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Huge black smoke, and no horse power in acceleration

Discussion in 'Audi S4/A4/A4 Cab (B7 Chassis)' started by iucle, Jul 17, 2013.

  1. Wrath
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    Wrath Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 20, 2013]
    I would empty the fuel from the fuel filter and see what it contains. It *should* be completely clear like the sample from the pump, however I think it won't be. If there is a small amount of thicker liquid it is going to get stuck in the filter and choke the engine. If you can get it back to your house and leave it idling, I suspect it will eventually just stop.
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  2. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 20, 2013]
    I just towed the car back home and tried idling as you suggested, it won't keep idling more than 5 sec, starts and then chokes a little and stops...
    #42
  3. Wrath
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    Wrath Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 20, 2013]
    I'm betting a matchbox you've got something in your fuel system and the fuel filter has probably got blocked thus starving the engine. Empty the filter into a glass tomorrow and look, it theoretically wouldn't take much to starve it.
    At least it has started and pinpoints to something, I have looked at the pic of the fuel from the old filter a few times and it isn't right.

    As to the turbo, I'm not sure why this doesn't work but it shouldn't stop the car idling. I suspect the turbo might be linked to the MAF but you might have to get someone with VCDS to diagnose that.
    #43
  4. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 20, 2013]
    I think I will be able to diagnose with VCDS on Monday, but will do the fuel test tomorrow, if it's dirty, would you suggested refilling the filter with new fuel and starting again to see?
    Or tank cleaning would be the only solution?
    Thanks Wrath!
    #44
  5. Wrath
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    Wrath Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 20, 2013]
    No probs mate, happy to help :)

    Yeah, even it if doesn't look dirty, if you can empty the filter, fill with new fuel and start her up. I'm guessing she will start and probably idle for longer than 5 seconds. If she does then you have something/**** in your fuel system and it's difficult to gauge how much. If she idles for 10 seconds without stopping then apply some revs. It might be a small amount of contamination and the revs might kick it through.

    If it fails again then I reckon you need the tank drained and the fuel system cleaned. Fingers crossed it pushes it through and you don't need to.
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  6. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 20, 2013]
    Cheers!
    Will try ad do it tomorrow morning and let you know!
    Fingers crossed indeed.... :)
    #46
  7. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    Hey Wrath!
    Tried taking out the fuel filter today and emptying, here is the picture:
    IMG_8770.jpg
    It doesn't have the debris as the old fuel filter had, but still has the blueish colour at the top.
    So I put new diesel in the filter and started it again.
    It idled for 8-10 sec and then stopped again. So I tried starting it again, ad same point as yesterday, 3-4sec, and stops....
    I'll have to VCDS it tomorrow, I suppose there is no other way...
    Can it be injectors? Got dirty from earlier fuel in the system?

    Cheers!
    #47
  8. Paul B7
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    Paul B7 Active Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    This gets more and more curious, keep us posted and good luck with resolving your issues soon.
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  9. Wrath
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    Wrath Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    It can't be the injectors as they would get it after the filter although you don't know how much of the contaminant is getting to them. I suspect the filter is doing it's job and stopping whatever it is from going through, the engine can't get the fuel so starves. The fact that the engine was on for longer than 5 secs after putting fresh fuel in the filter shows it must be the contaminant.

    There is a bluish tinge as you note, someone hasn't put antifreeze in your fuel tank have they? I don't know if the fuel tank has a drain plug but it looks like you need to drain the tank, clear the fuel lines and, most likely, have a fresh filter.

    Then needs to have VCDS plugged in and error checked which may pick up the problem with the turbo but if your EGR is that clagged, it could be the turbo was clagged and may have stuffed it.

