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Jeremy Clarkson, will he get the sack?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Fourmx, May 2, 2014.

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  1. Fourmx
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    Fourmx New Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    #1
  2. Ads

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    [Nov 24, 2014]

  3. Av4nt
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    Av4nt Well-Known Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    nah very doubtful. He's jsut been cleared of the Japanese car comment and that was blatant enough lol. He will be ok. If he does it would indeed be a joke cos I doubt he is a racist. At least he'd have a nice fortune to retire on early if it happens i guess...
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  4. oufc1976
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    oufc1976 Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I hope not. Top Gear is my life! :racer:
    #3
  5. sidibear
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    sidibear Looking for Zombies !! Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Just goes to prove the loony left that run the BBC have it in for him and are looking for anyway possible to make his life difficult.
    It was a rush, an out take, an unused version of what was aired, this is cutting room floor stuff.

    So, who dug it up, made it public, and why?
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  6. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Daily Mirror, I think.
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  7. Av4nt
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    Av4nt Well-Known Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Question is..do the BBC want to lose millions of viewers for something so stupid, that is not even proven to be 100% correct, NOPE
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  8. Ads
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    [May 2, 2014]
    To say it's an overreaction is an under reaction on your part. But that's another discussion in itself.


    Whether he is a racist or not is irrelevant.


    Also irrelevant. Just because it was never aired has nothing to do with it. It was during work, not in his own time.




    I'm not saying he should be sacked, but the BBC's hands could be tied on this one and have no choice other than to get rid of him.

    Let's be honest, it's another thing he shouldn't have said (well, kind of said) in a long line of other things he shouldn't have said.
    If the BBC sack him then I can understand why. They can't be seen as overlooking it, and are probably crapping themselves wondering what the next thing he'll eventually say will be.

    He's done three takes so he can use a poem that he and most people know carries a racist word in it - probably the most notorious racist word there is. So I think it's very poor judgement on his part to attempt to use it in a TV show that will be seem by millions.

    I like the guy, and watching his apology video, feel sorry for him - but being such a high profile TV personality he really needs to think about what 'jokes' he should and shouldn't make.
    #7
  9. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Ok, I'm 70 next birthday: I don't look my age, don't feel my age, and certainly don't act my age! But having lived through a period where the said rhyme was in common use, and others of a similar ilk; and having witnessed the invasion of political correctness being applied to issues that to me were never of any concern (and I've worked underground, on the factory floor, and in the boardroom), I do think there are more issues to worry about than this.

    I for one like Clarkson, he does seem to broadcast his most inner thoughts, and is to me very funny: and in this case, I believe his reasoning.

    And YES! I used to have a Robertson's golly as an infant, and a Muffin The Mule, and he was just that for me, then: I also went to school with others of differing nationalities and it was never an issue, so why do we make it an issue now... :friends:
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  10. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I'm with Ads on this.

    There is a danger with any media personality who build their reputation on being "edgy" and that over time, their belief in their own invincibility takes over from their ability to judge where the edge lies. In effect, they become a cariacature of themselves, and the only way to sustain the illusion is to keep pushing.

    JC has been to the edge - and stepped beyond it - so many times now that those who (like many of us on here) regard themselves as his fans are losing patience with him.

    Jezza; stop being a knob and start being a journalist again!
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  11. Shrek5
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    Shrek5 Well-Known Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I've listened to the clip and my immediate thought was that although the phonetics of it did bear a resemblance to the word I didn't think it was a deliberate attempt to use the word covertly.

    The subsequent Clarkson explanation for it seems to bear that out so, for me, I'll treat it as an unintentional set of sounds he used and I suspect he won't lose his job over this.

    Reading that back it sounds like an apologists attempt to cover for him but I promise it isn't, and it is just my opinion. :)
    #10
  12. s3dave
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    s3dave TFSI Hybrid Supporter

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Totally unacceptable but obviously they new that, it does seem to be about more of late, and i blame the African-American rap types that seem to love using it on a daily basis in song and sentence...:shrug:
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  13. Ads
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    [May 2, 2014]

    I'm afraid that his apology says exactly the opposite and blows your theory out of the water....


    He admits that he was... "well aware of the racist word in the best known version of the rhyme which I was extremely keen to avoid".

    He then went on to say... "in two of the takes I mumbled where the offensive word would occur".

