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K03S waste of money on AGU?

AndrewUkR6 Dec 16, 2008

  1. AndrewUkR6

    AndrewUkR6 Member

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    been collecting together bits for my AGU 2000 1.8T for a ko3s swap for my ko3. Was planning to change the downpipe and custome remap.

    However having just spoken at length to a Custom Code dealer in brighton, he was convinced it wasnt worth swapping the turbo. Said the early model AGU A3's ECU's wernt very good to program (without VVT), and that id be much better changing the full exhaust, a stage 1 remap on the k03 = give me around 220bhp. I wasnt so sure on this but i dont work at a rolling road tuning company.

    I have to speak to custom codes also as he thought this remap (with k03s) would fall under a stage 3 remap, whereas i'd heard stage 2 elsewhere....

    Anyone got any oppinions?
     
  2. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    thats very optimistic on a ko3 mines a ko3s on a stage 2 revo aum engine code mines about that sort of power

    ive always been told your lucky to see 190bhp on a ko3
     
  3. AndrewUkR6

    AndrewUkR6 Member

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    well i thought so too, having read so many thread on k03's and k03s over the years. Would a full exahust take it over 190bhp?

    Just spoke with the guys at jabba and they had a very different oppinion - however didnt entireley think changing the downpipe and cat for a miltek was really worth it - maybe 3-4bhp...
     
  4. A3_Turbo

    A3_Turbo Swaying towards IHI....

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    I'd say go for it. Ive done the same on mine.

    I have a stage 2 Jabba Custom Map, K03S, Neuspeed TIP Miltek DP, And a Miltek turbo back system and also a Pro alloy Custom FMIC.

    Its running at 1.5 Bar of boost.

    Need to have it rolling roaded really im happy with it though :)

    Jason
     
  5. A3_Turbo

    A3_Turbo Swaying towards IHI....

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    That dealer in brighton is talking total ***** by the way. 220 Bhp on a K03 is Impossible!

    Get yourself a K03S and go from there.....
     
  6. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    i cant say the differance to be honest as i got mine all done at once

    the exhaust defently helps tho as the standard item is quite restrictive
     
  7. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    jay i think we should organise a mini meet soon so i can see what your cars made of :) jabba stage 2 v revo stage 2 place your bets lol
     
  8. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    the guy you spoke to is full of **** :)

    Having spent silly amounts of money and done days on end of research into the ko3s agu conversion, I can safely say is it VERY worth it.

    I got my agu totally standard, and had it revo'd after 6 months to 184bhp and 236lbft, the guys said the torque figure was one of the highest they had seen, and that the highest bhp they had ever seen from a ko3 was 193bhp.

    At all the dyno days I've been to I've never seen a ko3 make more than 187bhp, and everyone that came in mine said it felt very strong for a stage 1.

    I then fitted a ko3S, along with a front mount intercooler, a full milltek turbo back exhaust, and a set of forge hoses (TIP and DV cold side kit)

    That was then mapped with custom code phase 2. this isn't a TRUE custom map, but a file written to work on an AGU engine with bolt on mods and a ko3S. it's a fairly good map, but obviously not a TRUE custom map for your car.

    Mine mapped made 238bhp and 290lbft, and the difference was incredible. with the ko3S the car was SO much faster than when revo'd on the ko3, it's actually more economical, and when it's working right, it's VERY fast (quicker in a straight line than a remapped S3)

    However......

    It's not been without it's problems, and it still isn't working properly now!

    When first mapped, it had a boost leak (no fault of CC) which storm (the CC agent) fixed for me. When I picked the car up, after 30 minutes, it started making a high pitched squealling noise on boost over 10psi. Storm said this was probably a tiny boost leak, and that I just needed to tighten all the clamps and it would be fine.

    After spending around £120 on replacing all the silicon couplers on my FMIC and all the clamps, the noise was still there.

