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My minor modding thread

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by <tuffty/>, Jul 29, 2009.

  1. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 5, 2012]
    4" MAF tube is too large for my setup and have used this setup before on a race car before... idle was a bit rubbish due to large tube and no mesh for laminar flow... not any good for a car used mainly on the road...

    Getting the scaling right on it would take a bit of effort (as it did on the LCR) so why bother with the hassle...

    <tuffty/>
  2. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 5, 2012]
    Because you need a known MAF tube size with flow straighteners to achieve laminar flow across the sensor, else you get erratic and inaccurate airflow measurements... You can influence the idle of the car by simply blowing into the airfilter such is their sensitivity.
    I have previously tried MAF element into a 100mm alloy pipe, but without many straight diameters upstream (not physically possible in an engine bay) the flow was unstable.
  3. Scullies
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    Scullies Well-Known Member

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    and I thought the mesh was to prevent any strange objects entering the TIP :blush:
    Another useful lesson learnt :thumbsup:

    Would mafless be a better option, I can only imagine it must be very difficult and time consuming to get the map right when running mafless.
  4. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    Better option for what though? some have tried with mixed results in the US to go MAF less on ME7... thats mostly due to chasing huge numbers and for cars that will be used mostly for drag strip and/or street racing...

    If building a 400/500 hp road going 20v on std management then there is no reason to go MAF less... RS4 MAF will support over 600hp... by that time a 1.8 would be not be a particularly road friendly car to drive though...

    <tuffty/>
  5. Westy
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    Westy Double Dark Side! Diesel & 8P

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    It's great that we're still finding new improvements for this little old engine. The tuning boundaries are still being stretched due to new hardware and software findings. It's exciting stuff.
  6. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    no need not to run maf... its designed for it..
  7. Andrew@A.L.D
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    Andrew@A.L.D May add NOS to 600+bhp?

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    I looked into running mafless and found it to be a very common mod in the US so people can run atmospheric dump valve.
  8. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    for the sake of running a wooshy valve...... Seems like a lot of work...
  9. superkarl
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    superkarl MAN OF STEEL

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    you'd look and sound well cool on the streets yo.
  10. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    HKS SSQV yeeeeaaah boooiii! (hate the noise they make!)
  11. Andrew@A.L.D
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    Andrew@A.L.D May add NOS to 600+bhp?

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    Running a maf helps drivability, I did drive one without a maf and can say it wasn't as nice with a map with a maf
  12. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 6, 2012]
    Aiiii innit..
  13. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Big thank you to Bill for taking the time to dyno my car today... I pretty much left him to the map changes and stuff today as he has far more experience with it than me so I built engines and kept an eye on stuff letting him work his magic...

    Fuelling needed a little fine tuning as he boost levels rose which I expected anyway... however... my car being my car she did put up a fight... this time the Tial wastegate springs... first runs would net higher boost than subsequent ones as the Tial got hot... guess its altering the springs tension when hot and is highlighted more as we are running open loop boost control... ah well... at least it gives me something else to do lol...

    Anyhoo... scores on the doors...
    [​IMG]

    A bit more fine tuning to do of course and I need to find a solution to the boost issue... have a few ideas so will see how that goes...

    <tuffty/>
  14. s3 Hoggy
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    s3 Hoggy Whats going on???

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Congrats mate!
  15. BuuBBa
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    BuuBBa Member

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Nice figures! How much boost pressure?
  16. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    26psi currently....

    <tuffty/>
  17. Prawn
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    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    awesome stuff :)

    The all important question though: How does it feel to drive now?
  18. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Not really had much chance to give her the beans as yet but the one overtaking move I did do felt well rapid and sounded awesome :)

    More boost always gives the exhaust a bit of a work out ;P

    <tuffty/>
  19. Westy
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    Westy Double Dark Side! Diesel & 8P

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Are you running meth now too Tuffty? I know you had an AEM kit but can't remember if you'd fitted it!
  20. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Not yet mate... I have a DO kit though... it was never my intention to tune for WMI but I will be adding it once I know the mapping is where I want it and I have (yet again!) got over another small hardware issue lol

    <tuffty/>
  21. Vex182
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    Vex182 Guess what I drive...

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Excellent! Made the magic number today then. Cheers to you and Bill today, my drive back home to work sounded much better with that filter and still did 41+mpg on average.
  22. Oke Phill
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    Oke Phill Member

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    bloody hell! that is a result! bet you chuffed, this is a dangerously inspiring thread.lol well done bud.
  23. Westy
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    Westy Double Dark Side! Diesel & 8P

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    Are you happy now Tuffty or are you hoping for a touch more? It's been nice to see a few builds come together this weekend ;)
  24. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 7, 2012]
    I am happy with the power, less so with the frigging Tial... not sure if its a victim or the cause as yet... most Tial installations I have been involved with are stood off a bit more from the manifold and or on tubular manifolds... mine glows quite nicely so I suspect its getting hotter than it would on a more remote location... the boost is consistent after the first run... drops by nearly 3psi which is quite a bit of horse power...