    Then he says... "later I realised that in one of the mumbled versions it sounds like I've used the word that I was trying to obscure".


    I'm not sure his apology has done him any favours, to be honest.
    #12
  14. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Irrespective of what was said / wasn't said / might have been said, the nature of the human condition is what amazes me more than anything.

    I really struggle to get my head round people taking such overt offence to pretty much everything. Society seems conditioned to want to object and be in uproar about every slightly suspect soundbite, insinuation or action of anyone who managed to get onto that shiny screen in the corner of the living room. We've never lived in more moderate times in the UK, and yet every time I turn the TV on there is someone demanding an apology off someone for something whether it be race related, politically motivated, or something else.

    My view is that Clarkson isn't the sort of bloke to want to insight racial hatred or offence (in say the same way a UKIP MP might). A fuzzy haired middle aged idiot makes a verbal blunder and now all the life value that's gone before is irrelevant and he must pay with his job and reputation (and who decides to what level)? Maybe if he was a footballer he'd get away with it as they do kick a bag of air so very well.

    I personally don't want anyone (including rappers) mentioning that word on TV, but likewise whilst I'd caution against it at all costs I think we have much bigger pending social problems heading in our direction than this idiot.
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  15. Shrek5
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    Shrek5 Well-Known Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    This bit was my point though - he realised that the mumbled portion sounded like the original but he had not intended it to do so, just that the chosen mumbling sounds ended up sounding like it.

    That's my take on it anyway.

    If he really did intend to disguise the 'n' word by mumbling it then that's a different story and is not acceptable, but I don't think he did intend to use that word.
    #14
  16. Ads
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    [May 2, 2014]
    Just so it's clear.... I don't think he's racist.... I don't think he said it to offend... I don't think he should lose his job... I don't think people should send him death threats.... I don't think he should be killed by the press.

    I just think he should have thought about / should think about what he says before saying it. He's big and ugly enough to know what (rightly or wrongly) lights the touchpaper these days.



    It's this sort of view^^^ that worries me most.


    There are two specific camps when it comes to being offended by a racist, sexist, etc etc comment:

    One camp is full of people who just want to jump on the bandwagon and complain for the drama or because they know/think it's wrong but don't really appreciate why. This camp includes the media, in my opinion.

    The other camp is full of people who have been affected by 'the comment' throughout their lives in some way, and are justified in taking exception to hearing it.


    But what happens is - the first camp of people (the more vocal camp) shout and scream about this sort of thing at every opportunity and cause everyone else who is not in any of the camps to feel like pretty much what you have expressed in your post.

    Loads of times I have seen or heard someone who is justifiably offended by a racist/sexist/etc comment being dismissed as playing the race/sex/etc card. And this is mainly because of the amount of complaints that happen now days, and people are understandably tired of hearing about the same old thing again and again - and write it off as "here we go again".


    Basically, the REAL issues get lost among (and lessened by) all of the hype.



    But anyway.... LINK
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  17. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I think you're right Ads, I am at danger of being fatigued and emotionally de-sensitised by sensationalists who are determined to make news out of acts of gross stupidity rather than genuinely subversive actions. The risk of this is that it's effectively 'crying wolf', and as a result it distracts from bigger / more emotive issues.

    I see so much unpleasantry in the world these days, an old t**t muttering a subjective noise (possibly in error) doesn't even really hit my radar when I some of the atrocities going on.
    #16
  18. Adrian888
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    Adrian888 New Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Ever heard the phrase 'people in glass houses.....' etc?
    Last edited: May 2, 2014
    #17
  19. Clart
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    Clart Active Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    It's ok for gangsta rappers to use the N word, but if a white boy honky uses it then hes a racist... FFS!!!

    Who really gives a flying one...

    Much respect to the big man JC!!!

    Keep doing what you do Mr Clarkson, Legend!!!

    Peace...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzdcbO3XkGM
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  20. voorhees
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    voorhees Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Another well known name getting the sack for saying something he shouldn't have (Andy Gray)
    #19
  21. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I'm a big JC fan, and at the same time against the stupid direction of 'staged, edgy humour' Top Gear has been leaning towards. The biggest issue here (for me anyway) is the stupid, constant political correctness and over-sensitive reaction of everyone to everything. The vast majority of complaints around these sorts of things is old people sat at home with nothing better to do, or online forums/commenters with no requirement of accountability or even effort to "be outraged" and "demand action".

