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Prawn and BigAls A3 Track Car

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by Prawn, Dec 29, 2010.

  1. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    How much caster are you running currently?
  2. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    I'm not sure to be honest Jason! Whatever standard s3/ Lcr castor is, with the camber adjustment pulled right out.
  3. superkarl
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    superkarl MAN OF STEEL

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    im failing to see how those bushes can give you more or less castor.
    all i can imagine, is by having the hole slightly to the left like in that pic above, you will then have more toe in. but then the front bush on that arm won't be in the subframe square if the rear of the arm is sat more outward.

    id personally just rely on topmounts for more castor and camber adjustment
  4. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    They give more castor Karl, they won't give toe in at all. If anything they would actually give a fraction of toe out.

    By offsetting the rear bush like that, you push the ball joint forward, which increases castor.
  5. Sam_
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    Sam_ Down under

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    I think you mean static camber right? I'm pretty sure castor is, or certainly contributes pretty highly to, dynamic camber?
  6. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    Definitely mean castor Sam :) when I say 'static' what I mean is non adjustable. Fixed by the wishbones so to speak, then any fine adjustment can be done at the top mount.

    I see what you mean about castor giving 'dynamic camber' though, that makes sense.
  7. Oke Phill
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    Oke Phill Member

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    Prawn loving this thread!! I love how its been stripped and caged, this is making me want to do this to my car now!!! You are a bad man.lol
  8. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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  9. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    Last edited: Jun 18, 2012
  10. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Yeah thats just the main page. Part number is W53189. Adds 0.75+ so it says but its 69quid for the kit!
  11. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    Thanks chaps, that whiteline kit looks very similar to the superpro kits I've seen.

    Oddly, there seem to be two kits, one for Non R models so to speak, A3 / Lc / Golf, and one kit for the S3 / R32 / TT225/LCR.

    This confuses me a bit, as the bushes fit either, so I don't know why there are two kits. Different designed too.

    The cheaper kit uses a round bush with a metal crush tube with an offset hole in it. The more expensive R32 kit uses a circular crush tube with central hole, and the offset is in the poly bush itself.

    Not sure which is better....
  12. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    Solid subframe bushes arrived :)

    [​IMG]

    Massive thanks to Eddie at WOT Motorsport for these, I didn't start asking questions until Saturday, paid for them on a Sunday via paypal, and had them on my doorstep at 9am Tuesday. Can't ask for better service than that!

    Just waiting on a few emails back from a few people about bushes now!

    A bit annoying that I've got to do all this right now, as I hadn't planned it for a few months yet, but I found a bit of a play in a track rod end at the weekend, so it's all got to be done at the same time, then top mounts can wait a bit longer.
  13. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    You lot are **** these days, why is the forum so dead at the moment? It's not as if you're all out in the sun :(

    Meh. Oh well, I fitted the solid subframe mounts today, not a bad job at all.

    Jacked car up, supported on stands on the chassis rails to allow me to lower the subframe:

    [​IMG]

    Knocked the old bushes out with a hammer and punch, one came out with just a few taps, one took about 15 minutes of mashing the rubber a bit before it'd pop out.

    Old rubber bush compared to 034 Solid mount:

    [​IMG]

    Offered into place on the subframe:

    [​IMG]

    Now, being a tolerance fit, to keep the subby ultra secure, these don't just press in by hand. I'm sure you could just put the subframe bolts through and crank it up to the car, and the mounts would pull in, but I didn't want to take any chances, so I used a nut and bolt with washers to pull the mounts tight into the subframe first:

    [​IMG]

    Once the bolt was dead tight, and I was happy the bushes were seated correctly in the frame, I removed the small nut / bolt, and fitted the subframe bolts again:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And that's about it!

    Also, I wasn't happy with the outlet from my catch can either, it was slightly kinked in it's routing, and I still want to get a better catch can in the near future so don't want to spend any more sorting this setup.

    I found a bit of my old ko3 heater line, 19mm like the breathers, and used this to bridge the gap over the TIP before the tail goes out under the car, looks much neater now:

    [​IMG]

    Also, thanks to some absolutely horrific weather like this:

    [​IMG]

    Work has been cancelled for the weekend! So at rather short notice, I'll be at GTI International on Sunday :)

    See you all there!
  14. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Looks like a nice easy job eventhough it sounds like it should be a pain! Have you ever had it aligned since fitting all the LCR stuff and other work? Take it you`re just going to wait until you get the top mounts and maybe the caster bushes before getting it properly set up?
  15. Dane
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    Dane Faster than a V12 Q7

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    Nice work prawny, I have a spare stand pass for Sunday If you want it :)
  16. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    Sort of yea, I've had the tracking done. I centralised the subframe as best I could to the mounts, and pulled it was far forward as possible to give as much castor as it can give. On the camber adjustment slots on the LCR withbones I pulled the ball joints out as far as they'd go, which gave me about 1.7-1.8 degrees negative I think, then I had the tracking done with about 10 minutes Toe out.