    Keep us updated.
    #49
  10. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    As for the antifreeze, there shouldn't be anyone who put that stuff in the tank as I filled it myself all the time and at night the car is closed, therefore don't think anyone has put it in the tank...
    Right know I am waiting for a member from the forum that lives near me to hook up the vcds and see what codes come out....
    As for the tank, I suppose that I'll have to go to a garage and see what they can do, have no idea how to drain it, and I have 30+ litres in it right know :)
    #50
  11. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    A guy came to my house with the original VCDS cable and we run the fault codes, weren't able to run the whole autoscan, as it gave an error every time we did when it reached 17th section...
    But that's what we got:

    Sunday,21,July,2013,16:51:16:11303
    VCDS Version: Release 11.11.6
    Data version: 20121223






    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------




    Chassis Type: 8E - Audi A4 B6/B7
    Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 0F 11 15 16 17 18 36 37 45 46 55 56 57 65 67
    69 75 76 77

    VIN: WAUZZZ8E56A061801 Mileage: 252070km/156629miles
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 01: Engine Labels: 03G-906-016-BKE.lbl
    Part No SW: 03G 906 016 FE HW: 028 101 212 7
    Component: R4 1,9L EDC G000SG 9820
    Revision: 12345678 Serial number: AUX6Z0E0072331
    Coding: 0000071
    Shop #: WSC 00590 210 87518
    VCID: 6BD198F549A9D740E59


    5 Faults Found:
    17055 - Cylinder 1 Glow Plug Circuit (Q10)
    P0671 - 000 - Electrical Fault
    Freeze Frame:
    RPM: 0 /min
    Torque: 90.3 Nm
    Speed: 0.0 km/h
    Load: 0.0 %
    Voltage: 11.93 V
    Bin. Bits: 00101000
    Temperature: 9.0∞C
    Bin. Bits: 00110000


    17056 - Cylinder 2 Glow Plug Circuit (Q11)
    P0672 - 000 - Electrical Fault
    Freeze Frame:
    RPM: 0 /min
    Torque: 90.3 Nm
    Speed: 0.0 km/h
    Load: 0.0 %
    Voltage: 11.93 V
    Bin. Bits: 00101000
    Temperature: 9.0∞C
    Bin. Bits: 00110000


    17057 - Cylinder 3 Glow Plug Circuit (Q12)
    P0673 - 000 - Electrical Fault
    Freeze Frame:
    RPM: 0 /min
    Torque: 90.3 Nm
    Speed: 0.0 km/h
    Load: 0.0 %
    Voltage: 11.93 V
    Bin. Bits: 00101000
    Temperature: 9.0∞C
    Bin. Bits: 00110000


    17058 - Cylinder 4 Glow Plug Circuit (Q13)
    P0674 - 000 - Electrical Fault
    Freeze Frame:
    RPM: 0 /min
    Torque: 90.3 Nm
    Speed: 0.0 km/h
    Load: 0.0 %
    Voltage: 11.93 V
    Bin. Bits: 00101000
    Temperature: 9.0∞C
    Bin. Bits: 00110000


    16787 - EGR Valve (N18)
    P0403 - 000 - Malfunction
    Freeze Frame:
    RPM: 0 /min
    Torque: 0.0 Nm
    Speed: 0.0 km/h
    Duty Cycle: 0.0 %
    Voltage: 11.93 V
    Mass Air / Rev.: 0.0 mg/str
    Duty Cycle: 0.0 %
    Bin. Bits: 00000000


    Readiness: 0 0 0 0 0


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 8E0-910-517.lbl
    Part No SW: 8E0 910 517 D HW: 8E0 614 517 AK
    Component: ESP8 front H05 0120
    Revision: 00000000 Serial number: 00000000000000
    Coding: 0004401
    Shop #: WSC 06335 000 00000
    VCID: 285BA7F99BDF3C5848B


    No fault code found.


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 8E0-820-043.lbl
    Part No: 8E0 820 043 AJ
    Component: A4 Klimaautomat 2831
    Coding: 00000
    Shop #: WSC 00000
    VCID: 69DDE2FD1355C550975


    No fault code found.


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 8E0-907-279-8EC.lbl
    Part No: 8E0 907 279 K
    Component: int. Lastmodul ECE 0504
    Coding: 00001
    Shop #: WSC 06335
    VCID: 3A7F6DB12673BEC82EF


    No fault code found.


