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Oil Catch Can mini group buy anyone? including PCV system simplification.

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by OllieH, Mar 3, 2010.

  1. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Don't worry about the extra cash folks. Let me find out how much it's gonna cost to ship them out to you first. The money left over leaves about £2.70 per can, so if it's not much more I'll stump up the extra. If it's quite abit more, then please feel free to send me a couple of extra quid :).

    With regards to the guide, when I receive the cans I will fit mine straight away and take some phots, then post a mini guide on here :icon_thumright:
     
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  3. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Yes, was thinking about this today as I decided to remove the PCV system ready for the catch can install, whilst searching for an air leak. The brake servo line ID is 1/2" and like you said, we need 3/8" ID hose for the manifold blank, like this one:

    [​IMG]

    I also plumbed the brake servo straight onto the side nipple on the inlet manifold using the check valve shown here:

    [​IMG]

    and blanking the third/redundant leg on it:

    [​IMG]

    This is only a temporary fix, until I get some proper hose.
     
  4. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    ahhh forgot you had the S3 Ollie....im fitting this to an AUM for the first application so should be exactly the same as the VW link......

    let me know how you get on as im sure we could all stump up for a length of the hoses we need
     
  5. Westy

    Westy Double Dark Side! Diesel & 8P

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    I'm massively confused at the moment so I'm not doing any work until I see your write up Ollie :)
     
  6. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    only thing that confuses me is the S3 fitment as i dont see the need for that valve for the brake balance.... most likely as i dont understand the flow path
     
  7. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    If I get a chance I'll make up a little guide using some pictures I already have as to what you will need to do, explaining everything. :icon_thumright:

    The check valve is needed to stop boost pressure from the manifold reaching the brake servo. The one I have used in the picture above is the one currently used anyway, but is located below the inlet manifold, with one leg normally going off to the suction jet pump. If you do not fit this inline with the servo vacuum line you will not have any servo assisted brakes, and I would think possibly blowing seals in the braking mechanism.
     
  8. jonny87

    jonny87 Active Member

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    that makes two of us lol
     
  9. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    ah got ya, cheers Ollie.....other than that its exactly the same fitment with the looks of things just with the servo line on the opposite side
     
  10. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Yep, you got it. As long as you have a line going to the servo, with a check valve in it, a vac line to the FPR and DV (or N249 valve first if you still have it fitted), anything else on the inlet manifold can be blanked. Then it's just the crank and rocker breathers to be piped into the catch can, with the outlet going to the PRV and into the TIP.
     
  11. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    isnt there two pipes in the bottom of the S3 inlet Ollie? IIRC
     
  12. jonny87

    jonny87 Active Member

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    three last time i looked, two small pipes running to dv/n249 and to fpr, and a bigger hose in the centre of the underside of the inlet mani which is incorporated in this system we are replacing somehow?

    on the bottom of my tip there is a hose with one of these check valves in that runs up along the top of the bulk head and back down by the chargepipe, it either leads to the inlet manifold or the charcoal chamber, is this the brake line servo thingy you are on about?
     
  13. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    As said by jonny87 there are three. Two underside left, which have a 4mm ID, which supply a) the N249 valve/DV and b) the FPR. Shown here:


    [​IMG]


    and the third one at underside centre, which has a 3/8" ID and connects to the PCV system, shown here (shown blanked on mine):


    [​IMG]


    Here is a picture of the PCV system from an S3 that we'll be replacing. Orange is where it connects to the side of the inlet manifold, red is where the brake servo line connects, green is where it connects to the underside centre nipple of the inlet manifold, pink is the suction jet pump, purple is the PCV check valve, yellow is the crankcase breather, and the blue arrow is where there is normally a pipe that leads upto the rocker cover breather and then into the TIP via the PRV (hockey puck).