    I'm told you can elongate the slots on the LCR wishbones to give slightly more camber, so when I remove the arms to fit the new bushes I'll look into that, and use my calipers to make sure they are all elongated by exactly the same amount, then fit the castor bushes and have the tracking done again, and that'll be it handling wise for this year.

    Then, at the end of the year, once the new engine is in, i'll get some GC topmounts to allow me to fine tune the geo even further :)

    Thanks buddy, but Aaron has already saved me a pass on the COV stand just incase work cancelled, which they did!

    I think the ASN stand will be huge anyway, so I'll go and keep the numbers up for COV :)
  17. HEKTOR
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    HEKTOR Member

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    Looking good! Nice comparison picture between old OEM bush and 034 mount.
  18. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    Thanks Eddie, I was amazed how quickly they arrived!

    So, test drive done. Very happy.

    I'm not going to be a goon and say the car is transformed, it's only two bushes,! However, there is definitely a more positive feel to the steering, it feels very sharp and pointy, you can also feel a bit more through the floor. Not instrusive at all, just feels more connected. I can't imagine how good it's going to feel when it's all poly bushed!

    My clunk has also gone, so all in all I'm very happy. I think subframe bushes are probably overlooked by just about everyone. I know my car is ultra high mileage and has had a very tough life, but the bushes that came out were in a horrible state.
  19. HEKTOR
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    HEKTOR Member

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    I dont like skimping on the shipping. The less time it spends in the post the less chance there is for damage/loss plus fast delivery helps you guys get on with fitting :)

    Glad you are happy with everything and that you notice the difference.

    I agree the difference is subtle but you do notice the front end feeling a little more connected, sharper and a slight amount of extra feel through the floor. Good to know that the mounts have sorted the knocking/clunking as well. Its good that it is not that difficult to fit them either.

    Your car is going to be so sweet when you are finished, poly bushes and GC top mounts are going to finish everything off nicely.

    Yeah your bushes do look pretty bad compared with the ones we took off the r32, mind you the r32 has only done 65k of hard miles and certainly not as hard as the miles your car has done lol
  20. Reesy
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    Reesy Well-Known Member

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    Nice work as usual. You going to be sprinting at inters mate?
  21. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    I'm going to have ago on the strip reesy yes mate!

    Straight lines arnt really my thing, but I'll tthrow some mmedium compound yokos on the front and are what happens!

    Just been out in the semi damp on road tyres testing a few launches. No idea on quarters, but i
    seem to be able to consistently get 0-100 in aroud 13s dead, most people doing low 14's seem to be under 100mph, so who knows how it'll go!
  22. Reesy
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    Reesy Well-Known Member

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    Sounds impressive. Can I tag along for one mate?
  23. superkarl
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    superkarl MAN OF STEEL

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    cheeky fkn yut
    you in your hotel yet gay boy?

    prawn there is a handling track at inters is there not?
    go and embarrass everyone!
  24. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    is there really? that'd be amazing! I thought there was only a sprint as that's all anyone ever talks about!

    Perhaps I should take a full set of Semi Slicks.....
  25. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    You'll be in the 13s easy! You should try a decent rwyb day just once. Just to see what it can do. If you enjoy the sprint on a crappy runway this weekend you should try pod/shakey once in your life time. If you say traction on the road is fine due to smooth mapping you should be pretty swift on the timing.
  26. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. A quick google suggests that there have been arguments in the past about whether you can use track day road legal tyres on the handling course or not.....

    Anyone know the score this year? Car feels rubbish on road rubber in comparison to the good stuff!
  27. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    Back from Gti International, what a great day, made so sad by a terrible end.

    Towards the end of the afternoon an accident occured involing a Leon losing control and going throught the barriers at speed and into the watching croud injuring several people.

    I won't speculate more about what happened, but wish all those involved a speedy recovery, and hope meaures are taken to stop something like that ever happening again.

    I did 4 runs on the strip, and I'll be honest, I was AWFUL at it.

    First run, against a mk1 golf 20vt, beat that, although absolutely LOADS of wheelspin in 1st, and second, and 3rd, complete fail. 14.75s

    Second run, against a totally standard mk4 golf, beat that obviously, and a much better launch, but still far too much wheelspin in 1st and second
    14.219s

    Third run, against a big turbo Ibiza Tdi with about 250bhp / 6 million lbft

    Got an OK start, then missed second some how :( the soot chucker got ahead :( finally got second, and was reeling him in, but it was too late, he beat me to the line :( massive shame on me. Beaten by a tdi :(
    14.41s

    Fourth run, against a stage 2 golf ED30 I think it was, sadly it started raining in the que and it was slightly damp, I felt I got my best start, but being wet it wasn't enough. Not sure who won that one, was pretty dead level the whole way down.
    14.35s

    [​IMG]

    So, we established that I am **** at drag racing, but I'm not fussed, because if I'm honest, I found it pretty boring. The best bit by far was the corner at the far end of the strip!

    So, sodd that, onto the handling course!

    This was MUCH more my cup of tea!

    Chatting to the bloke running it before having a go, he was telling me that they had managed sub 40s in their own golf race car the day before, but very few of the public got below 40s ever.