    One idea is to run the MBC again in parallel and tune the N75 duty to do the boost I actually want using the MBC to cap off the initial overboost hit... the MVS is also water cooled so I could look into that too (not plumbed in as yet...)

    Few options to try including the possibility of making a tubular manifold to my own spec... it will of course be done (if at all) to emulate my existing mani fitment wise so underslung etc but will be merge collector with the aim to flow better top end and improve spool over the existing log manifold I am currently using..

    <tuffty/>
  25. superkarl
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    superkarl MAN OF STEEL

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    excellent news. you've finally hit the magic number.
  26. Sevv
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    Sevv Pushing the limits..

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    congrats mate was waiting to see the + 400
  27. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    wmi next imho, along with a cooling circuit to the tial somehow

    stabilise temps and engine itself will be more consistent...
  28. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    As an interesting comparison... the power curves from mine (GT3071, log manifold, yellow plot), Welly's (FP green, tubular race manifold, red plot) and a stage 1 S3 (custom code, blue plot)...

    [​IMG]

    <tuffty/>
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2012
  29. Sam_
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    Sam_ Down under

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    Substantial area under the curve. What's stopping it breathing well up high? The log manifold?
  30. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    Pretty much yeah... merge collector type manifolds are more efficient for top end power which is why I will look into making one later on... there is a little bit of a 'ramp' in the collector of my log mani but nowhere near what would be needed to stop cyl 1 gasses knocking on the door of cyl 4's exhaust port...

    <tuffty/>
  31. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 8, 2012]
    balance of runner length and diameters and merge collector vs large bore but short runners of a log type manifold..

    log will spool sooner, when less volume, but when flows high, the lack of narrow angle merge collector tells its tale..
    wellys setup being one of my old ibiza cast off's, hence its performance is race related.. and the original cost of that turbo and manifold alone was >£2500
  32. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 9, 2012]
    I think I found the boost issue... I forgot that I have had the banjo air fitting on the Tial come loose a few times in the past... didn't much of it at the time but check it lunch time and it was loose... again!... so tightened it up for the drive home (will make it more permanent later) and it appears to be holding consistent boost of around 1.7/1.8 bar (didn't look too much as the roads had those annoying 'other' motorists on it!!)... might try and grab a video of the boost gauge tomorrow if I can get the phone secured ok on the window...

    Unfortunately the roads have other issues besides people who think they have to be using it at the same time as me... potholes! and I managed to clip one with a fairly healthy jolt... :(

    Tyre looks ok, wheel 'looks' ok but the steering feels dead so its definitely knocked something out... typical... as seems to be the way, just as you solve one issue another one takes its place... so will check the tracking when I get over to Bills and tweak accordingly... its the near side wheel that took the hit so should be a case of half a turn and all good again else its back over to Chris Mullins in Glos for a laser alignment... bugger..

    Liquid was showing healthy airflow (assuming I have the scaling right which I believe it is) and tried the 'power gauge' for a giggle..
    [​IMG]

    Whilst I think its a little optimistic its good pub ammo ;P

    Gonna log a few things tomorrow as now I have boost again I need to check timing etc...

    As I may have mentioned before... its never really finished... :D

    <tuffty/>
  33. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    Did a quick video pulling out from a junction on the way to work this morning... more to see if boost was holding as the roads were too busy to watch the gauge and the road at the same time...


    Will have to do a few more vids I think :)

    <tuffty/>
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2014
  34. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    Just spotted this post fred (11th December 2011) and chuckled :)

    Do you think I have pulled it off?

    <tuffty/>
    Westy likes this.
  35. badger5
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    badger5 www.badger5.co.uk Site Sponsor

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    hooligan :p
  36. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    And rightly so!! :)
  37. Scullies
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    Scullies Well-Known Member

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    Back to the MAF quickly, which RS4 MAF housing is the one to go for - V6tt or V8 4.2 ??

    I like the vide clip, it inspires me to get off my ass and do some more work on my engine
    Regards the tubular manifold, I bought this cast S/S collector off a guy in the US - only 1 left
    AMS Performance Cast Turbo Manifold Merge Collectors | eBay
  38. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    V6 2.7tt

    <tuffty/>
  39. Andrew@A.L.D
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    Andrew@A.L.D May add NOS to 600+bhp?

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    [Oct 10, 2012]
    RS4 2.7tt Maf sensor+tube Bosch part number is 0280218067
  40. AVLO
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    AVLO Active Member

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    [Oct 11, 2012]
    this thread is amazing paul the car isnt just an s3 its a work of art, your car sounds epic in that vid!!

    really love the oem look

    thumbs up to yourself and bill :yes:

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