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Prawn and BigAls A3 Track Car

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by Prawn, Dec 29, 2010.

  1. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    Be a shame if they don't do it :( was far more interesting than the fag strip!
  2. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    You won't be saying that when you re-shell to an S3.... :p

    <tuffty/>
    Jason.s and superkarl like this.
  3. 16Klappe
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    16Klappe Princess Clap.

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    Never.

    It won't ever happen.

    Prawn will NEVER let the S170 saga end, not even for a fake four wheel drive system. Anybody who thinks he will doesn't know him, he is just fishing.
  4. Sam_
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    Sam_ Down under

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    Totally. Someone needs to do a proper emptied out S3, bare bones style. I've done the suspension but unfortunately like my creature comforts for the daily hack. No AC in 40-45° days would be horrid.
  5. Sam_
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    Sam_ Down under

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    He's already ditched the fake turbo....
    Jason.s likes this.
  6. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    mines been fitted since end of 2007... ;)
  7. Neru
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    Neru Member

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    Can you launch it in first?
  8. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    One day IF it ever happens i`ll quite happily remind you of this :p

  9. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    I love S170, its what put A3's on the track car map, and its been doing its thing against the 4wd mob admirably for years and will continue to do so.

    If I'm forced for any reason to reshell, then it'll be into a 4wd shell with ME7.5, but we'll cross that hurdle when we come to it :)

    this week I've ordered new drop links whilst its all up in the air and I've got some powerflex. 22mm arb bushes to go on.

    Ive also got tufftys old ths engine mounts which I'm filling with some 85A poly resin, and a set of the new powerflex Black Series dog bone bushes for both ends of the dog bone, so hopefully engine location should soon be ULTRA positive.

    Thatll all go in with the newly rebuilt box from Ben this weekend, then, hopefully next week ill have a other small surprise to add as well :)
  10. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    ohhhhh surprises :)
  11. Jay A3
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    Jay A3 More power

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    What a tease!
  12. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2013]
    There's got to be a time where you get fed up of gearboxes/cv joints/diffs that 4wd will become a well considered option.

    Anyway look forward to the secrets and I was wondering why the sale of tufftys old mounts was a bit quiet! Lol
  13. mk1chopper
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    mk1chopper Missing the S3

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    [Apr 25, 2013]
    If you ever go down the 4wd route you should go rallying with it.
  14. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 25, 2013]
    Oi, enough 4wd loving in my thread, its an if an when topic, that's a long way off :)

    I've got several sets of btcc and wtcc slicks to try out first :) very excited about seeing how they perform!

    Just itching to get stuck into it again now. Want to be driving it again :)
  15. s33nyboy12
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    s33nyboy12 Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    Just out of interest prawny , how much did the slicks set you back ? Pm me if you want and don't mind me asking ;-)

    Sean
  16. ReDBull
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    ReDBull Member

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    How easy where the caster shims to fit on the rears?
  17. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    Will PM you in a mo Sean :)

    Really easy actually Paul, Traditionally you need to remove the rear hubs using a puller, and the bearings fall out and need replacing, but eibach have made a special ultra thin drop headed spanner which actually lets you get in behind the hub without removing it, so you can undo all the bolts, fit the shims, and refit the stub axle without pulling the hubs.

    Took about 45 mins per side, including messing around with washers and shims to get the rear brakes to run true again. As the camber /toe is changed on the stub axle, and the carriers for the brakes mount to the beam, the shims throw the rear brakes off line.
    s33nyboy12 likes this.
  18. Vorshprungdork
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    Vorshprungdork Active Member

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    OK, I have to admit I know less about motorsport than I would like but it strikes me that the problems you are having with your gearboxes are mainly die to teh higher heat generated causing the oil to break down and ultimately the box to fail. Better oil is a good option but what about a transmission oil cooler? I did a quick Google and thay seem to be available, bo idea of price though but may be worth looking into for additional future proofing.
  19. Scullies
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    Scullies Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    JudderMan likes this.
  20. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    Funny you should mention that, Dad said exactly the same thing last week!

    I think if I'm honest, part of the issues we've been having with transmission have been cost related, having already shelled out a lot of money to get the diff in the first place, we've often for the cheapest solution to get the car back on the road, and none of the boxes have had a full refresh in the past, it's always been a case of ''it looks good'' so it's gone back together.

    When I told the chap at Opie Oils that I'd been using standard motorfactors gearbox oil in this application he practically laughed off his chair, and said exactly what you have just said.