    Bottom line - if you're offended by anything then that's your problem. Unless someone is knowingly saying something overly personal explicitly to get a reaction out of you (then it's fair there should be a direct consequence for the 'attacker'), then be offended all you want but keep it to your self.
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  22. Av4nt
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    Av4nt Well-Known Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Well im sorry but you cant even make the word out ffs. cannot even be proven so how can he be sacked just because its in the "common" rhyme. Most children use the word TIGER or TIGGER ... sounds pretty much the same if you mumble it. what a load of utter bull this world is.

    Whatever next. infact its happened with the whole muslim and Subway scenario. Realy ffs?

    everything is getting just totally ridiculous. Soon enough one will not be able to step outside their own home without someone kicking up a fuss.

    I say start world war 3 and nuke the earth. Job Done
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  23. sidibear
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    sidibear Looking for Zombies !! Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 2, 2014]
    The Mirror got in some specialists to review it and even they were only 75% certain.

    Shows how hard someone is trying to give him a bad name. Its a witch hunt, pure and simple.
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  24. TonyH38
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    TonyH38 Active Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I totally agree I used to collect the robinsons golly pins should bring them back
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  25. Clart
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    Clart Active Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I don't care what was or wasn't said... Which car won the Eeny, meeny, miny, moe,test? I'm gonna buy one!
    #24
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  26. Clart
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    Clart Active Member

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Buy one even...
    #25
  27. CHEZ
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    CHEZ moderately amusing Supporter

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    [May 2, 2014]
    been sitting on the fence here watching this unfold!
    and to be frank,
    a, even if he did say that word, it is just a word! you hear it all the time in films and recordings!, what is that other old rhyme again?.. oh yeah sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt me!
    b, the guy, however fumbling and tongue in cheek he is/has been, has noted the potential unrest he has/could have caused here, and done his best to correct it.
    c, people are 'gona hate, always, period! so this bandwagon will always attract attention to the negative effect of such a subject.
    d, ultimately 'that' word is it really that offensive? like really? because i do not think so at all!
    just saying....
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  28. Ads
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    [May 2, 2014]
    With respect, you'd never be able to appreciate the full extent of its offensiveness. Not even all black people can. It's an 'experience' thing, more than a 'colour' thing.
    #27
  29. warren_S5
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    [May 2, 2014]
    Ads, can I ask a question. Please don't take offence at this as I'm hoping it will help me to understand better. I have a mate from Zimbabwe, a hulk of a bloke called Sitho, one of the nicest blokes I've ever met. He is black (stating the obvious here but I don't want any misinterpretation), and he refers to his mates from country of birth as my ******, and quite openly.

    Likewise rappers seem to use the same word fairly liberally. I grew up listening to Ice T / NWA / Ice Cube / Public Enemy and these guys seem quite comfortable in using the word. Track 9 of Ice T's album OG is called 'Straight up ******', and he dictates that in his opinion this is exactly what he is.

    The piece of the jigsaw I'm missing here is when does a word that is deemed 'appropriate' for use by certain ethnic groups to use between themselves become so indecently and unforgiveably offensive if used by another group? I feel a bit embarrassed I don't already know the answer to that, but then I'm not sure that many people would. If you can shed any light, but appreciate if it's a difficult subject and not one you'd wish to broach publicly. I'm a great believer knowledge is the great enlightener.
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  30. CHEZ
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    CHEZ moderately amusing Supporter

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    [May 2, 2014]
    hardly the same that though is it?
    calling a female the ultimate derogatory personal insult is not cricket!
    for any race or creed....

    and your right Adam i cannot relate to the later as well as you know i can't mate!,
    however,
    i have mixed race, jamaican, indian, japanese, vietnamese, korean, african plus other race friends!
    they are tolerant of life's misdemeanors however harsh!
    and i would put my left testicle on the bet, if i phoned, text or said to my jamaican friend that lives in jamaica the 'n' word, he would not bat an eye lid, or take offence! he may even lol :( who knows?


    back on topic, though, jezza is not a racist, he is old, that is all!
    #29
  31. Ads
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    Ads License to drive

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    [May 2, 2014]
    The best way to answer this is to give an example...

    If you were obese you probably wouldn't have an issue commenting on another obese person's size or calling them fatty as a joke or a term of endearment... And vice versa. But if you were of an average slim build I'm guessing you wouldn't call a fat person anything like that. Or if you were fat and a slim person called you fatty you'd be offended.

