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Pipe dream - owning a b7 rs4

Discussion in 'RS4 Forum (B5 and B7 Chassis)' started by jdas03, Nov 20, 2012.

  1. jdas03
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    jdas03 Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Hi,

    had an 8l s3 up until march this year when I decided to get an abarth 500.
    I am missing the power of the s3 and initially thought about getting an 8 p s3 when I'm 25 next march.
    After research I have seen you can pick up a b7 RS4 for around 20k!
    iam now considering RS4 as toy car and some 1k shed as commuter car.

    i have seen this question asked a fair bit but wanted to get a complete opinion from this forum; running costs;

    Petrol - I know it will be pricey but I'd only be doing a few 1000 miles per year so not a concern

    Tax - is it 2006 cars at lower tax rate?

    servicing - how often and what needs doing? Cam belts frequent and expensive? Any other major work to consider?

    consumables - what size are the tyres? Any other shockers?


    finally what are the common issues to watch out for? How can they be prevented?

    I appreciate your thoughts and advice about the above or anything else I should be aware of? I'd love to get a rs4 before I ave the weight of mortgages etc!
    #1
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  3. Brodster
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    Brodster Shark Performance In Scotland Regional Rep Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Blody hell Ive just asked the same question mate.....lol
    #2
  4. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Not sure if the 2006s are lower tax, but my '07 is top bracket.

    Servicing can be "long-life" which is something like 20k miles, so if you're only doing a few thousand miles a year it will be 2 years (I think... service schedules should be google-able). Regular service items are actually not too expensive, considering it's a £50k car, and if the car's looked after properly then there shouldn't be any big surprises.

    Tyres are 255/35 R19, so not cheap, but again with the miles a set should last you a long time. Brakes and pads are the same - big and expensive, but wear with use not time.

    There are a few things to look for when viewing cars, they're all covered in the buyers' guide on rs246 - DRC, vacuum system/exhaust flaps, carbon build up, steering rack bolts, seat bolsters, auxiliary radiators...

    RS246.com Forum :: The World's #1 Audi R, S and RS Enthusiast Website • View topic - RS4 B7 Buying Guide Sticky

    Best thing to do is drive as many as you can, so you can get a good feeling for a "tight" car. And remember that age/mileage aren't as important as history and condition. A 30k mile car won't necessarily be better than a 60k mile car.

    I'll have a dig though the receipts that I got with my car and get you some numbers for costs of services, and what's included at each one.
    #3
  5. jdas03
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    jdas03 Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Haha so you did! Except you did it the correct way and got a lovely 8p s3 before looking at rs4!

    thank you for the information, actual figures would be fantastic! So far it isn't sounding as horrific as I thought it might be!
    Brodster - feel free to hijack this thread as we basically want the same thing lol
    #4
  6. Dave.
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    Dave. Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    With regards to servicing, I would not stick to the long life plan. A car in general should not go 2 years or 20K without a service, let alone an RS4.

    I personally try and change the oil every 6 months. It will be an expensive car to run even doing low mileage, and skimping on servicing will result in a lower value come resale time.
    #5
  7. Ste_Nova
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    Ste_Nova Active Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    put aside £1000 for a set of tyres

    tax will be £4xx or £2xx which makes no difference for the right car
    #6
  8. jdas03
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    jdas03 Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Brilliant, thanks for the advice so far, much appreciated.

    my other question is around the different body styles available.

    i don't want the estate as its not really needed so its between saloon and cab. I am guessing the only difference is the cabs handling being slightly worse due to the missing roof? Is it a significant difference? I was thinking of the cab so you get the full noise with the roof down!
    #7
  9. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Yeah, looking over the service schedule, the intervals are a little longer than I'd expect:

    LongLife Service - period must be less than 24 months, always includes oil change, flexible intervals shown by service interval display

    Inspection Service - Oil change as indicated by service interval display, every 12 months, or every 10,000 miles and inspection every 24 months or 20000 miles.


    Anyway, some figures for you all:

    Last service on my car was done by VW specialist Star Performance, was just oil change and inspection, and cost £166.14. The Tyneside Audi ones before that were part of the Approved Used plan so cost £0.00 each time (not much help there).

    Current tax disc on the car was £460 for the year. To buy tax for cars registered before 23 March 06, it's now £270.00, and for cars registered between 23 Mar 06 and 23 July 07 it's £475.00 (gads).

    There's also a bill here for "cooler 079117021T" and "line 8E0 117 316/315" - not sure exactly, seller said oil cooler - that was £1021 all in, so still some big bills possible. For balance though, my S3's fuel pump went without warning and cost something like £350 just for the parts. And the S3 I had before that ate a power-steering pump which was at least £400 since it needed the hoses and valves too. I guess Audis in general are just quite expensive to run anyway, but I think we all know that by now.

