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Oil temperature (SOLVED)

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by Matt82, Jan 14, 2010.

  1. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 14, 2010]
    when i did the cambelt change on my car i noticed a little sender to the right of the crank and it didnt have a cable on it at all, in fact i couldnt find a cable for it anywhere

    since then ive found out this should be for the oil temp gauge. my oil temp displays as normal until about 85* when it just goes mad

    firstly... how on earth is my oil temp gauge displaying anything considering the sender has nothing plugged onto the top of it

    secondly, i take it that "going haywire" is a sign of a duff sensor? in the past duff ones ive had just wont display anything at all
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2010
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  3. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 14, 2010]
    [​IMG]

    where should the cable for this thing be?
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  4. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 14, 2010]
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  5. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 14, 2010]
    I'm pretty sure the sensor you found IS the temperature sensor, perhaps theres an additional one in the oil condition thing, i'll check the wiring diagram in a bit.
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  6. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 14, 2010]
    Odd, the wiring diagram says the oil pressure switch and oil temperature sender are both single pin sensors earthing thru the block, and both run on the same harness, which stems from a 2 pin black plug on the left hand side of the engine/bay

    However it seems to suggest that the harness only exists until '99

    for the 2000my the 2 pin black plug is still there, but the second lead going to the oil temp sender is missing, and it only has one wire coming off it for the pressure sender, however i cant find that new level sender to see if it connects to the same place on the dash as the old sender did. I'll look a bit more and see if i can uncover anything.
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  7. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 14, 2010]
    Ah excellent, seems that one of the changes they made, when they went from "99my" to "2000my" was to remove the standard oil temperature feed, and replace it with a combined temperature and level feed. Also seems that the early cars didnt have any oil level sensing at all!

    So its not even possible to reconnect that standard temp sender to the clocks.

    Well done Audi.
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  8. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    this is good news as itll help things make a little more sense to me now

    im spending some time under the car this weekend checking the connector and wiring for the oil temp thing.

    i suspect is the sensor thats duff, so does anyone have any bright ideas where would be best to get a new one?

    it looks like it could be a generic sensor, i may have seen the exact same thing in 20vt sumps before.

    ill call audi for the price, but who knows where else i can get it?
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  9. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    the part number starts "1J0" which is the model designation for a mk4 golf or something, so ye, its presumably a generic part.
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  10. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    fantastic, if so i can get it from my good friends at VW!

    i need to call audi in the morning with my chassis number as apparently there are a few variations but well see.

    thats about the only "to do" i had on the list, getting that gauge sorted (still have not washed the car yet though..)
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  11. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    i dont see any variations, just 1J0907660B
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  12. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    such liars then. i bet he just wanted to get me off the phone haha
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  13. A4Q
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    A4Q New Member

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    [Jan 17, 2010]
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  14. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Jan 17, 2010]
    jebus. thats good to know. ive done nothing car wise this weekend but its good to know i can get that part of just about any vw ever made!
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  15. mojocvh
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    mojocvh Member

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    [Oct 13, 2013]
    For quite some time I have been hunting for the oil temp sensor/sender for my yr2000 RS 1.8tq.

    I had deliberated both online and with my Haynes manual as to where the little blue nosed thing was, but despite being pointed to the block by various sources it would now appear that it's the combined low level/ temp thingy in the sump that would appear to give the [very] intermittant oil temp indication.

    If [if] aragon reads this could he please provide a reference for this as, previously stated the only small sensor around the oil filter housing is wired up W/B....

    As the vehicle was in for some work with the undertrays off it was commented that the sensor had been replaced some time before. I was dismayed at the lack of environmental protection at the crimp joints [as an ex aircraft electrician] and the fact that the small 3 wire harness was basically rolling about under their unsupported.

    Eventually finding this thread has been a goldmine!!

    thanks again, in advance, if anyone can provide a pointer to how the hell my car is wired up!!

    cheers

    Mo.
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  16. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 13, 2013]
    if you have a digital clock on the dash cluster, the car uses a combined oil temperature, level and condition sensor in the sump. This signals the cluster with some combined signal, which the cluster decodes into temperature and level info as well as oil condition for the long life servicing.

    What are your symptoms?

    It could be something as simple as a faulty coolant thermostat, causing the guage to always display 60c because the oil is infact always below 60c. Does the coolant guage stay at 90c all the time once warmed up?
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  17. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 13, 2013]
    I should add, that if there was an electrical/wiring issue to this sensor, i would expect you'd get a nice big warning on the dashboard due to the level information not being available. It certainly does this if its unplugged.

