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OEM big brake upgrade

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by Cupramax, Oct 25, 2005.

  1. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    Not sure whether its just my car but I'm not that impressed with the factory brakes.

    Anyone know whats involved with getting the 345x30 3.2 front brake setup on a 2.0T? Is it just a case of calipers, carriers, disks, backplates and pads? I want to try and keep the car looking as OEM stealthy as possible /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif
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  3. JaminBen
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    JaminBen Member

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    Tell you what, I overheated my 3.2's brakes just yesterday. Granted, I was driving like an idiot, and it was a very long, hard, downhill drive, and it took half an hour to get to mushy brakes, but...

    The 3.2's brakes are BIG, but the floating caliper, single-piston design just doesn't cut it (imho).

    Furthermore, afaik, there are no aftermarket pads for that caliper!!!

    JBR Performance is about to sell ECS' stage V BBK, based on a Porsche fixed-caliper design. That ought to do it ;-)
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  4. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    Yeah, I'd love to go Brembo or Porsche but my insurers wouldn't cover it. Dont forget the 2.0T is a good 100kg lighter as well.

    On the pad subjet I think you'll find its exactly the same as an S4 front set and there must be some pads available for them.
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  5. marriedblonde
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    marriedblonde Moderator

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    CupraMax,

    To fit the brakes from the 3.2 you need callipers, carriers, discs and pads. I'm away working in Hungary at the moment, if you wait til the weekend I will send you the part numbers and prices for the conversion. I can;t do it now as i have my works laptop with me and the info is on my personal laptop which is at home!

    J.
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  6. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    Thanks mate... see post re pedals to.
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  7. marriedblonde
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    marriedblonde Moderator

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    [Oct 25, 2005]

    No worries dude, spotted your thread. I have dropped the guy a line to order one set so I can make sure they fit and to get the wheight for postage costs although not applicable to you!

    You may want to remind me about part numbers and prices friday... Not as young as I used to be and the memories going...

    J.
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  8. Karcsi
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    Karcsi Member

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    What's the point in bigger brakes if you the standard ones are more that sufficient to ensure you lose grip in normal conditions? Or is it not the issue of ultimate stopping power, but that you don't need to work them so hard, which means optimum performance is maintained for longer, and it's easier on your right leg? Plus, they look much better under 18 inch rims!
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  9. johnmv55
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    johnmv55 Member

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    [Oct 25, 2005]
    i'm not sure it is as easy as that, from my race car experience just throwing a set of large brakes at the front isn't the answer as it spoils the front/rear balance that the car had with the std brakes, surely you need to alter something at the rear as well to keep the balance? Maybe some harder pads and cooling would be a better idea?
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  10. little_wing
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    little_wing Member

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    [Oct 26, 2005]
    For the 3.2, brake performance is ok from the big discs - I don't think there'd be a need to go bigger, but I think some improvements could be made in terms of feel and resistance to fade. If I could find some, I'd go for something like 4 pots with some decent pads and grooved discs. Hopefully people like ECS will be bringing plug and play replacement stuff out for the 3.2 soon as it gets released over the pond.

    For the 2.0T, maybe just grooved discs and harder pads will make enough of a difference depending on which bit of the brake performance isn't impressing you, but simply going big discs up front may well upset the balance leaving you with a skittish car under hard braking.

    some good discussion here
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  11. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Oct 26, 2005]
    The plan is to put the entire 3.2 setup on eventually. Maybe its because I'm used to driving a Leon Cupra R with Brembo's but the 2.0T setup is very poor. It just doesn't feel confidence inspiring when pushing on. Will be doing some track days next year so need to do something...
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  12. johnmv55
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    [Oct 26, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]
    .

    For the 2.0T, maybe just grooved discs and harder pads will make enough of a difference depending on which bit of the brake performance isn't impressing you, but simply going big discs up front may well upset the balance leaving you with a skittish car under hard braking.

    some good discussion here

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yep--I agree--
    From my experience you tend to find just sticking big brakes up front makes the front do a higher percentage of the stopping, which results in the car "standing on it's nose" with rear end way up in the air, not the ideal way to enter a corner!
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  13. steeve
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    steeve Well-Known Member

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    [Oct 26, 2005]
    Be careful about the balance, wouldnt like to be braking hard into a corner in the wet at speed if the cars not set up properly. Is the master cylinder the same and there must be some front to rear bias valve ...... all a bit iffy. Upgrade the standard ones with decent discs and decent pads, or buy a 3.2.
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  14. dummi
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    dummi smoking a6

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    [Oct 26, 2005]
    if your upgrading try to get rid of the floating callipers and get some 4 pots, the response is much better, i likened my old brakes to stepping in a turd and trying to look elegant compared to the 6 pots, worth a look apracing, stoptech, goodridge, all similar to brembo without a name that'd scare insurers..

    funny when i told direct line about my 6 pots they weren't bothered. are you on a like 4 like policy?
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  15. JaminBen
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    JaminBen Member

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    [Oct 29, 2005]
    The entire "A3 brake upgrade" story really has me interested. Right now I'm trying to get my suspension sorted, but early 2006 I'd like to do brakes.