    At a RR day 1 week after mapping, the car made just 202bhp and 240lbft, and wasn't running well AT ALL.

    I whipped the TIP off to find the turbo was WRECKED, the thrust bearing had totally collapsed, with 4mm of play along the length of the shaft! the high pitched noise was the compressor wheel rubbing the inside of it's housing, not good!

    A new turbo later, and a rolling road day to find the car making 225bhp/290lbft, with power peaking at just 4500rpm, at which point the fuelling went dangerously lean.

    A trip back to storm, and 4 hours on their rolling road (FOC-very helpful) and they diagnosed a dying fuel pump, with very low fuel pressure causing the big lean out.

    Fitted an S3 fuel pump, and it FLEW, it really made a massive difference, and the car was perfect for about a month.

    Now, due to running very high boost (22psi) I assume, the spring in my actuator has gone weak, and the pressure within the exhaust housing is no over comming the actuator spring, and forcing the wastegate open, and I'm loosing boost again. I'm going to be fitting a forge adjustable actuator in the new year, and hopefully, that'll be the issue solved.

    Every so often now the actuator sticks, and it manages to make it's 22psi boost, and it really is very quick.

    Overall, I've had loads of problems, quite possibly due to my mileage (155k when mapped, now 175k) and purchasing a ko3S of unknown history, but I wasn't happy at all that Storm let the car go out with a near ruined turbo, although all credit to them for the day Dave and I spent with our cars on the rolling road to diagnose the fuel pump issues.

    Overall I am happy with the mapping and the service I got from CC, it wasn't without fault, but they seemed genuinely interested in solving the problem for me.

    All these conversions will have issues along the way, and I've gone for a high power figure with a lot of parts sourced on a budget, so I always expected things to go wrong.

    Overall I'd say the conversion is WELL worth it, and you can do it in stages to make things easier.

    If I were doing it again, I think I'd fit the FMIC and turbo back exhaust with the ko3 still in place, and get all things like boost leaks and exhaust fitment sorted first. Then I'd just swap out the ko3 for the ko3S and go for mapping.

    I'd recommend buying a turbo with known history, my first was from a dodgy guy in east london, who 'thought' it had come from a 75k TT, I paid £180 for it. My replacement was a silenced version from an 04 ibiza cupra, removed at a genuine 26k by a guy I know, and it's been perfect, and was a bargain at just £100!


    Sorry for the insanely long post! I just thought it may be of some use to you.

    If you're anywhere near plymouth over xmas, or portsmouth in the new year, I'd be happy to take you out in mine so you can decide for yourself if it's worth it.

    Nick
     
  9. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    The downpipe won't make much difference on the ko3, as it's already pushed for flow at 190bhp, and the downpipe isn't really restricting it too much. It will however allow the turbo to spool up much faster, and earlier.

    on the ko3S setup, you almost certainly need a decent downpipe to get good power, the standard downpipe is TINY, and if you look at it off the car it's very restrictive. The cat's arn't a problem, but the DP/cat is all 1 unit, so you have to pay the price. Otherwise you can get a 3'' DP/decat for around £100 from ebay.
     
  10. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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  11. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    jog my memory whats a forge tip?
     
  12. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    turbo intake pipe, it's the pipe that goes from the MAF onto the turbo inlet. the standard rubber trunk thing can collapse in on itself due to the negative pressure created by the turbo sucking the air in
     
  13. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    ahh ive not got one of them do they make a differance?
     
  14. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    slightly increased flow, some people claim 2-3bhp increases, and you hear the turbo spool up a lot louder, but it's mainly to stop the intake collapsing
     
  15. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    ill be looking for 1 of those then :)

    ive been looking at the pancake replacement pipe aswell lately thats gotta help the flow surly
     
  16. AndrewUkR6

    AndrewUkR6 Member

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    wow great replies guys. Very helpful... I'll get it done. Out of interest has anyone done this with the standard downpipe and cat, what results did you get? - i think i'll get one but their not cheap!

