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Is it worth an extra 5p

Discussion in 'General Automotive Chat' started by andy110m, Aug 25, 2009.

  1. andy110m
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    andy110m Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    Hi Guys,

    Now I know this debate is going to be down to personal opinion but is the extra 5p a litre for 98RON fuel worth it over the standard 95RON.

    My car is completely standard and the reason I ask is, will I get better MPG on that fuel day to day and secondly, I'm taking a caravan (I know I know but its a one off) down south about 200 miles each way and was thinking super juice might make towing slighly easier.

    Whats the thoughts of the masses?
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  3. Blue_Thunder
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    Blue_Thunder Active Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    If you're running a turbo engine then I would recommend always using premium to prevent knocking. My S4 has always been run on premium.

    Towing a caravan will put a lot more load on the engine so you will be having to use more power, which means more boost, higher combustion temperatures and more chance of knocking.
    #2
  4. Shink
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    Shink New Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    If your engine is designed to run on 98RON then it should get 98RON. A lower RON reduces power and increases wear.

    I also found I got about a 10% increase in MPG by switching to Shell V-Power.
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  5. Siena
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    Siena Active Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    Modern engine managements will compensate for lower octane fuels, though at the expense of reduced engine output.

    As long as the knock sensor/s is/are working, it will not harm the engine to run on lower octane, unless the manufacturer specifically recommend a higher octane, and no other substitute.

    Example is if the manual states "minimum octane 98 RON", then I'd go with 98 or higher, if available. If it states "minimum octane 95 RON", you can go higher or lower.

    If there's the risk of engine damage by running it on 95 octane fuel, the manual will clearly state "avoid prolonged high RPM, till you can fill up with the recommended 98 RON".

    I often ran my RS2-engined Coupe quattro with 95, it was highly modified, from S2 spec to exceed the 315hp of the RS2, and made 426 / 411.3 ft-lbs. With 7 years of hard driving, often on the Continent, and often on 95 RON, it suffered no wear issues, bearing in mind the Motronic system used on the B4 cars was nowhere as sophisicated as that used on B5 upwards.

    Running 95 RON will however make the car thirstier, as it'll require a greater throttle angle to make the same speed that could be achieved on 98, with less of a throttle angle. That was the only issue I had.

    Andy, you don't state the year and model of your car.
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  6. Tavli
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    Tavli Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    Hi Guys

    I use the higher octane fuel every fill up, tests show that £ for £ it costs no more when you take into account MPG over the 2 fuels, however the main reason I use it is better performance and the additives which are in the fuel help to keep the engine clean and running smoother.

    Tav!!
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  7. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    On the flip side, if the cars designed and mapped to run 95 octane, you'll probably use more fuel running it on 98, because the management wont advance the timing enough to take account of the higher octane, which means you'll actually get less specific power out of a litre of 98 than you would a litre of 95.

    Performance cars like the S4 are mapped for 98 (as suggested by the fuel flap sticker) so will run maximum advance on 98 then retard if you run it on 95. The 1.8T however only recommends 95, which probably means running it on 98 is a waste of money, as it will simply run the timing for 95 and you'll get less power.
    #6
  8. gaz71
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    gaz71 1.8T Quattro Sport AJL

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    True but my 1.8tqs has the AJ L engine and recommends 97 RON with reduced power if 95 RON used. I use Shell V- Power.
    #7
  9. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    Mostly 98 here. I can tell the difference between the two. My car is mapped for super, but occasionaly my local station doesnt have super so she has to have a small amount of super to get me to somewhere that sells "proper" petrol

    Smoother running, and more MPG on the super. Please however bare in mind it may take a full tank full before your managment adjusts to make full use of the decent fuel
    #8
  10. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    Interesting, presumably related to the higher power output, our 1.8TS just says 95.

    Presumably if the cars mapped the timing will be pushed a little more too, so 95 might be a bit marginal on a chipped 1.8T too.

    My old Nova had a 1.6 16v motor which ran about 11:1 compression ratio, and you could really feel the difference in that running on 98. All the flat spots would vanish and it would pull much better. Didnt stop me running it on 95 most of the time though :p
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  11. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    ^^ I bet she pinked like a good en^^ lol

    Deffo worth it even on a std car IMO
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  12. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    It had a knock sensor, so just wound the timing off.

    Thats probably what created all the flat spots though!
    #11
  13. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    I have doen the tests with empty tanks on mine (relatively unmolested 180bhp 1.8tqs)
    vpower didn't feel noticeably different but BP Ultimate did!

    fecking nearly ran into the back of someone sliding into a gap from a motorway slip road!
    much better response from the esso **** that I had to fill up with previously!

    would love to see what tesco 99 is like but can't find any.

    think of it this way at the most 60 litres is all you are getting in there. 5p a litre more and you are spending what you would normally spend on a pint in any bar in London.
    drink one less pint and give the old girl what she deserves!!
    #12
  14. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    When I switched my old 2.8Quattro from standard unleaded to Shell V-Power (it was still called Optimax then), I immediately saw an improvement in fuel consumption of about 10% on average. So, it paid for itself. But the car also seemed to run a lot more smoothly, and throttle response and pick up were sharper too.

    When I changed to my current B6 2.4, I have only ever run it on V-Power, so don't have any side-by-side comparisons.
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  15. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    The BP and Vpower are better IMO than the 99 ron Tesco stuff. My car is definatly better on BP and Shell than Tesco, not sure why !
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  16. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    10% improvement in fuel economy if thats acutally possible seems very worthwhile.

