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More S3 Drama

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by Welly, Feb 7, 2010.

  1. 1animal1
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    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!! VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 8, 2010]
    woah badass :) ;)
    #41
  2. S3BAM
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    S3BAM Member

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    [Feb 8, 2010]
    Crazy that Welly i did my Forge front mount yesterday started at 3.30 outside til 10.30 on my tod still not finished(align pipes and bumper headlights to fit back on..!!!) popped up to Forge (u get some funny looks with 1/2 the front end missing lol)earlier to get my top int hoses on way back thought id give it a bit and it blew one of my hoses off..!!!(the join off the plastic map pipe lh side)

    touch wood put it back on and no probs just need to get it back together now...!!!
    #42
  3. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Well good and lovely people, I have an update for you....

    Head is now off.... Whipped it off last night, and a few bits and bobs aside like no having the head bolt removal tool (Thanks Bill!), and having some odd fashion turbo - exhaust manifold bolts which I just don't have a socket that will fit, all went very well.

    Started at about 8 PM, and by 10.30 we had all the ancillaries off and the only remaining things to do were remove the timing belt and get the turbo bolts of the mani. Timing belt - no problemo. Turbo bolts.... well we finally got all 3 out at 1 AM (after hammering a 1/2 inch 10mm socket on and cracking them with a 3 ft breaker bar). :(

    Let me say at this point, I had been at work since 8, and got straight on the car when home - I couldn't be arsed to take photos!

    When I unbolted the inlet manifold, cylinder 3's inlet port and valves has visible oil in which wasn't a massive surprise. The other 3 were absolutely fine.

    Had a quick inspection of the block, especially cylinder 3. Plenty of oil in there.Bores look good, no abnormal scoring. Rings on all also look good. Quite happily hold WD40 in the cylinder with no problems so that's been deemed as unlikely. Head gasket appears fine also, no obvious damage, or leaks, or marks of any kind really.

    So........that left the head. Flipped it over - And it looks pretty good actually. Cylinder 3's exhaust valves are covered in burnt, congealed oil unsurprisingly, but other than that, it looks cushty to be honest... Valves are all in tact. No obvious cracks.

    So. God knows what's up with it to be honest. Something head related I'm pretty sure, as everything else looks in very good nick for an engine which has done 125K. I'm going to drop it in to a local company who will look at it for me, hopefully they will be able to find out what's happened and resolve.
    #43
  4. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Small world dude actually, my mate works with your mate I believe!
    #44
  5. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    #45
  6. MIKE GTR
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    MIKE GTR Member

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    I e-mailed the guy when i needed mine doing, he never got back to me
    #46
  7. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    I've done the same thing so will wait and see. I'd rather get the guys that have the head at the moment to do it really, they're a small, family based company and they're such good guys. They don't charge to strip and investigate which is a rarity these days! I'll see what they come back with once they've looked at it.

    I like to support local business wherever possible.

    BUT not at my own expense!! :(
    #47
  8. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    #48
  9. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Thats what I thought when I saw it! 20 new valves, seats, stem seals, bit of a clean and a skim? 300 bones?

    Where do I sign?
    #49
  10. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    If you are stuck, Bill has a head guy thats pretty damn good... must be as he sends his race heads to him

    <tuffty/>
    #50
  11. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    10 out of 10 for commitment to the job there welly, thats some proper s3 love right there lol

    so no obvious/visible damage any ideas at all what would of caused you all this hassle?

    although a reet pita, at least you can change hg/cambelt/water pump etc etc and be done with it all in one go
    #51
  12. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Haha, S3 love? Why I have any I have no idea, but I agree. I cannot stand leaving a job half done. My neighbours will be WELL annoyed with me after me HAMMERING a 1/2" 10mm socket onto those mani nuts at 1 AM, and then the din when I got them all out and I was jumping about like a moron! lol :)

    Work all day, work all night. Same again tonight! SAI removal, N122 removal, turbo checkover, replace a load of hoses that the head not being there makes easy!

    You think the same way as me Jonny, thats exactly how I look at it. Once done, engine should be good for some trouble free motoring!! :icon_thumright:

    Obviously that's b*llox though, because I own it. It will probably drive itself off a cliff next! :(
    #52
  13. Alex C
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    Alex C Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    lol, yeah i was thinking that when i read it :) All that noise at that time in the morning
    #53
  14. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Exhaust mani? might have saved yourself the hassle if you had used a 12mm ;P

    <tuffty/>
    #54
  15. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    :) hahahahaha, that just made me piss myself lol

    i dont think theres much else to go wrong is there? or should i not say things like that?

    yer mate, if its all in bits get as much done as possible, it makes sense really

    3-4 hours for whipping the head off aint bad seeing as some people were saying its a pita, whats this special tool that you need for the headbolts?
    #55
  16. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Yeah, I did feel bad. It was a bit of curtain twitching moment.... BUT **** em. I was there looking mightily peaved holding a 3ft breaker bar, I didn't think they were stupid enough to come and say anything, and I was right! lol :icon_thumright:

    It was the 3 mani - turbo bolts. Christ only knows what sort of bolts they were, an E14 socket fitted the actual star, but there was actually only 4 mm of teeth before the bolt tapered off.