    Higher temps generated, causing **** oil to break down, and very quickly the box loses it's lubrication, diff bearings suffer the most being right at the main source of heat, then when the diff bearings break down the diff can drop, and the bolt heads catch on the casing and BOOM
    Vorshprungdork likes this.
  21. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    So, after a cracking week away, it was time to get a bit more done :)

    I didn't fancy getting stuck into fitting the gearbox this evening, so decided to get on with my engine mount plans.

    I realised a while back that I needed new engine mounts, but really didn't fancy investing big money in a set of Vibratechnics ones, so decided to try and make something that should be similarly stiff.

    I decided to try filling the OE mounts with a 2 part Poly resin, an idea first discussed with RobinJI back at Christmas.

    I did some research, and found that most poly bushes are typically between 70-85A Shore hardness. I did some ebay scanning and came across this 2 part poly resin kit for an 85A poly:

    Polytek Poly PT Flex 85 Fast Cure - Shore A85 Polyurethane Rubber - 1kg | eBay


    Start off with 2 perfectly servicable THS FR3 uprated engine mounts, purchased from Tuffty:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The THS mounts are a stock casting, using a slightly harder rubber. To make the new mounts as stiff as possible, I wanted to put some holes through that rubber to allow the poly to get in and around everything nicely.

    Gearbox side mount seems to be a solid rubber block under the mount, so I voided this as best I could:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Then the drivers side mount, this mount seems to have a large void under the mount, that may or may not at some time have been fluid filled. Either way, when I drilled into this, it was full of air only.

    I voided this side as much as possible also to allow the poly to get all around the existing rubber:

    [​IMG]

    I also removed the bottom cover of the voided section and broke away a few bits of the casting to allow me to pull more of the rubber out, the last thing I wanted was this chamber forming an air trap in my new poly.

    [​IMG]

    With that done, I masked up the backs of the mounts, and got mixing with the poly resin and poured it in.

    I was very careful to pour it in really slowly, and move the mounts around to ensure the resin got EVERYWHERE with no air voids at all, I also poked it repeatedly with a bike spoke to make sure there were no air pockets.

    30 minutes later it was all rock hard, so I unmasked it, and here are the results!

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And then to firm up the dog bone, I've invested in some of the new Powerflex Black Series 95A dog bone bush mounts too :)

    [​IMG]

    And some new drop links, for good measure:

    [​IMG]
  22. Dani_B19
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    Dani_B19 Audi-sports own special child.

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    Vwry good matey, need to really do mine lol. Why has the engine mount bracket thing come out of the mount if that makes sense?
  23. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    Because they just pull out by hand :)

    Everyone always seems to worry about that bit, but they actually just pull straight out. It was in the way of me pouring the resin in easily, so I removed it and plugged the hole for the casting.
  24. s3dave
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    s3dave TFSI Hybrid

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  25. Dani_B19
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    Dani_B19 Audi-sports own special child.

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    Wtf, really, surely that cant be right lol. Ill check mine tomorrow. Im abit worries about drilling the mount rubebra out though, i tend to get carried away haha.
  26. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 26, 2013]
    It's just a pin, locating into a socket Dani, once fitted there is no possible way it can go anywhere because the way it pulls out is into the engine block. It just hangs the engine :)

    they all pull out, even brand new oem ones.
  27. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 27, 2013]
    Argh.

    Busy day, no progress on the car at all!

    Plans changed with a phone call late last night, and after a few weeks of searching, we were on our way this morning to look at another Lupo for Tori.

    by 2pm, after a 160 mile round trip through sun and rain, we were back at home with this little beauty:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    1.4 16v, 75bhp, never wanted for anything and is absolutely immaculate. Tori loves it, it's taken us a while to find the right car, but was definitely worth delaying my gearbox install another day to go and pick this up :)

    Then a mate popped over with an LCR in need of a look over, and now I'm off to see mr Ponting and have a play in his LPG S4 that has recently been 'beach buggy fixed' :)

    Happy days
  28. s33nyboy12
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    s33nyboy12 Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 27, 2013]
    Cough cough 1.8 20v t install cough cough
  29. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 27, 2013]
    Now THAT would be a whole load of fun!

    To be honest, just 75bhp from the 1.4 16v feels nippy enough in something so tiny, and it cruises down the motorway at 80mph at just over 3k rpm, feels way more refined than the 6N polo it's replacing. I love it already, perfect little town car for Tori :)

    Will be attacking the A3 in full tomorrow now, hoping to get the gearbox in, new poly'd engine mounts fitted, powerflex black dog bone mounts, new ARB bushes, and new drop links all done tomorrow. Just want to be driving it again now
  30. Scullies
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    Scullies Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 27, 2013]
    That looks like half a vw polo :laugh:
    I bet it would be pretty light if it were to be stripped for track with a 1.8 ko4 setup :racer:
  31. 16Klappe
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    16Klappe Princess Clap.