    Is their anything in what he said about the older ECU's not being very good to work with, and that the newer ones were much better with VVT. Thats why he didnt think it was worth doing - i had never heard this before.

    They are my closest CC dealer by a long way. Not sure what to do about remap now.
     
  17. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    where abouts are you mate? I'm in pompey so if you're anywhere near you can come for a spin in mine and make your own mind up!

    The older ECU's are different to work with, it's a far more simple system, and it doesn't have a map sensor, so relies entirely on the MAF and lambda values.

    It still works fine though, and is well worth doing.
     
  18. tel

    tel 4x4 junkie

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    i used the cat replacement pipe from ths i think there called very nice kit, but i will say if you do away with the cat get a cheapy code reader to turn your em light off as when you drive them really gently the light likes to come on which will pay for its self in 1 go if you go to a dealer every time
     
  19. AndrewUkR6

    AndrewUkR6 Member

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    Im in brighton, would be great to go for a spin in one thats been done.

    Bit worrying on the possibly fragility of the K03S! Has anyone had one running for a decent mileage mapped?

    I did consider a de-cat but didnt fancy swapping it over once a year. MOT's are a bit tighter thesedays....
     
  20. s3_kev

    s3_kev Stage2'd!!!!!!

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    dont take it to formula 1 even after fitting your new turbo, they dont have a rr anyway and they tried to charge me extra things when i was looking at getting mine mapped so ended up getting the custom code dealer to do mine on there mobile service. dont think id want him to mapp my car either as he obviosly dosent have to much experience with these engines,
     
  21. AndrewUkR6

    AndrewUkR6 Member

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    no i was having doubts - i thought they had a RR how can you do a custom map without one?

    Anyone got any reccommendations for someone to do the map in the SE area - around Brighton / Tunbridge wells...
     
  22. Nick101

    Nick101 Boost fiend

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    My car (joshw's old car) made 236.7 BHP and 228.2 ft.lbs with: K03s, ECS CAI, Forge 007P, Neuspeed FMIC, Blueflame Cat-back, Milltek Dp & Sports Cat, Forge TIP, Denso IK22s, Custom Code Phase 2

    Last RR it went on when Josh had it, it made 220.9 with a boost leak, so I was very pleased with the results of the new printout!
     
  23. Man Of Mystery

    Man Of Mystery Member

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    thats weird. ive got a 1999 1.8T and with a CCode map with just a exhaust upgrade, its pushing 195bhp on the rolling road and CCode gave me the print out.

    /me hugs my car :)
     
  24. Prawn

    Prawn My other car is a MINI!!!!

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    the 193 figure I quoted was from my local rolling road, not from jbs....

    that said, JBS's rollers seem to be VERY optimistic at best..... I know of a car that made 349bhp at jbs, make only 272 on a dyno dynamics roller.....

    it's all about the dyno lottery!
     
  25. AndrewUkR6

    AndrewUkR6 Member

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    from all this talk of Dyno's - can anyone reccommend a good remapper in the south of england, from experience.
     
  26. Custom-Code HQ

    Custom-Code HQ Member

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    Right then guys i'll clear a few things up

    The K03 turbo is on its limits at approx 205-210 bhp : to get this you would be looking at a FMIC,TIP,Uprated boost pipes,Induction kit,DV,Highflow downpipe and sports cat,performance exhaust system and Software

    The K03S turbo is on its limits at approx 240bhp : to get this you would be looking at the same spec as above.

    Small boost leaks,dodgy MAF's and weak fuel pumps will all contribute to poor running on any vehicle whether stock or tuned

    The K03s turbo is a worthwhile upgrade if you do the other mods to compliment it

    The software for the K03S upgrade would be a Phase 2

    If anyone would like any prices or information please feel free to give us a call on 01246 455004

    Hope this helps
     
    NewAudiNut likes this.

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