    [​IMG]


    When you delete this system, the brake servo hose that normally connects to red, will go straight onto the side nipple that orange is connected to now (making sure you put the check valve inline, as mentioned on my earlier post). The underside nipple that green connects to now will be blanked, as I have done in the 2nd picture above. The T-piece that houses the PCV (purple) will be removed, and our new 19mm ID hose will connect straight onto the elbow pipe that comes from the crank breather (yellow). Our 19mm hose will then t-off, connecting to the rocker breather one way, and to the catch can inlet the other way. All the other parts in the above picture will be removed.


    jonny87, the hose you are talking about going into the bottom of the TIP I'm assuming is this one, with the check valve shown by the circle (under the heat shielding):


    [​IMG]


    This pipe connects to the charcoal filter and also to the throttle body via another check valve. The following picture shows the route of this in the engine bay, shown in red, with the check valves circled. The blue line is the brake servo from the inlet manifold to the master cylinder. As you can see, I have already put the check valve inline (blue circle) and connected this servo hose straight onto the side of the inlet manifold (note: I have drawn the arrows on the brake servo line the wrong way round, as the inlet manifold will actually be drawing air out of the brake servo, creating a vacuum.)


    [​IMG]
     
    #132 OllieH, Mar 18, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2010
  14. jonny87

    jonny87 Active Member

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    bloody brilliant mate, thanks alot for that, made things much clearer for me (after a few trips out to the car lol)

    i dont appear to have the jet suction pump inline from the inlet manifold though?

    yer that hose to the charcoal chamber is the one i was on about mate, how important is it and the whole system?
     
  15. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    for reference the one way discs are £13 from Audi - gonna order one closer the time ;)

    cheers again Ollie
     
  16. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    The one way valve on the AUM has no 'T' on it like the S3 one in the pic, would that be a better one to use so you don't have to blank off the spare port as seen in pic below?



    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  17. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Yeah, have seen a few examples without the jet pump in, but the general principle and routing of the pipes should be the same. What car have you got, and engine code? I think there are going to be a few people in the same situation where their pipework layout is going to be different, to say my BAM engine, but at the end of the day you will still have only one rocker breather and one crank breather, and as long as you have the side nipple supplying the brake servo vacuum and then the two underside nipples for the N249/DV and FPR, everything else can be removed and any open nipples blanked.

    With regards to the charcoal filter, I haven't read much about that. Ideally I'd like to get rid of it aswell so that I've got no vacuum lines at all, but I don't know enough about it yet to make that decision. All I do know is that it seperates the fuel from the gas fumes coming out of the fuel tank. I think that the vacuum lines conneceted to it (shown in red on the picture above) are what draws the fuel tank fumes through the charcoal filter. The fuel is then seperated and goes back to the tank and the gas is either drawn into the throttle body on idle, or into the TIP when accelerating etc. It is another emissions based fitment, but I can't see there being that much actual fuel in the fumes. Other cars don't have it so..... Will have to do some more research on it.

    Thanks for that. Will probably get one of these myself as the three leg'd one I'm using now looks abit gash. :icon_thumright:
     
  18. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    UPDATE:

    The hose has arrived! It's the same spec hose but they have supplied the 'anti-static' version which is slightly different (and would have been more expensive but they honoured their original price). It looks like a 'wrapped' hose, similar to the ones used for the air-con hoses in the bay but it is still R6 hose nonetheless, (the original one looked more like a coolant hose, this one is easier to identify due to the outer coating being different) - I hope it's not gonna be a problem guys?. :think:

    I'll be bagging them up very soon with the T-pieces and posting them out using recorded delivery. Once posted, I'll PM everyone with their individual Recorded Delivery Tracking Number so you can keep an eye on where it has got to.
     
  19. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Yes, that is a better one to use. That bloke has obviously bought one of the £13 ones 1animal1 mentioned about above. I'm just using that one as a temporary solution.
     
    #138 OllieH, Mar 18, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2010
  20. jonny87

    jonny87 Active Member

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  21. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Shouldn't be a problem. Is it still bendy, i.e will it do the bend like the hose to the rocker breather in the AUM picture you posted above?


    sounds like a plan :icon_thumright:
     
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  23. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    sorry Ollie, its the big hockey puck valve that costs £13......
     