    Under any pressure, the socket just kept on slipping off and ended up damaging the teeth. To be fair, it looked to be some sort of security bolt that needed a special tool to undo. Maybe they were Audi ones - but I certainly shan't be replacing them with the like.

    I won't be able to do the little buggers up!:(

    It's a VAG tool (suprise suprise....) Nearly a 'T' series bit... but not quite.... I'll try and find one in a bit and post a link.
    #56
  17. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Ahhh... yeah... little feckers ain't they... Think I uses an 11mm socket tentatively on mine but I knew they weren't going back on ;P

    There is a funny name for the type of end this tool has... Bill will know as he had to fine a different one for the newer 16v VAG head bolts fitted to that Mk2 Golf...

    This may be of some use to to too...

    http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3425946

    <tuffty/>
    #57
  18. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    I knew mine weren't either, I'll be replacing them with something less bloody stupid. The 11mm didn't work for me :(. I did try it. Then moved to 7/16. Then finally to 10mm, but the 10mm out of my 1/2" kit. Job done.

    What a rewarding crack that was when the last one went :)
    #58
  19. S3BAM
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    S3BAM Member

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Yeah Manny said to me on monday that you had done your engine..!!! he works with your m8 just give us a shout when your passing or il give the yellow to manny to pass on..

    Finshed all my pipework earlier also done the 2 top int hoses(of course Forge ones) as just didnt look right leaving them just got to line it all up now and get the bumper back on..!!!

    I spoke with Bill earlier may pop it over to him weekend if i cant sort it i have spoke to My m8 from Forge hoping he can sort something next couple of days though..>!!

    Post pics soon...!!!

    Pete
    #59
  20. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 9, 2010]
    Tonight has been uneventful.... lol

    I removed the entire SAI - but very little else to do and is very cold out in the wild.

    Took some photos though :)

    [​IMG]

    As you can see, her big fat arse sticks out of the garage!

    [​IMG]

    This is my current pile of removed items...

    [​IMG]

    My absolutely disgusting inlet manifold (due to broken dipstick pipe), ready to be cleaned.

    [​IMG]

    This is my blood on an intercooler pipe. Can also be found in various other sections of the car's engine bay...

    [​IMG]

    Half empty or half full??

    Hopefully should hear about the head tomorrow....

    Watch this space....
    #60
  21. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    OK, there is news. Confused news granted, but news none the less.

    Ordered all the kit needed from Euro Car Parts this morning:

    Head bolts, Head Set, Rocker Cover Gasket Set, Timing Belt Kit, Water Pump + Gasket, 5W 30 VAG oil, Oil Filter, Sump Plug & Aux belt.

    £225 delivered - which I thought was pretty good.

    Also heard back about the head - Tuffty was spot on with the timing chain tensioner (good shout dude!), as it is FUBAR. So I expect it's that causing the rattling noise.

    Valves have all been removed, checked and cleaned. Work from here will comprise of relapping all of the 20 valves back in, a skim and pressure test, new stem seals and rebuild with new tensioner.

    And all that work for £150. Shame the tensioner is £115 plus VAT from Audi. Ouch.

    Anyway.... onwards....
    #61
  22. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    the bay looks a total sty lol hard to see whats what in there!!

    £115 for a tensioner, what the duece?
    head work for £150 has to be a winner!!

    so what caused the oil dump? valve stem seals? tensioner related or coincidence?

    so when do you reckon she'll be back on the road, obviously allowing for delivery of all the bits?
    #62
  23. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    I know it looks bad - but I think I know where everthing is! lol.

    I know that £115 plus VAT for a tensioner is expensive, but it's the one for the cam chain - so is important. I didn't even look to see if there was a pattern parts one available. I'd rather shell out knowing that it will be OK, than risk it and end up with a shagged engine. Again. Yeah, £150 bucks for the head work. Where do I sign?

