interesting to see how cheap it could be done.
    #31
  32. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Just out of budget really, Your talking another £500 or so for pistons, plus a rebore rather than a hone, then theres various clearancing required inside the block to make it work (side of the block and the IM shaft specifically) and then finding the appropriate crank.
    #32
  33. IN 2 Deep
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    IN 2 Deep Hoonigan

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    Kevin, I have an AJL bottom end sat here complete & untouched (140K) I would be willing to swap it for your AEB block and a few quid? As you know this has the 20mm wrist pins etc and is a better stock motor. Lets face it if I ever need a spare block it will require an 83mm rebore and crankcase shaving anyway so doesn't really make any difference to me, I'm holding on to the head though. I also have a scabby facelift A4 front bumper you can have in silver no washer jets though, Its far from perfect but would be fitting for a shed lol.
    #33
  34. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Sent you a PM mate.

    Front Bumper i'm wanting for the Avant, not the shed!
    #34
  35. Foxmeister
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    Foxmeister Fired Up!

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    Small world eh, Dennistoun isnt that far from me, bout 10mins drive.

    Arrange with your mate if you want and let me know when you want it, currently off work till 5th then after that i do shifts so only wkends i would be available.

    Cheers, Mick.
    #35
  36. IN 2 Deep
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    IN 2 Deep Hoonigan

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    Anything to update?
    #36
  37. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Yeh i should probably write up where i'm at shouldnt I!!

    Unfortunately it feels like i've spend a crapton of money and not really got anywhere with it.

    Thanks to Andy (In2Deep) i picked up a servicable bottom end a couple weeks back, however given i want to put rods into it, i decided it would be sensible to put the block into the shop and have it honed and decked, and the crank polished up so i was starting from a good reference point. So the block and crank were dropped into Blackpool Road and Rally, and i'll hopefully get them back some point this week.

    I havent baught any rods yet, mainly becuase i managed to spend the money on lots of other ****.

    I managed to source a new cylinder head (with cams) for much cheapness on ebay, although thats added more question marks, because now i cant decide wether to put the new head on the motor with the old cams/lifters/valvegear, or fit the new cams along with a new set of lifters (which i'd have to buy) along with the old valves and springs. Or perhaps even just put this head on the shelf for a "big" build of some description and get the old head cleaned and refitted. Little while yet to decide that though.

    More ebay hunting turned up a set of brand new Eibach dampers for just over £100, so i "had" to have those, however i need to get some springs ordered up, i had purchased some FK's, however the company refunded me claiming they were out of stock and FK arent making any more or something. Stupidly, i dismantled the rear suspension in expectation of the springs arriving, so yet more bits of the car are detatched and laying around the place.

    I decided to start on the interior, pulling the rear seats and giving them a good scrub in the house, i also jetwashed the boot carpet, and removed the CD changer and boot side panel (weight saving, gonna fit a PFL side panel by swapping it with my brothers). The seats have come up pretty nice. I also pulled the rear speakers when i was working in the area, as i dont like shelf speakers when i'll be fitting a sub in the boot.

    Removed the front seats and gave a whole car a hoover so the interior is slowly getting there. I need to clean the carpets though as they're properly hanging, so i'll do that before i refit the front seats (which i've not got round to cleaning yet).

    I've also picked up some prefaclift S4 HID's, so they'll be going in when it goes back together.

    Still done nothing with the bumper i baught from Foxmeister as its up in Glasgow, need to pick it up next time i'm up north.

    Not really got any photos of anything either, because nothings really finished, so all in all a bit boring really.

    I'll try to get the carpets and seats cleaned this weekend so i can tick some things off as finished, and get some photos taken of the various parts in their various stages of disarray!
    #37
  38. IN 2 Deep
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    IN 2 Deep Hoonigan

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    Good work, at least its progressing towards the light. I know how it feels to chuck money at it and feel like your not getting anywhere, modifying these A4's really is a slippery slope, just try and resist the urge to build a monster, it can quite easily drain your accounts! All I can say is stick with it, its all worth it in the end dude, I know the boys down at Bpool road & rally will sort things out for you, good bunch of guys down there. :thumbsup:
    #38
  39. Foxmeister
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    Foxmeister Fired Up!

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    As said, at least things are moving all be it slowly, all projects end up like that.

    As for engine, if its only gonna be a smoker to run around in, id keep the head rebuild limited to DIY if thats what you plan, unless i think you mentioned at the start to maybe track it, if thats the case then do the head to match the bottom, keep it reliable! It'll end up always goin over wotever you budget at start, my paint job was only to fit the new bodywork and £2-400, ended up into 4 figures at the moment! Doh!
    #39
  40. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Yeh i certainly dont want to get into buying all new valves for the head, but stretching to a set of lifters and using the new head and new cams is one way to go. Whats in the back of my mind is i was planning on building a motor for the other car at some point down the line, so maybe i should keep the new head for that instead.

    I think my aim is to end up with a car thats mechanically sorted. I'm not arsed about the bodywork, so long as its sturcturally sound and solid. So i dont really want to cut corners with the mechanicals, as it'll just annoy me and i'll end up wanting to redo it later on!

    That reminds me i need to sort you out with the money for that bumper bar!
    #40

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