  24. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    The hose seems just as 'bendy' as the one I posted a pic of originally, the only difference is the material type wrap that is on the outside (it's also fluro lined internally just like the other one) the OD is now about 28mm instead of 27mm. I can't see why it won't fit like in the AUM pic, I'm hoping to wrap these up in a sort of loop to send it out so it's definately bendy!
     
  25. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Ah, ok :)

    Ok, happy days :icon_thumright:
     
  26. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    Just had a quick look on ETKA and the one way valve is part of the hose so it can't be bought separately by the looks of it, most of the hoses are around the £20+FAT price range so maybe a trip to the breakers would be a better idea? I suppose any similar vehicle (A4 / A3 etc) will have a similar valve that you can use?
     
  27. Westy

    Westy Double Dark Side! Diesel & 8P

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    Does anyone have any idea how often the catch can will need to be emptied once its in operation?
     
  28. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    Ok, I've posted out all the hoses / t-pieces by recorded delivery this morning as promised (with the exception of J B who is collecting tomorrow).

    I have PM'd everyone their individual barcodes so you can keep tabs on it. If anyone has any problems, please let me know by PM so that I can make the relevant enquiries.

    p.s. - Packaged in the finest plastic rubble bags money can buy, in a choice of blue or clear - no expense spared!:moa:
     
  29. Dani_B19

    Dani_B19 Audi-sports own special child.

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    Not often westle, mines been in 8 month ish and still not emptied it haha.
     
  30. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    There should be a drain valve in the bottom of it. From looking at the uk-mkiv's thread, some were only draining very occasionally and others were draining every week.
     
  31. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    thats why im mounting ours on the back plate, above the TIP and in front of the scuttle panel ;)
     
  32. Speedy Steve

    Speedy Steve Active Member

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    Got my hose the other day thanks Imteyaz
     
  33. Westy

    Westy Double Dark Side! Diesel & 8P

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    I cant wait for the can to turn up so I can rip out all the **** hose.
     
  34. Speedy Steve

    Speedy Steve Active Member

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    I know me to. well i cant wait to get my ca back from Bills aswell
     
  35. jonny87

    jonny87 Active Member

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    yer i got my hose the other day too, can still gonna be another couple of weeks away yet i bet :(

    ollie, ive done a bit of research on the charcoal chamber thingy, the only person i read about removing it was on a track car where he had it venting to atmosphere, not sure on the implications of doing this on a road car ie the legality of it, effects on engine/fuel
     
  36. OllieH

    OllieH Member

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    Haven't heard from Saikoumichi yet, so expect another couple of weeks unfortunately. I've not had a chance to read up on the charcoal chamber myself, might end up just replacing all the pipes with silicon...
     
  37. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    imteyaz....pipes arrived this morning, many thanks mate
     
  38. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    Thanks to everyone for keeping me posted on their deliveries :icon_thumright:
    If you haven't yet had a delivery, please PM me asap so that I can start chasing Royal Mail to see where your goodies have got to.

    Thanks again to everyone who joined in this Group Buy, Ollie H and I appreciate the fact that you guys were spot on with your payments (which I know have mostly been made on 'trust' alone, most of us have never met in person so to hand over your hard earned wonga to someone you only communicate with on a forum is a big ask).

    Big thanks to Ollie H for having the kahuna's (sp?) to start the ball (no pun intended) rolling. :respekt:

    Fingers crossed, Mr. Saikoumichi is beavering away making our cans as I type!



    (just read my post back, why does my post seem like it's full of innuendo? 'kahuna's', 'ball's', 'beavering'... LOL) :asskicking:
     
  39. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    dunno fella but more worryingly it's homosexual inuendo..... dont be scared doood, we will support you ;)
     
  40. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    :wtf:

    LOL, I did use the word "beavering" too, that's my 'Get Out Of Jail Card' right there...
     
  41. 1animal1

    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!
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    im sure 'beavering' will have it's own meaning much like 'cottaging' matey ;)
     
  42. Imteyaz

    Imteyaz 6th Gear

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    Seems like you are more 'educated' in these sort of activities - cottaging? Never heard it before! :p

    How did I manage to change a post about catch cans and hoses to this?

    Taxi for Imteyaz.....
     

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