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How to 'ME7 conversion' your AEB/AJL.

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by Bradderz_1988, Feb 17, 2014.

  1. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Basically im still waying up this setup as i think it will be more suited to my needs, basically i have been searching on this and getting a list of bits needed (please feel free to add parts needed and even better those that have done it post part numbers if known)

    I assume that all this can be taken from a 02' plate passat 1.8T AWT ??
    i have this up to know :-

    ECU
    ENGINE HARNESS
    PEDAL BOX WITH DBW ACCELERATOR
    PEDAL TO FUSEBOX/ECU LOOM
    THROTTLE BODY W/BOLTS (Does this match manifold intake size ??)
    MAF SENSOR + HOUSING (TT/S3 i believe will work)
    MAP SENSOR (will a B6 FMIC intercooler or Passat one with sensor location fit the A4 B5 ??)
    ENGINE CONTROL RELAY (what no or part number ?)
    02 SENSORS
    N112 & N249 (i belive these just need to be plugged in for the ecu to see they are there)

    now how do you run EGT on these ive been looking at the AEM uego system ? Also any pointers/tips are welcome.

    i sort of want this to turn into a proper 'HOW TO ME7' thread as theres not much out there !!
    #1
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  3. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Following notes from memory:

    ECU
    Yep, any ME7.5 wideband ECU will work, i got one from a Golf and one from a Skoda Automatic!

    ENGINE HARNESS
    Certain passats have one that mostly drops in, not sure on the date range though, i can look this up. You need to move some pins around for the power feeds and add one extra feed on the car side of the harness. The harness i have is a narrowband one, so i need to add some extra wires for the lambda.

    PEDAL BOX WITH DBW ACCELERATOR
    Yep, or you can use a prefacelift S4 sensor on the stock pedal box.

    PEDAL TO FUSEBOX/ECU LOOM
    Yep, white plug from ECU box and connectors for clutch, brake and throttle body.

    THROTTLE BODY W/BOLTS (Does this match manifold intake size ??)
    Yep, same size

    MAF SENSOR + HOUSING (TT/S3 i believe will work)
    If you use a wideband 2.5" one it will drop streight into the airbox and is good for 270-280hp IIRC. If you want more power you can use the TT/S3 one and hack the box around.

    MAP SENSOR (will a B6 FMIC intercooler or Passat one with sensor location fit the A4 B5 ??)
    You can get little bits of pipe with a sensor boss welded in.

    ENGINE CONTROL RELAY (what no or part number ?)
    Not sure on this, my loom came with a relay

    02 SENSORS
    Wideband front O2 required. I'll be coding out the rear one.

    N112 & N249 (i belive these just need to be plugged in for the ecu to see they are there)
    You can just resistor these out AFAIK.


    I've got everything i need to do my car, i just need a base map written for the ECU so it matches my combination of MAF, injectors etc.
    #2
  4. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Nice write up mate. You have remembered more than I knew when I did it. Lol
    #3
  5. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Ideally i could do with part numbers as i cant get elsawin to run on my laptop to check pin layouts etc

    So there is no need to replace the pedal box then ?? Do clutch/brake switches need change for later ones ??

    Also how you getting round the VVT ??
    #4
  6. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    there is no clutch switch ATM, so you need to add that, the brake switch needs replaced with a 4 pin one. The PFL S4 uses a standard cable throttle pedal box, with a round can thing attached up the back of it and connected with a short linkage to the pedal. You still need to unbolt the pedal box to get it in however, so it really just depends what you find.

    VVT will be coded out.
    #5
  7. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    My passat loom had n122 but no n249 as it was nb and I Converted to wb. I use vvt as it's awesome. Aids drivability and spool. As stated 4 pin brake switch needs to be added and wired back to ecu with clutch switch. If wanting to add cruise this is the time to do it.. you can generally buy the whole lot from a breaker for under 200. Ecu tb map sensor etc etc. Almost plug n play. You will need to change Cts and oil pressure switch to face lift style too and possibly add sump sensor or you can use the original oil temp switch as one wire is the same as previously
    #6
  8. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Which sump fits tke it you use later TQS sump or APU sump ??
    #7
  9. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Either mate
    Or just use your std sensor like I did. I now have the correct sump on but without facelift clocks the oil condition and level bit won't work anyway
    #8
  10. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    cars with digital clock should already have the correct sensors etc.
    #9
  11. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Mine has analog clocks will i have issue with immo etc
    #10
  12. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    If i cant source parts all in one go from a scrapped 1.8T Passat, im thinking of buying a 02/52 plate passat (1.8T AWT) and just robbing everything from that and maybe sell some of the parts to recuperate funds or just scrap it and keep the engine to build up a stroker or is it more work on the 06A block than the 058 ??
    #11
  13. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Sounds like a plan. Mine was from apu. But I wasn't concerned with changing the block etc. I'd bet the passat would be cheap enough now a days. Tho more likely to acquire if the passat engine has sludged
    #12
  14. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    What so you used everything from an APU to convert it then used a me7.5 ecu ?? I take it the harness just has to be of a later car and ecu has to be me7.5 and if things are not all matched up they can be coded out ??
    #13
  15. Broken Byzan
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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    I Converted to nb first then added the extra wires to turn it into wideband
    #14
  16. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 17, 2014]
    Mines an APU loom too.