    Another example... A gay guy calling another one a 'homophobic' name. A heterosexual guy probably wouldn't.

    The list goes on, there a plenty of examples.

    Think about that and you'll probably have an answer to your question.

    Going back to the word nigger... Think about the origins of the word, and how it was used by people outside of the ethnic group. That's why a non black using it has become one of the biggest no no's out there.
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  32. Ads
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    [May 2, 2014]
    I took that bit of my post out before you replied. Just thought it would open up another topic.

    But now we're on it.... Why is calling a woman the ultimate derogatory insult worse than calling a black person the ultimate derogatory insult?


    Maybe your friends would be ok with it, but plenty of friends out there wouldn't be.

    I'm mixed (black, white, Chinese) and I've experienced racism from all sides... from black, white and Chinese people lol.
    Racism aimed towards me doesn't bother me, I'll just give as good as I get. But I fully understand how others can be highly offended by it.
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  33. CHEZ
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    CHEZ moderately amusing Supporter

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    [May 2, 2014]
    ok let's get this thread back on track!


    step down malcolm X! :beerchug:
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  34. Ads
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    Ads License to drive

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    [May 2, 2014]
    It's Mr. Luther King, if you don't mind. :friends:
    #33
  35. warren_S5
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    [May 2, 2014]
    Fair shout Ads, I did wonder whether there may be anything more subversive about the term based around the horrific slave trading era (my knowledge of this level of history is seriously lacking), but completely take your explanation on board, so thank you.

    I'm mixed race (white - US/UK), and I grew up in Spain, but because I attended a boarding school in Britain you'd have a job to tell I'm not a fully fledge Brit! I'm not quite sure what the hell that makes me. My folks always say Mongrel!
    Last edited: May 2, 2014
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  36. Nilz
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    Nilz Defo worth the wait :)

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    [May 2, 2014]
    I have also been sitting back and watching this too, its a difficult and delicate subject.

    When I was at school racism was quite rife and to hear a racist term against blacks and asians was quite upsetting and hurtful. Being on the receiving end of it, I can appreciate the offence it can cause some people.

    I know people that have never had to experience and cant see what the issue is with it.

    Ads gave a good example above about only being able to experience it and understand it if you are directly affected by it.

    As for Jezza, he is in the public eye, whether he likes it or not, he needs to be a bit more careful with what he says.
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  37. MartayMcFly
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    MartayMcFly Well-Known Member Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [May 2, 2014]
    Actually, it's Dr. King.
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  38. Ads
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    [May 2, 2014]
    You might want to research that one.
    #37
  39. simers
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    [May 3, 2014]
    I can see why so many people are upset and annoyed by it.. His choice of phrase was well misplaced.. Back in the day when I was in school which isn't that long ago (13 yrs ago I finished) there wasn't many coloured people around.. Now the country is full of them and I see on a daily basis what that brings.. My partners father is goin out with a coloured woman and she has 2 kids from previous relationship and I hear wat people say about them.. It wrecks my head because they are the same as everyone else.. I'm not a racist by any means as I treat everyone the way I like to be treated..
    Jezzas choice of phrasing and wording leaves a lot to be desired as has already been said he is a public figure and watched all over the world.. He should be sacked IMO even tho he makes the show..
    #38
  40. Av4nt
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    Av4nt Well-Known Member

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    [May 3, 2014]
    THIS ^

    Purely because he is a celeb known to climb the borders of whats right and wrong to say on air.. the bandwagon jumpers as mentioned up above have indeed jumped on this one. Films and TV, songs etc all use this word day in day out. Most in the black communities call use it so casually toward each other that it probably goes unnoticed in most arenas.. until its a celebrity ofc..

    its been massivley overhyped its just stupid.

    PS: When I saw the clip i remember watching the actual episode and remember trying to make out the car badges and not even paying attention to what he was rhyming about. If someone actually sat and started listening to the rhyme so intently that they thought he used the word...clearly they listened so many times they eventually heard the word in their tiny brain enough to make them believe thats what he said. Load of rubbish
    Last edited: May 3, 2014
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  41. Andy1608
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    Andy1608 Active Member

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    [May 3, 2014]
    TV ratings are too good for them to sack him
    #40
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