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Mis-sold my car? No of Owners - Need help please!

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by Mike_P, Dec 16, 2005.

  1. Mike_P
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    Mike_P Member

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    [Dec 16, 2005]
    Hi guys,

    Hoping someone can help me here... The story is as follows.

    Bought my A3 3.2 QS in November 2004 as an ex-demo (so I would be 2nd owner)
    Come the end of November '04, the V5 drops through my door saying I'm the THIRD owner /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
    Naturally, I go and complain to the stealer, and all I get is bull - specifically the quote "it won't affect the value when you come to sell" after asking what happens if I need to p/x or sell it. I walked away because I liked the car at the time, and thought I'd probably have the car a while anyway.
    Roll on this month - time to sell because I need an oiler due to the miles I'm doing... I've got outstanding finance on it, but I'm prepared to take a hit because it'll save me money in the long run. But I'm not prepared to also chuck in an arm and a leg!! I've been getting silly quotes like £14k for it when book price should be £17.5k!!! Okay, I know it's a bad time of year, but didn't expect it to be that bad.
    Roll on today, when the Seat dealer I was at let slip it was because all the dealers he was calling don't want a car with 3 owners... so off I pop to the stealer I bought it from, and asked them to give me a valuation should I want to p/x or just sell the car back.
    He comes back with the usual "time of year etc" when I asked him why it was so low under book price. Then I asked nonchalontly if the number of owners would make a difference, to which he replied "Yes"

    After that, I asked to speak to the Sales Manager, but he was in a conference call, and I'm still waiting for him to ring me back....

    Is there anything I can do? Is there anything under the Sales of Goods or Trade Descriptions Act that will help me? I've been mis-sold this car and now I'm going to end up even more out of pocket /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

    Cheers in advance, and sorry for the essay!
    Mike

    PS - Am I right in saying ex-demo cars are sold as Approved Used Audi Cars? Because I didn't receive any certificate saying it's free from defects or hidden histories etc, or even a VMC report!!
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  3. h5djr
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    h5djr Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 16, 2005]
    The one time I have bought a second hand Audi it was an ex-demo A3 (8L) 1.8T Sport. If I remember correctly I got all the usual paperwork, including a VMC check certificate. Mine was definitely sold as an Audi Approved Used Car and the V5 came through with me a only the second owner.
    #2
  4. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Dec 16, 2005]
    does the number of owners make a difference to the value? yes and no. A low number of keepers proves nothing, especially not the condition, spec, age or reliability of the car.. BUT a low number of keepers makes it more desirable and easier to sell. This will make it worth more to the dealers.

    do you have any comeback? unlikely. They will take the line that you should have taken it up with them as soon as you found out - and i know you said you did. This will be the tricky part. 1. proving it was mis-sold (audi have an uncanny knack of marking all their documentation as "every effort has been made to make sure the details above are accurate, check with the dealer any information that may affect your decision to purchase". To this you can simply state that you did, and they confirmed the number of owners. But wheres the proof? man i hate it when they say that. What will also be said is that since you took the matter no further, you implied acceptance of the fact, and kept the car for a year. (DESPITE the fact you were fed a load of bull).


    Best bet is to take it up with Audi customer services if you get no joy.
    #3
  5. AndyMac
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    AndyMac Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Dec 16, 2005]
    Why did it take so long to get the V5, you should have been given it with the car and it clearly states how many owners.
    They will claim any mention of previous owners referred to private owners, i.e. not classing themselves as an owner. If you buy an ex-demo car you do refer to it as ex demo not secondhand, like it is practically new, used for dispay purposes only, when really it is just another secondhand car that's had a harder life than most for its age - lots of short thrashy journeys, no motorway miles etc.
    I'd be surprised if they provide any compensation, but worth pursuing in any case.
    Do you know what the difference in price would be if you were only the 2nd owner?
    The number of owners effects sale price really only on very new cars.
    People just assume it's a bit of a dog if it's had 3 owners in 18 months a bit like having too many jobs on your CV in a short space of time.
    Surely as it's still under warranty it can't make a dramatic difference
    #4
  6. imported_S_Line
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    imported_S_Line Guest

    [Dec 16, 2005]
    how the Hell can a EX demo have 3 owners !!!

    Thats Bad , really bad !

    a EX demo is 1 owner from new !

    The Dealer ! is the first owner and as its a ex demo you are the Second, being a second owner is bad enough but what the heck is going on here ?
    #5
  7. Mike_P
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    Mike_P Member

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    [Dec 16, 2005]
    Thanks for your replies guys /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    I thought I might not have any comeback, but wanted to check all avenues first...
    I really should've taken the matter further first time round... suppose you live and learn!

    Andy, that's the other thing I've just realised, I never got the green slip when I picked up the car. All I've got is a couple of receipts, a handover checklist (explain functions, full tank of fuel etc) and that's it.

    Surprise surprise, the manager never called me back /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif so might try pursuing it on Monday. It looked like I was going to have to wait til next year anyway... just sick of not having a life and spending my money on petrol! doh!

    Cheers again
    Mike
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  8. gizze
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    gizze Member

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    I would say that you were told that being the third owner would not effect residuals, however, having spoke to several dealers they have told you not only does it effect residuals but with 3 owners they would not want to take it on either, and point out one of the dealers was them.