    Fuel consumption is just above 20mpg, but I'm only halfway through the first fill-up so will likely drop as I average out the cruise back up from buying the car. Cost £83 to brim the tank with V-Power and I'm expecting around 220 miles per tank, so about 38p a mile in fuel. My S3 had the same range, but a smaller tank so that's gone up a bit.

    Pads are similar to S3, but discs are bigger, and are about £400 for the front pair. A lot of owners have recommended Phaeton discs (the same size, but smooth) which you can get grooved, but OEM pads are well thought of. Usual after-market option is EBC yellow stuff, no favourite disc other than Phaetons, which I guess are still OEM kind of.
    #8
  10. Brodster
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    Brodster Shark Performance In Scotland Regional Rep Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Cheers for that matey. Seems like we are after the same beast then but Im after the Avant so it gives me a bigger boot for carrying what I am acquiring next week. The tax Im not bothered about as it will probably be the same as the S3. Its just servicing costs and consumables I was interested in. I can write off some to the tax-man as my car is a business tool so just need to weigh it all up and select which colour I prefer. There are afew nice ones on Pistonheads but would prefer to buy from Audi just to be on the safe-side.

    1. Used AUDI A4 (B7) RS4 QUATTRO 2006 [SOMETHING SPECIA... for sale - PistonHeads (Ref 921594)
    2. Used Audi RS4 Avant RS4 AVANT STUNNING BIG SPEC R... for sale - PistonHeads (Ref 824719)
    3. Used AUDI A4 (B7) RS4 QUATTRO 2006 for sale - PistonHeads (Ref 875659)

    I love No.3........in your face car!!!
    #9
  11. Audi Dynamik
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    Audi Dynamik Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    You will get the lower price to pay tax if it is registered before 23th March 2006, Watch out for the Bucket seat Bolsters for wear you can probably treat them with a leather product to reduce wear.
    You can get a rough idea of Tyre prices here.
    Online Quotation < Audi Tyres < Owners area < Audi UK
    Obviously you can get them cheaper from somewhere else but Audi but that is a rough idea.
    The Tyres are 255/35/R19 as said above. Im not really sure on anything else really.

    But yeah, get one bought :p :kissmyrings:
    #10
  12. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    It's not the kind of car I'd get from a small dealer, but felt confident enough buying privately (when you can get a feel for the owner, and how they are with their car). Buying from Audi would be ideal in term of warranty, but doesn't guarantee a clean car. It'll also cost more from the dealer, obviously.

    No. 3 is special. Everyone loves Imola. Don't have the balls for a yellow car though and as you saw in Edinburgh, I don't keep a car clean enough to have another black car (No 2). Will be better with the RS4, just because it's more special, but it won't be getting washed every week, or detailed more than twice a year. Don't see that being a problem for you though.

    As for body styles... Avant, Saloon and Cabrio. Cabrio seems to be the black sheep; better for the noise but hugely compromised dynamically. If they'd have done a coupe, I'd have had that, and the cabrio would be the closest in shape... but not exactly the same thing. Go for Avant if you want the space/are an RS fan-boy; Saloon if you just want the RS for it's engine and arches.
    #11
  13. Audi Dynamik
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    Audi Dynamik Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]

    I didn't see your post:



    Yeah, looking over the service schedule, the intervals are a little longer than I'd expect:

    LongLife Service - period must be less than 24 months, always includes oil change, flexible intervals shown by service interval display

    Inspection Service - Oil change as indicated by service interval display, every 12 months, or every 10,000 miles and inspection every 24 months or 20000 miles.


    Anyway, some figures for you all:

    Last service on my car was done by VW specialist Star Performance, was just oil change and inspection, and cost £166.14. The Tyneside Audi ones before that were part of the Approved Used plan so cost £0.00 each time (not much help there).

    Current tax disc on the car was £460 for the year. To buy tax for cars registered before 23 March 06, it's now £270.00, and for cars registered between 23 Mar 06 and 23 July 07 it's £475.00 (gads).

    There's also a bill here for "cooler 079117021T" and "line 8E0 117 316/315" - not sure exactly, seller said oil cooler- that was £1021 all in, so still some big bills possible. For balance though, my S3's fuel pump went without warning and cost something like £350 just for the parts. And the S3 I had before that ate a power-steering pump which was at least £400 since it needed the hoses and valves too. I guess Audis in general are just quite expensive to run anyway, but I think we all know that by now.

    Fuel consumption is just above 20mpg, but I'm only halfway through the first fill-up so will likely drop as I average out the cruise back up from buying the car. Cost £83 to brim the tank with V-Power and I'm expecting around 220 miles per tank, so about 38p a mile in fuel. My S3 had the same range, but a smaller tank so that's gone up a bit.