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 15: Airbags Labels: 8E0-959-655-94.lbl
    Part No SW: 8E0 959 655 G HW: 8E0 959 655 G
    Component: Airbag 9.41 H11 3530
    Revision: 91H1135 Serial number: 0036M006A3AH
    Coding: 0033622
    Shop #: WSC 06335 000 00000
    VCID: 3B7168B57A4987C0359


    No fault code found.


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 16: Steering wheel Labels: 8E0-953-549.lbl
    Part No: 8E0 953 549 Q
    Component: Lenks·ulenmodul 0801
    Coding: 02041
    Shop #: WSC 06335
    VCID: 418D1A5D4BA5ED106F5


    No fault code found.


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 17: Instruments Labels: 8E0-920-9xx-8EC.lbl
    Part No SW: 8E0 920 951 B HW: 8E0 920 951 B
    Component: KOMBI+WFS 3 H12 0110
    Revision: 0110 Serial number: AUX6Z0E0072331
    Coding: 0006401
    Shop #: WSC 00189 210 92914
    VCID: 295DA2FD83D50550575


    No fault code found.


    The second time we run the auto search, the same codes came out, with the EGR malfunction, but wasn't able to do the whole run, the guy told me it never happened to him.
    Try starting it without the MAF sensor plug, it idled for a 3-4 sec and stopped again, so it shouldn't be the MAF sensor.

    What do you suggest guys? It's becoming a big PIA and don't know how to resolve it....
    Egr valve faulty? Should start and run anyway...
    Could it be fuel pump? But no fault code comes up...
    #51
  12. Wrath
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    Wrath Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    I'm hoping someone else will jump in here but it looks like you have a glowplug problem/harness problem as well as EGR fault. By the looks of it the codes may not be too serious, Cylinder # 1 glow plug fault code ..... - TDIClub Forums

    I am concerned VCDS couldn't finish it's scan, can't remember what the 17th module is in VCDS. You got water floating around under your battery or signs of corrosion anywhere in the engine bay?

    The EGR not working shouldn't stop your car from operating, it's more likely to cause shaking and juddering.
    #52
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  13. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 21, 2013]
    No water in the engine bay whatsoever, or the battery, all dry and clean.
    What do you think about the EGR valve? Does it need replacing?

    No other fault codes, but idling is still a problem, I think I should go to a garage and see what they say, don't even know if the tank needs cleaning, or could it be the fuel pump? the one that pumps fuel from the tank?
    #53
  14. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 22, 2013]
    I went to a German car specialist today, and they said to bring it in.
    I quickly told them the problem and they said that the fuel filter shouldn't be a problem and the colour is normal as it mixes with oil...
    From the words they couldn't tell the problem and said to bring it in. So I'll do so and keep you guys updated.
    Cheers!
    #54
  15. iucle
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    iucle Member

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    [Jul 23, 2013]
    Hi guys!
    Just an update on my car.
    It's been fixed!!
    The Egr valve was the problem. The fact that it was not idling was due to the gases that were choking the engine as the Egr valve wa constantly open.
    The guys from the garage tested it by blanking the Egr valve with a metal plate that blocked the gases going to the EGr valve.
    Changed to a new OEM audi Egr valve and know the car is as new!!! Very responsive, quick and no smoke on high revs.
    Paid £250+vat for the valve and almost £100 for labour, with £400 overall, but happy as the original Audi part comes with 2 years warranty :)

    As for the fuel colour I was getting, they said it is not a problem at all as it can be worse than that and the blue-ish colour is due to the oil mixture, so nothing to worry about.
    Hope that all this helps someone in future.... and if the Audi specialist says that with the Egr valve not broken the engine should still work, it is not true, as in my case, when it stays open, it will choke on itself and won't idle.
    #55
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  16. DieselJake
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    DieselJake God Mode

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    [Jul 24, 2013]
    Probably same with mine then, cheers, haven't messed with the EGR but will now blank it and have it mapped out.
    #56
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