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    [Apr 27, 2013]
    I haven't seen a car so desperate for a set of wheels in a long time.

    Put the BBS's off Tabitha on it?
  32. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 28, 2013]
    Gearbox is finally hung off the engine again :)

    Now to connect everything up, change engine mounts and ARB stuff, and hopefully test drive this evening.
  33. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 28, 2013]
    Running.

    [​IMG]

    Happy.

    Got all the engine and box mounts done, and the ARB bushes and drop link on one side, then decided it was getting too late and I was hungry, so now I'm off out for dinner.

    Will update properly later on :)
    s3dave likes this.
  34. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 29, 2013]
    ARB bushes and new drop links on, and it's finally on it's wheels again after about a month of deadness.

    Time for a test drive, wish me luck!
    superkarl likes this.
  35. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Apr 29, 2013]
    Gl dude... :D

    <tuffty/>
  36. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 29, 2013]
    Yes.

    Yes yes yes yes, yes yes yes.

    It is done.

    It is good.

    I always forget quite how fast it is, every time its off the road, then the first time I go up through the gears on full boost, it scares the living sh*t out of me :laugh:
    Vex182, rhubarb4, Scullies and 3 others like this.
  37. Paradox1
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    Paradox1 Active Member

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    [Apr 29, 2013]

    SOLD :racer:
    Prawn likes this.
  38. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 29, 2013]
    So, jumping back in a time a little....

    Before I fitted the box, Dan had asked me to take my TIP off and inspect my turbo whilst access was easy, so I obliged:

    [​IMG]

    Very happy to report, that after 4500 very hard miles, and a few hard trackdays, there is absolutely no movement in the bearings what so ever, the thrust is perfect, and side to side play is as tiny and minimal as any brand new turbo I've ever felt, which is to be expected given it's been dry for a month. Very happy with how it's doing indeed, the last unit, despite running at 5psi and 50bhp less was in a really bad state after this mileage. So top job from Beach Buggy Turbos once again :)

    With that done and checked, it was time to get the box in. I wasn't feeling overly strong, so got the lifting beam out and hoisted it up into place rather than man handle it in like I've done previously:

    [​IMG]

    Gearbox number EIGHT in it's new home:

    [​IMG]

    A quick comparison of the engine mounts, old (tiger seal filled) and new (85A Poly filled)

    [​IMG]

    Nasty tiger seal ****:

    [​IMG]

    Smart poly resin:

    [​IMG]

    And the engine side mount also:

    [​IMG]

    With everything hooked up, it was time to fill it up:

    [​IMG]

    And the last job, whilst it was up on stands, was to fit new powerflex 22mm arb bushes, and new drop links:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    So that's that, ready to turn the key!

    [​IMG]

    Success! It lived.

    I took it out for a test drive this morning, and it feels absolutely fantastic. Everything is better. The gearbox feels tight and sharp, it goes into gear much better than the last one, smoother and quicker too, and the change feels positive.

    The engine mounts do cause a fair old vibration at idle, but as soon as you've moving it's gone totally, and not at all annoying given how bare the rest of the car is.

    Once rolling, there is noticably less engine movement from inside the cabin, you don't feel the engine move as you come on and off the power now, it just feels very direct and connected. Gear changes feel great, and it seems to put the power down better with the engine not trying to jump off it's mounts.

    Wheelspin is also better managed, with a more smooth spin up of the wheels rather than the evil wheel hop which feels like everything is going to die.

    I even found the time to take a few pictures of the old shed!

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2013
  39. MIGGZ
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    MIGGZ nanananananananan BATMAN

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    [Apr 29, 2013]
    Good work there Mr Prawny, please let me know how the new oil works out, might consider it for mine and ashley's
  40. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Apr 29, 2013]
    Will do dude!

    First impressions are it's probably hard to say how good it is!

    Shifting feels great, it goes into gear easily and smoothly, the the transmission isn't loud at all despite the near solid mounting. It was easy from the off, but got noticably more silky when it warmed up a touch.

    How much of this is down to the new trans fluid, and how much is down to finally having a decent gearbox I do not know, but for the minute it feels bloody wonderful.

    I'm still grinning about how quick it is too :) always takes me by surprise after not driving it for a month.

    At some point this summer I'll try and book another play day with Mr. Gower and head up to R-tech for a few more tweaks, the boost profile could do with some tweaking to avoid surge at full boost on track, and I reckon it could happily swallow up a few more psi at the top end, but I'd still really like to create some sort of inlet manifold for it before heading back up.

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