    ECS Tuning has a very informative website, as does StopTech. On B6 S4 forums (that car has very similar brakes to the 3.2), many say that a simple change in pads/lines/fluid is enough for:

    - good feel / modulation,
    - increased brake torque,
    - fade resistance.

    MB, I'm really looking forward to seeing a 3.2 brake conversion for the 2.0T, as are quite few others. I'm also waiting to read some in-depth reviews of full-on systems as what ECS or others are offering...
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  16. Banwell
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    Banwell previously LeeS3

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    [Oct 29, 2005]
    I think I am right in saying that within certain limits the ecs/abs system in the car will adjust for improved braking upfront.

    Extreme situations may lead to brake bias which is another matter. But on front engined cars going big upfront isn't usually a problem - massively improving the rears would be though..

    The only thing you need worry about when chopping and changing callipers (which fit!) is the master cylinder compatability.
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  17. marriedblonde
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    marriedblonde Moderator

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    [Oct 29, 2005]

    Ok I was going to send the info via PM but I'll post it up here instead.

    The prices are approx what I can get, although I think I can get a little bit more discount now!

    I've given you the part numbers of callipers, carriers and discs to show which bits are compatable. The easiest comversion for us Tdi owners is to go for 312mm.

    288 x 25mm Disc Setup
    Disc: 1K0 615 301T
    Carriers: 1K0 615 125 or /.......125-D
    Calipers: 1K0 615 123 or / ......124

    312 x 25mm Disc Setup
    Disc: 1K0 615 301AA - £27.89
    Carriers: 1K0 615 125-C - £58.94
    Calipers: 1K0 615 123-B or / ......124-B - £56.06

    345 x 30mm Disc Setup
    Disc: 1K0 615 301M
    Carriers: 1K0 615 125-B
    Calipers: 1K0 615 123-C or / ......124-C

    Hope this helps.

    J.
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  18. Eeef
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    Eeef Lord of War

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  19. JaminBen
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    JaminBen Member

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    [Oct 30, 2005]
    Yes, but it has been "in preperation" for a very long time. I've called the french Oettinger importer xxx times, and he still has no info! Madening!
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  20. little_wing
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    little_wing Member

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    [Oct 30, 2005]
    These look like quite nice alternatives to the standard 3.2 345mm discs but they're listed for the B6 S4 only. Anyone know whether they'd fit a 3.2?
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  21. little_wing
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    little_wing Member

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    [Oct 30, 2005]
    Just to answer my own question - no /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif according to Tom from ECS on this thread. Bugger.
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  22. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Oct 30, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]

    Ok I was going to send the info via PM but I'll post it up here instead.

    The prices are approx what I can get, although I think I can get a little bit more discount now!

    I've given you the part numbers of callipers, carriers and discs to show which bits are compatable. The easiest comversion for us Tdi owners is to go for 312mm.

    288 x 25mm Disc Setup
    Disc: 1K0 615 301T
    Carriers: 1K0 615 125 or /.......125-D
    Calipers: 1K0 615 123 or / ......124

    312 x 25mm Disc Setup
    Disc: 1K0 615 301AA - £27.89
    Carriers: 1K0 615 125-C - £58.94
    Calipers: 1K0 615 123-B or / ......124-B - £56.06

    345 x 30mm Disc Setup
    Disc: 1K0 615 301M
    Carriers: 1K0 615 125-B
    Calipers: 1K0 615 123-C or / ......124-C

    Hope this helps.

    J.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    MB, thanks for the info. I'd dug around on ukmkiv's and found that... just need to find pricing on the 345x30 parts now. Any info on the pedals yet?

    As for the Brembo posts I know you can get a kit but I want to keep the car OEM looking..
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  23. marriedblonde
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    marriedblonde Moderator

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    [Oct 30, 2005]
    I should have the trial set of the pedals mid week - fingers crossed!!!!

    J.
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  24. Banwell
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    Banwell previously LeeS3

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    [Oct 31, 2005]
    Where are these parts coming from? I need new pads and disc for a 3.2 a3
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  25. marriedblonde
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    marriedblonde Moderator

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    [Oct 31, 2005]

    I have a couple of VW contacts. Would you like me to get a firm price on OEM discs and pads? although it might be cheaper to try your local Euro car parts of GSF as they are quite heavy items.

    J.
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  26. IanMcA3
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    [Oct 31, 2005]
    I don't know about anyone else, but the prices and part no's that marriedblonde posted (thanx by the way) make for a pretty cheap brake upgrade. And its OEM! Sorted.
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  27. Banwell
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    Banwell previously LeeS3

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    [Oct 31, 2005]
    eurocarpart would be 77 quid per disc, plus the dreaded vat...
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  28. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Nov 1, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]
    I don't know about anyone else, but the prices and part no's that marriedblonde posted (thanx by the way) make for a pretty cheap brake upgrade. And its OEM! Sorted.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Lol, that was the idea of my post in the first place... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
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  29. IanMcA3
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    IanMcA3 Member

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    [Nov 6, 2005]
    Cupramax - I/m not stealing your "fire" - I'm just agreeing.

    Bad day? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif
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  30. Cupramax
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    Cupramax Uber pimp meister

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    [Nov 6, 2005]
    No offense intended mate, didn't come across as I meant it... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
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