    Pads are similar to S3, but discs are bigger, and are about £400 for the front pair. A lot of owners have recommended Phaeton discs (the same size, but smooth) which you can get grooved, but OEM pads are well thought of. Usual after-market option is EBC yellow stuff, no favourite disc other than Phaetons, which I guess are still OEM kind of.



    I didn't see this post when i posted my Post, Im sorry about that. It didn't update when i read the replies so i thought the question was unanswered haha.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
    #12
  14. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Think your quotes got mixed up there, Dynamik. And no worries, plenty of times I take about an hour writing a post, then realise 3 or 4 people have already answered the question before me. It happens sometimes. I'm also pretty bad and not seeing bits of mid-thread posts and then repeating them.
    #13
  15. Audi Dynamik
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    Audi Dynamik Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Number 3 is the nicest by far, i think Buckets are a must personally. Not many are without Buckets.
    In my opinion Imola Yellow is the nicest Colour and second coming Sprint Blue.
    You probably will be better off getting one from a Audi dealer and if you wait one might pop up that you like.

    The Audi Approved Used Car Programme

    At Audi no pre-owned car enters our Approved programme without passing a comprehensive 145-point vehicle check. If it does, not only will you have peace of mind that your car is up to our exacting standards, you will also receive a minimum of 12 months unlimited mileage warranty with roadside assistance and the added value of key insurance and MOT protection (where valid).


    I wouldnt really go for the Cabriolet, I think the Rs4 Saloon is for you Jdas03
    #14
  16. Audi Dynamik
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    Audi Dynamik Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    Haha Sorry, I Read all the Replys before i answered, I think it was because i left the computer and i came back and it didn't update with your reply so then i replied basically the same thing what you put and im like :keule:
    Anyway we are :sign_ot: here now.
    Thanks
    #15
  17. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    #16
    StandFreeRS4 likes this.
  18. Audi Dynamik
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    Audi Dynamik Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    #17
    StandFreeRS4 likes this.
  19. Audi Dynamik
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    Audi Dynamik Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    My favourite one by far, it has been dropped £2000 aswell,

    Audi RS4 RS 4 Quattro 4dr Saloon 4.2 2006

    Its in good condition, below average miles, 4 new Conti Tyres, New Pads and Brake Disks, Full Audi Service History , Tracker, 6 Months Tax, 12 Months Mot, Really well specced looks amazing :hubbahubba:, you cant go wrong with that :rock:
    #18
  20. StandFreeRS4
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    StandFreeRS4 New Member

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    [Nov 20, 2012]
    I was just away to jump in with some thoughts and saw my motor up in lights!

    Anyway, I only ever got mine looked at by Audi Aberdeen (my local dealer) and have no complaints whatsoever with them - they know these cars inside out so hopefully the same can be said for Audi dealers across the UK. When I'm running a car like this I don't really want to scrimp on servicing costs which to be honest aren't bad. I had an E46 M3 before and I think the Inspection II was about £1,200!!!

    My tyres usually last about 15,000 miles (rough estimate) and I always put on Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 2s - have lasted much longer than the Audi recommended Continental Sport Contact 2 and have retained their grip better. My last set of all 4 corners was about £900 from AA so it pays to shop around.

    Having just looked at my service book I've had it done every 10,000 or so miles which for me is nearly every 12 months. My 40,000 service was about £500 with nothing extra needing done. I can't remember the cost for the one at 30,000 miles but it was much less.

    My pads lasted nearly 2 years / circa 20,000 miles and like Martay suggested earlier, EBC are a good shout and not too expensive.

    I'd hate to say how long discs last but they do last a very long time, I had the Audi OEM ones fitted.

    I'd also suggest you get an MOT at Audi for £50 - you get £750 MOT protection for the following year.

    That's about it really I think. As said above, MPG averages about 20 and I typically get 250-300 miles from a tank (I've a full 10 mile blast before hitting town each day so that keeps my daily average up and also carbon issues low!). On the last point, you'd be amazed at the number of RS4s out there running nearly 100BHP below what they put out when new. Luckily mine only lost 20 or so when I had it on a Rolling Road last year.

    Feel free to ask about any other costs as I've had mine for over 3 years now. On the whole it's not an overly expensive car to run IMO when you consider what you're getting for your money.

    And jdas, Brodster, more than happy to speak to either of you about my car if it's of interest.
    #19
  21. Brodster
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    Brodster Shark Performance In Scotland Regional Rep Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 21, 2012]
    StandFreeRS4 - Thanks for that buddy. If I was after the saloon then I would have yours away in a flash.....Im after the Avant so my quest continues.
    #20
  22. Gizmo68
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    Gizmo68 VCDS owner in Kent VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 15, 2012]
    A few question for the past and present owners:

    Oil consumption can be an issue on these engines, but in the real world how much do they like to drink it?

    Timing chains, is there a recomended interval when they need replacing? do the tensioners start to fail making the chain rattle?