    I will swap it for my nice economical A6 Sport avant if you like? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
    #7
  9. imported_hburnett
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    imported_hburnett Guest

    [Dec 17, 2005]
    I would gett your arse down to you local Trading Standards office and ask for advice and legal stance!
    h
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  10. Horchsense
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    Horchsense Member

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    Bit besides the point but I wouldn't trust any car dealer - my A4 was seriously smashed up summer 04 - car was repaired - 10k of work - every panel replaced - subframes steering the lot. Part exxed to main dealer for 17k and sold by main agent for 19.5k to a punter as "one owner" - true - but would you pay 19.5k for a car with that history???? Sorry MikeP - that probably doesn't help or make you feel any better at all...
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  11. mikep
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    mikep Member

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    Mike_P, sympathies, but not a lot can be done, the dealer will have caveated his deal with you up the wazoo.

    I think the only thing you should have done is reject the car when the V5 originally came through. But its too late now.
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  12. benw123
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    benw123 Moderator

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Bit besides the point but I wouldn't trust any car dealer - my A4 was seriously smashed up summer 04 - car was repaired - 10k of work - every panel replaced - subframes steering the lot. Part exxed to main dealer for 17k and sold by main agent for 19.5k to a punter as "one owner" - true - but would you pay 19.5k for a car with that history???? Sorry MikeP - that probably doesn't help or make you feel any better at all...

    [/ QUOTE ]
    £10k of work? Wow. What happened?

    Perhaps the reason the V5 was late was because it had already been sent away to have the second owner added to it. The dealer would have thought it was one owner. Who is marked as the second of owner of the car, and how long did they keep it? Might offer some clues.
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  13. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    strickly speaking, you may be the actual 2nd owner, just not on the paperwork.... the first may have rejected it at delivery.
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  14. simonl
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    simonl Member

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]
    strickly speaking, you may be the actual 2nd owner, just not on the paperwork.... the first may have rejected it at delivery.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    kind of academic though, the number of owners is the number of owners, period!

    One thing though, when dealers give you a part X price, they will use anything, and I mean anything to justify their sh!tty price.
    Whether it's number of owners, condition of tyres, stonechips... i've heard them all!
    Being two owners might have made a difference of a couple of hundred quid at best (which you'll struggle to get out of the stealer) but all in all, not that much.

    I ALWAYS get part ex quotes 2-3k behind book on cars that are 1-2 years old, regardless. One dealer even said my BMW coupe was worth 1500 less beacuse it was flat black not metallic black! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

    Try phoning around the country. I just bought a golf GTI from a brilliant dealer 200 miles away, their trade in prices were unbelievably better than my stealer, and they didn't feck around with poo quotes either.

    One last thing, it is quite possibly the WORST time of year too.
    #13
  15. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Dec 17, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]
    kind of academic though, the number of owners is the number of owners, period!


    [/ QUOTE ]


    'zactly, it's no excuse for the dealer to boosheet you at all. facts are facts.

    yep, and there certainly much better times for car sales other than the week before christmas.....
    #14
  16. trekbiker
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    trekbiker Member

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    [Dec 18, 2005]
    [ QUOTE ]
    how the Hell can a EX demo have 3 owners !!!

    Thats Bad , really bad !

    a EX demo is 1 owner from new !

    The Dealer ! is the first owner and as its a ex demo you are the Second, being a second owner is bad enough but what the heck is going on here ?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I would imagine that the dealerv sold this car as an ex-demo to another customer. Who then probably V5d it, then decided that they didn't likie it, and returned it to the dealer uner the 30 day user car return policy. it was then sold to you as an ex-demo(which it is!) but in the meantime, the other owner was registered on the V5. It might be worth contacting the last registered owner to confirm this, but i know of this happening before.
    i myslef bought an A4 avant from Vindis Audi 14 months ago. the car was 1 owner, and within the month, i identified that the car had had major paint. i got a full cash refund, but has in the interim period V5d it. hence when they went to sell it again, it would have an extra owner on it, even though i'd only driven it for about 3 week! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/idea.gif
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  17. cdb2
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    cdb2 Member

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    [Dec 18, 2005]
    TREKBIKER: "the car had had major paint" - do you mean accident damage or new paint job due to vandalism?

    Did you take it back under a 30 day warranty?
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  18. trekbiker
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    trekbiker Member

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    [Dec 18, 2005]
    not accident damage as far as i know, but it had all one side and the front. the Audi dealer knew nothing of it(apparently) and hadn't seen it.
    It went back under the 30 day clause and they were unable to find one the same. it was a A4 avant 2.5Q S with leather/Bose/cruise. not too many of them around for £15k at the time /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/comeon.gif
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  19. Mike_P
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    Mike_P Member

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    [Dec 20, 2005]
    Thanks for all your replies guys... I got fed up of trying to get hold of the manager in the end, managed to find a garage that would give me the p/x price I wanted... so I'm now the proud owner of a Seat Ibiza FR /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

    Cheers again
    Mike
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  20. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Dec 20, 2005]
    nice one on the purchase...

    out of interest, whats the difference between the 1.8 20vt Ibiza FR and the 1.8 20vt ibiza cupra R (apart from HP)?

    can we expect a chip'n'tune soon?
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  21. Mike_P
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    Mike_P Member

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    [Dec 20, 2005]
    Hi mate

    The Cupra has a different body kit (front/rear bumper, different exhaust, larger brakes) and a Group 16 insurance rating.. whereas the FR (diesel anyway) only has a group 8!

    I'm not going to chip her, or mod her actually (bar hands free kit).... got a house to mod now /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
    #20
  22. TDI-line
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    TDI-line Uber Post Whore

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    [Dec 21, 2005]
    Nice result there Mike, and good luck with modding your house. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
    #21
  23. Mikejervism
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    Mikejervism New Member

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    [Dec 22, 2005]
    I bought an ex demo A3 too. The V5 did show me as second owner though. Best bet is to contact the DVLA and for a small fee they will send you all the owner history etc.. for your car. My bet is that the Audi Dealer registered it twice!
    #22

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