    I popped in earlier and saw it on the skimmer. They've sonically cleaned it as well - looks brand spanking new! Has a quick chat with the boss man there, and he confirmed that the main oil way up to the head passes cylinder 3 - so it may of just been the gasket popped by the change in boost delivery with the new cooler, or could of been a stem seal. They have all the valves out of the head now, and didn't mention that a stem seal looked bad. Who knows. They assure me that the head is as good as gold, so I can only go with what they say to be fair.

    With a bit of luck, new tensioner and a rebuilt head, combined with a new gasket and new head bolts bolted down should solve the issue!
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2010
    #63
  24. Matt82
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    Matt82 Active Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    welly. i saw some post from you on the s4 board, just wanted to say well done on the work youve put in there, big thumbs up from me. not many round here are willing to get their sleeves rolled up and get stuck in!

    good luck and ill be keeping an eye on the thread
    #64
  25. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    Thanks dude. :icon_thumright:
    #65
  26. dela
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    dela Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    theres a place in the industrial estate behind the petrol station on the road between stonehouse and ebley that quoted me 300 beans to have all that done when my timing belt went, think its called A&M, two local guys that really know their stuff, only reason i didnt go through with it was my head was unsalvageable :(
    #66
  27. JS1500
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    JS1500 Howdy

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    I don't suppose you know off the top of your head (no pun intended) how much you paid for...
    ?
    Mine's leaking a little bitty.


    Good luck with it Welly. I think you deserve a bit of good luck!
    #67
  28. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    That exactly where it is mate, A + M Cylinder Head Reconditioners. Would recommend anyone wanting head work done in the Gloucestershire area to pay them a visit. Friendly, helpful guys. Thats the only place I take any head work.

    I just saw the ebay thing, and for all new valves, that is very cheap. Still, as I always say, buy cheap = buy twice. I really should listen to my own advice.... lol.
    #68
  29. dela
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    dela Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    £115 for the tensioner thats cheap!!! mine for the AMK because its vvt was over £300!!!!!!!!!!!
    #69
  30. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    #70
  31. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    OMFG! You are having a laugh surely? Cheaper to buy a full head second hand! I feel much better now.... lol :icon_thumright:
    #71
  32. S3BAM
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    S3BAM Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    Always worth trying Tps in tewkesbury Welly(they supply all local vag dealers) i get all my bits from there usual 18% disc if you ever call them speak with Colin will need to open a trade account otherwise give us a shout and il see what i can do..

    Not to rub it in but Forge mount all done finished at Forge earlier... give us a shout when youre passing...!!

    Pete
    #72
  33. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    Evening all.

    Can anyone see anything wrong with this:

    [​IMG]
    #73
  34. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    ohhhhhhh s***!!!

    that shouldnt be like that! :(

    how can an fmic do this, especially when you only gave it 2/3 throttle :wtf:

    what made you drop the bottom end off to check?

    really gutted for you guy!!
    #74
  35. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    I'm not sure whats happened mate. It wasn't 2/3 throttle, I must admit it was balls out, but only managed to get to 4K RPM!

    Anyway, I span the engine over to demonstrate to my Mum how it works and noticed that cyl 3 sat 6mm ish lower than cyl 2.... And that would be the reason!!

    Also, there is more bad news too. It's snapped a bit off of the bottom of the cylinder bore. Hard to say how big, but looks to be about 6mm long by about 3 - 4 mm wide. Not sure whats best to do at this point to be honest. Doing research at the moment....

    Not the best of days....
    #75
  36. tankie2ndrtr
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    tankie2ndrtr Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    I feel your pain dude... see my Blade last summer.

    [​IMG]

    Forged time for youuuuuuuuuu :)
    #76
  37. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    oh no!!

    well at least you did find it else you would of chucked it all back together and been none the wiser untill you fired it up

    2 choices really mate, total strip down rebuild or dump another engine in there, both pretty costly but upside of rebuilding current engine is you'll know 100% that all is safe and sound with it, could you afford to leave it off the road for a few months and do it bit by bit or do you need both cars?
    #77
  38. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    Yeah, those are the 2 choices.

    New engine is expensive like you said, but there is a BAM engine on ebay with no turbo at the moment with 38,000 miles which may be the way forward.

    I'm just not sure what the deal is with ecu recoding etc....

    The main problem is the chunk missing from the bore.... thats a BIG problem....
    #78
  39. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    yer, what would be the deal with that, get it filled and machined to suit?

    or

    2.1 rebore ;)
    #79
  40. Welly
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    Welly VX220 SC Driver :)

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    [Feb 10, 2010]
    Tempted I must say buy the 2.1 rebore... however need to sit down and evaluate all options before deciding really.

    2.1 rebore + pistons + rods is a truck load of dosh....
    #80

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