    Carbon build up, is there a specific reason for this (non Vpower etc) or is it down to the type of driving, or even the oil consumption?
    I am currently looking for a B7 RS4 Avant (must have buckets) for someone (he knows little about what to look out for)
    #21
  23. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 15, 2012]
    I've topped the oil up once, but Ive also only had the car for ~800 miles. Ive been told 1l every 1000 miles is normal, even 2l.

    Not sure about the chain and tensioners, will have a squint through the rs246 forums and see.

    Carbon build up is a side-effect or the FSI system and affects different cars different amounts. The engine needs to be revved hard and have a good stretch of its legs to get the air really moving through the system, that's the best way to limit the carbon build up. These cars needs to be run on 98-RON petrol all the time too. Brand doesn't really matter, but needs to be premium unleaded you put in it.
    #22
  24. Gizmo68
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    Gizmo68 VCDS owner in Kent VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 15, 2012]
    Thanks, I know that some of the newer 1.4 VAG engines like a decent drink of oil, which on a everyday car is unacceptable, running costs will not really be an issue as it will be doing relatively low (but ‘driven’) miles, but he wants to buy it knowing what the costs and pitfalls are.

    I am on rs246, but not been on long so not found my way round there yet.
    #23
  25. PetrolDave
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    PetrolDave Well-Known Member

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    [Dec 16, 2012]
    Oil consumption is only an issue if you don't change the oil regularly enough. My experience, and that of several owners, is that up to 5000 miles after a service oil consumption is negligible but after that it slowly climbs as the oil becomes worn and contaminated. Best to stick to no more than 10,000 mile or annual servicing, some owners change the oil every 5000 miles though.


    The official Audi line is that they are for life, but some owners on audizine are changing them between 100,000 and 200,000 miles.

    Carbon build up affects ALL engines, but is bound to be worse on all direct injection engines as the washing effect of the fuel isn't present in the inlet manifold. Carbon build up produces the most emotional and passionate posts in all RS4 forums, some seem to suffer from it to a much greater extent than others (I've done nearly 60,000 miles and still well within the factory spec for the 3k-8k rpm time). It's an overstated problem seems to be the majority opinion, but there are passionate believers too.
    #24
  26. Gizmo68
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    Gizmo68 VCDS owner in Kent VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 16, 2012]
    Thanks for your thoughts Dave :thumbsup:

    I had a thought last night (I know a whole one all to myself!) - we used to check the oil between stages when I used to rally, this could be at 20 - 30 mile intervals and top them up every 100 or so miles… so maybe the consumption is purely down to the engine being revved hard (as it is designed to) however I doubt I will ever find an owner who doesn’t rev the engine hard and therefore wouldn’t have to top the oil up significantly, so I will not be able to confirm this.
    #25
  27. PetrolDave
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    PetrolDave Well-Known Member

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    [Dec 16, 2012]
    I hit the 8250rpm rev limiter regularly - the sound is just SOOOO good! Even doing that gives the oil consumption results I mentioned above.
    #26
  28. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 16, 2012]
    The noise from 5k on is just addictive, the engine actually begs to be revved most of the time.
    #27
  29. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 10, 2013]
    OK, small economy update. Now that I've gone through a few fill-ups with almost exclusively town driving the computer says 16.4mpg and 14.2 if you ignore the original drive home. Winter tyres and cold temp won't be helping, most of the time the 7k limiter doesn't go away by the time I get wherever I'm going (think it stay until oil is above 68degs).
    #28
  30. PetrolDave
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    PetrolDave Well-Known Member

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    [Jan 11, 2013]
    The 7k rpm limiter is removed when the oil reaches 60 Celsius.
    #29
  31. Gizmo68
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    Gizmo68 VCDS owner in Kent VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 11, 2013]
    I thought the whole 7K limit is a great idea by Audi to stop you revving the engine too hard whilst the oil is still ‘cold’, unfortunately IMO it fails on two points:

    1/ 7K is still far too high for a cold engine.
    2/ Oil does not reach optimum temperature until around 98º anyway, so Audi think 8,250K is fine on 60/68º oil? :no:
    #30
  32. PetrolDave
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    PetrolDave Well-Known Member

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    [Jan 11, 2013]
    Some remaps include the ability to lower the 7k to something more sensible, like 4k. Not sure they change the oil temperature where the switch happens though...
    #31
  33. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 11, 2013]
    I rarely go above 4k before the warning goes anyway, it acts as more of a warning to take it say than an actual limiter. It is odd to bother with stopping you hit the last 1250revs, a lower limit would seem much more reasonable but I'm sure they knew what they were doing.
    #32
  34. PetrolDave
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    PetrolDave Well-Known Member

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    [Jan 12, 2013]
    The load on the bearings goes up with the square of the rpm so at 7k rpm the load is only 72% what it is as 8250rpm.
    #33

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