    I went out for a few sighting laps, then did a timed run. First run, 40.1, DAMN, so close to the covetted 'sub 40'

    Lined up, and had another crack at it.

    Flat out on the second run, a lot more aggressive than before, went really well, and the final time was 39.8, but I clipped one cone, so got a 1s penalty and recorded 40.8.

    Bugger.

    A bit of queing, then another try. Absolutely went for it, first lap went great, second lap was going well right up until the second to last corner, where I got a bit over excited and out braked myself and understeered my way into the last corner, lost a shed load of time, but kept it planted to the finish.

    39.61 seconds, no cones hit. RESULT!

    In car clip here:

    GTI International Handling Course - Audi A3 1.8T - YouTube

    Clip from Si Worker here:

    http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss214/nomis_worker/a1ed7c12.mp4

    And Niki put a video on facebook but I don't think I can link that to here!

    Absolutely cracking fun, and I went back later on to have another go, only to find that the FMX boys had moved a trailler, and the track had been changed to suit, so no more competetive times were being recorded. Such a shame, as ai really felt I could improve by a fair bit on my 39.61.

    Went into the Eibach stand to look at others times, and to my surprise, I found I'd been the 3rd fastest of the whole weekend! absolutely over the moon with that :) and SO pleased with how well the car had performed. Definitely confirmed that it's all about the corners for me :)

    After that I took Reesy out for a few fun laps, messing around mostly, pulling the handbrake, sliding everywhere, and just generally gooning around. Still 39s on the slightly altered course (Just one apex moved 1m from the last), but a bit more lairy than the proper timed laps :)

    Absolutely awesome day out, massive thanks to everyone who made it a great success, Aaron for his awesome COV stand and supplies, everyone from Audisport, and the incredible turn out for the Secret Seat Society who dwarfed every other club stand there!

    Top day, but I think it's safe to say our thoughts are with all those involved in the accident.
  28. s3dave
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    s3dave TFSI Hybrid

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    Nice to see you again and the infamous prawn-mobile.....:icon_thumright:

    And DITTO on the accident...:(
  29. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Jesus never seen a handling course so tight! Thought it'd mostly be like the autox tracks and sprint track at totb.
  30. Hammy999
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    Hammy999 Member

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    That's some really good driving there well done.

    Hope everyone from the accident is doing O.K
  31. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
  32. Dane
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    Dane Faster than a V12 Q7

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    Well done prawny, vids funny though,
    yeah?
    yeah.
    yeah?
    Yeah! Lol
  33. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    haha, can you hear him replying on the vid?

    I couldn't hear him at all! and being light gates it was just a case of go when you wanted, and I wanted to be sure i wasnt going to get bollocked for going early :p

    loved that handling course so much, I didn't expect it to go so well being so twisty and entirely 1st gear, but the car seemed to absolutely love it.

    Bloody hard work on the steering though, nearly pulled my arms out a few times!
  34. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Glad you have a quick rack now haha
  35. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    oh god yea, it'd have been an absolute killer on parts of the course, at the very top end, i think it was full lock right follwed by full left, then full right again! the second half of the course was might tighter than the first.

    Had a bit of a strange feeling at points where the steering seemed to go solid and required a lot of effort to pull over, but I think that was down to me being flat out at near on full lock with constant wheelspin for the whole lap!
  36. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    I fancied a run on high boost just for a laugh, but didn't get time due to another stupid FMX show that nobody cared about!
  37. HEKTOR
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    HEKTOR Member

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  38. Neru
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    Neru Member

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    do you use electronic boost controller? Im planning on using a high low switch as well.....aim is to hit high 12's for drag

    seeing your times doesnt give me hope :(
  39. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Sticky tyres, enough of a pressure drop to make the sidewalls sqidge down so you cant see any tread looking face on (although harder on the likes of a 888 due to thick sidewall). Plus just get Rtech to map in flatshift and launch control for a laugh lol. I ran road tyres at about 20psi which made T1R`s sqidge down just enough but they have quite soft sidewalls and that was only running standard power. Just have to try different rpm launches too. Again on standard power i would launch at about 3.5-4k, possible go a little less on current figures.
  40. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    I just have a switch on the N75 mate, N75 off is actuator pressure, around 14psi and 275bhp. N75 on is the mapped boost from the N75, although it's still low boost and gives about 295bhp currently.

    No need to is disappointed about the time and the potential of yours, I don't do launches, they break things, and I've said for years that I don't like drag racing, but I'll try anything once.

    My suspicions were confirmed, I don't like it, and I'm no good at it! For me, corners are where you prove your skill, not in straight lines.

    One thing worth noting though, whilst the 4wd boys had no problems (obviously), every single person I spoke to who'd run at pod and inters said that the airfield surface at Inters is terrible and has no grip. most people reported being around 1s slower at Inters than they are at Pod. guys running 14.0 at pod were seeing 14.8-15 at inters, and guys running 14.5's at pod were seeing 15.2-15.5 yesterday, and they all complained, so I'd be confident I could do a mid-high 13 as the car is now, with more to come when it's mapped to it's full potential :)

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