    The sensor has three wires, which are simply +12v, signal and ground.
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  18. mojocvh
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    mojocvh Member

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    [Oct 13, 2013]
    Thanks for your very prompt replies.

    OK.

    1. The car warms up to an indicated 90C no problem. It has, however, also dropped to 70C twice during hard ish use, [symptomatic of a "lazy" stat that is on the, do quickly, list]

    2. I have very intermittent oil temp indication on the gauge, basically it's off more than on. It has shown up to 90c usually working only after a "heat soak" in the supermarket car park etc.

    3. I have spent ages trying to locate the small metal sender [for the block] that "every" source [online] that I have found tells me should be the one, even the Haynes manual has a specific wire and sensor [grounding itself into the block] as the sensor type.

    As mentioned, It's been replaced at least once before by a previous owner, but the electrical connections don't inspire confidence being open ended crimps....or perhaps a non OE part has been spliced in and is duff??

    It's very frustrating as I like to use the oil temp gauge rather than the coolant gauge to determine the warming of the engine...

    Any further light that you could shed on this would be very appreciated.

    all the best

    Mo.
    PS From data sheet vehicle was manufactured in Jan '00! well before the week 27 mentioned in the longlife pdf from above.??? So is it a retrofit from some time in it's life???? i just want me gauge to work.

    PPS from pdf

    "
    21
    Measuring oil temperature and oil level
    The oil temperature is detected by a separate
    temperature sensor with integrated electronics.
    The measuring element for oil level also works
    with temperature measurement. The electronics
    therefore heat it up quickly above the current oil
    temperature.


    After the heater voltage is switched off, the
    measuring element is cooled down by the engine
    oil to the oil temperature level. The oil level is
    calculated from the length of time of the cooling
    phase.

    The signal indicates the heating phase as high
    voltage and the cooling phase as low voltage.
    During the cooling phase, engine oil temperature
    information is transferred as a separate high
    signal.........

    Last edited: Oct 13, 2013
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  19. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 13, 2013]
    As i said above, if you have a digital clock on the dash cluster, you have a combined oil level/temp sensor in the sump.

    If its an analog clock, it will use the old single wire analog sensor on the front of the block.

    It takes a good 10+ miles of driving to get the oil temperature up to 90c.

    Also, the main coolant guage lies, and shows "90" at temperatures above around 75-80c, so you can have a faulty stat thats running the engine at 79c and the guage will show 90. To check this, you can view "live" coolant temp on the climate control system.

    Hold down recirc and press the up arrow on the climate unit, the display will change to 1c. Use Temp +/- control to make it say 49c, then press recirc again, and see what the temperature shows. You can drive around with this displaying, and it'll show live coolant temp without the fudgefactor the guage applies.

    I guess its possible someones just fitted a crappy sensor? The other possibility is the sensor is fine and the fault lies in the guage. So confirm this, you can use VCDS to view the oil temp from the clusters diagnostic interface.
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  20. mojocvh
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    mojocvh Member

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    [Oct 14, 2013]
    Good stuff!

    Right just been and done just this, using the live method from above-very interesting- the factory coolant gauge certainly IS well damped at 90 degrees LOL.

    Coolant temperature varied a little either side 90 say 86 to 94 but the oil temp gauge did it's usual trick of not reading untill heatsoaked.....75-80c was all I eventually got on it....

    ...on the one time I was able to gun it the coolant temp DID fall on the live measurement down to 84 however the traffic concluded any further hard running and there was no swing on the coolant gauge, I think if I'd been able to run harder for longer then the stat would have displayed the same "lazyness" as before.

    I conclude that it may well that the lazy/erratic operation of the stat that is leading to the lack of oil temp-for the time being :zen:

    cheers

    Mo.
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  21. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 14, 2013]
    easiest check for the coolant is to just pull onto the motorway and sit at 70mph. The combination of high airflow and low output will soon see the temp drop right off if the stat is duff. My coolant tends to sit within a few degrees of 90 most of the time.

    Did you use VCDS to compare the clusters oil temp readout with the gauge?
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  22. mojocvh
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    mojocvh Member

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    [Oct 14, 2013]
    If only...
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  23. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 14, 2013]
    grab an ebay lead and use the free version, it gives you the first few blocks which should be enough i think.
    #22

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