    I'm going to try a tank and see what happens, the A4's never had super in it!
    #15
  17. Blue_Thunder
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    Blue_Thunder Active Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    I had run my S4 on V-power for about 2 years. Can't remember what made me start using Tesco's 99, but ended up getting a few tanks worth and noticed a definite (albeit modest) increase in miles per tank.

    Tesco 99 is now my fuel of choice. It's also usually 1-2p cheaper than V-power near me, and if you spend £50 at Tesco you get an extra 5p off a litre.
    #16
  18. Nez
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    Nez Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    I use the V-power and I am very happy with it :) and for sure I get more fuel economy then 95 :) and S4 runs very nice with V-Power :)
    #17
  19. andy110m
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    andy110m Member

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    Thanks for the great response guys.

    Siena, my car is a 2000 S4 Avant. The previous owner told me he'd tried super and not noticed any difference and advised me to buy standard and save some money. That tried in to my experience of super in a 1.6 FSI A2.

    Byzan A4 makes an interesting point that I'd never considered. How long does it take for the ECU to register the change of fuel? Is it possible to plug it in and tell it.

    The reason for asking that is the car has half a tank of standard in it. I'm towing the caravan this weekend so even if the tank gets down to near empty its not going to do any good to put super in because the car won't release until the hard work is over. Or is that not how it works?

    What is the consenus on the best super? V-power and Ultimate seem to get a good review.
    #18
  20. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    My S3 likes V-Power, not too sure why, but Ultimate from BP(Soold oy of V-Power over the road) seems really frothy(cleaning agents?) and I couldn't put more than half a tank in my S3 to try out, as it kept clicking the filler pump thing. Tried a tank of Tesco's 99RON also, when I was down in Guildford once, felt pretty quick on the motorway @80+(kmh) and exhaust sounded louder too, on the way to Power Engineering for a rolling road meet, but on the rollers, it didn't make any more BHP than I've seen on other rolling roads.
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2009
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  21. rasA4
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    rasA4 Four Rings Mafia Specialist

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    [Aug 25, 2009]
    what are you guys paying for v power and bp ultimate?
    #20
  22. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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  23. S4twiggy
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    S4twiggy Fully Certified Detailer!!

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    [Aug 26, 2009]
    so i take it i need to run my S4 on v-power or ultimate then lol never tried it before but shall let yall know if i see any improvements
    #22
  24. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 26, 2009]
    The garage around the corner from me does a litre of gold plated Ultimate for £1.18 A LITRE !!!!
    #23
  25. emery1990
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    emery1990 Active Member

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    [Aug 26, 2009]
    my v-power at the monent is 1.07 last time i checked, but yday tesco 99 was 1.07! And with the tqs as it has the k03s i presume, the manual says 97 ron, and nothing about the 95 ron..whereas the normal 1.8t, says 97 ron, but 95 aswell, but recomneds the best fuel available. Just use v-power or bp, as i only fill up littkle amounts, i proablly spends an extra £1 on fuel when using v-power!
    #24
  26. Nilz
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    Nilz Defo worth the wait :)

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    [Aug 26, 2009]
    When I first got the car it had been run on normal unleaded, so I did so, until a couple of weeks later and I tried V Power, it took about 2 tank fulls for me to notice the difference, but believe me I did, the car felt so much more responsive and the miles I get out of it has increased quite well too, I do mainly motorway miles, and I have seen off a full tank, sometimes upto 50+ more miles, which is cracking!!!

    In response to RasA4 - I filled up the other day with V Power for 109.9 a litre!!!!

    Way too high!!! Even if it was the 99p mark would be good enough for me :)
    #25
  27. Just Plain Old
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    Just Plain Old Active Member

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    [Aug 26, 2009]
    I use BP ultimate in my 4.2 S4..... I have used normal stuff on occasion,,, can't say I really noticed much difference, between **** and ****, fuel economy wise mind......

    I do remember when I had an EVO VI, which everyone always said 'must' be run on 98 RON,,,, that I put normal stuff in (never pay attention to the perceived wisdom me!), and actually thought it sounded a lot louder (rougher some might say!), than with the high octane stuff........ Now that was a gas guzzler......
    #26
  28. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Aug 27, 2009]
    I've seen you drive mate, the letters 'mpg' is not in your vocabulary is it? :):racer::)
    #27
  29. Andy D
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    Andy D Member

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    [Aug 27, 2009]
    I have an A4 2.0T Quattro and normally get the petrol light flicking on about 330 miles with tesco 99.

    when running BP Ultimate or v-power I'm getting nearer the 360 miles per tank which is worth in my opinion as the car feels as if it likes the BP and Shell stuff better.

    When I was running diesels I done a few different fuekl tests and found the BP and shell premium diesels also gave a better results than the tesco stuff.

    I'll look out the chart showing the results I posted on another forum if anyone wants a butchers.
    #28
  30. andy110m
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    andy110m Member

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    [Aug 29, 2009]
    Hi Guys,

    I filled her up with Tesco 99 today. I tried to run it as low as I dared before filling up. The mileage computer said 10 miles but the needle seemed to show 1/8th left. Seemed odd.

    The reason for choosing tesco, £1.07 a litre. V-Power £1.18 and BP £1.16. I'll run a few tanks though her and see how we get on. I'll report back in a week or two.
    #29

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