    06A block is easier to stroke than the 058 too, so bonus there.
    #15
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  17. Broken Byzan
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  18. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    Yeh but no grinding lumps out of the block and no IM shaft in the way.

    Swings and roundabouts i guess, but if i was building a stroker, i think i'd probably start with a 06A (or is it 06B in longitudinal?)
    #17
  19. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    Does the AEB/AJL head bolt straight on the 06A block ??

    And i take it all the coolant, powersteering etc pipes in as normal ??
    #18
  20. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    heads are the same.

    Not sure on the coolant stuff, i suspect there will be small detail changes here and there.
    #19
  21. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    I'm pretty sure pipes are in different places. And aircon pump is different too. You'd need all mounts and brackets that mount stuff on as they are quite a4 specific iirc. Audizine are probably more clear on differences between them.
    #20
  22. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    If the whole motor comes out of a passat you'll have most of what you need though. The PAS pipes and AC stuff i'd imagine should interchange ok?
    #21
  23. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    Dunno. The aircon pump is the wrong side iirc other than that not really looked much
    #22
  24. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    thats interesting, i'd have thaught the A4/A6/Passat would have shared most of the front end!
    #23
  25. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    ETKA says 06B passat uses the same AC pump as the A4 058, and has it mounted on the same side...
    #24
  26. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    Really. Oh... No idea then. Lol
    #25
  27. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    [​IMG]

    AWM (06B) engine in a passat!
    #26
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  28. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    This passat donor car is becoming a more viable option all round :)
    #27
  29. Broken Byzan
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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    Sorted. Next project kev ? Lol
    #28
  30. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Feb 18, 2014]
    Will my 034 snub bracket need to be changed to the later one if i go this route ??

    Also i believe if i use the AEB head i will have to use the 06A cam pulley and cam sensor ??

    Anyone have a flat bed/tow truck :)
    #29
  31. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 19, 2014]
    yeh you'll need to use the 06b cam pulley.

    You can probably just swap the 06B cams over into the AEB head?

    Snub mount i'm not sure about. The bush looks the same, but the mounting bracket on the engine could well be different.
    #30
  32. gmx
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    gmx Member

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    [Feb 23, 2014]
    For 06x block, use the crosstube from the passat, it will take care of the snub mount
    #31
  33. gmx
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    [Aug 14, 2014]
    What engine harnesses from Passat can drop in? How about AWT (ignore the 06a bottom end & vvti)?
    Is the pedal to fusebox loom PnP or do I have to snip one out of a donor car?

    I will be using AWT Passat donor car if one comes up cheap and going with the 06A bottom-end. My own opinions and beliefs that it is superior.
    #32
  34. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Aug 14, 2014]
    Im sticking with the 058 block as i landed an ABF crank for £30 well the whole ABF bottom end that is lol im still toying with ME7 but going AGU for now.

    When you get your donor start a build thread as i will be interested to see how you get on !!!
    #33
  35. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 14, 2014]
    Yeh AWT or AWM i think are the ones that work. So long as its an early <2002 passat i think it should be the same.

    The pedal loom is wrapped up in the main harness. You could unpick it all, but it'd take hours. Your better off just cutting the plugs and making up the loom yourself.
    #34
  36. Broken Byzan
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    [Aug 14, 2014]
    Tis what I did. I used apu loom and added the bits I needed when I went wide band.
    #35
  37. gmx
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    [Aug 15, 2014]
    Definitely will start a thread on it when the right donor comes by, that seems to be the difficult part.
    Trying to avoid the automatics as well.
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2014
    #36
  38. Broken Byzan
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    [Aug 16, 2014]
    I was too busy doing it to document it sorry guys. It's mostly plug n play with a few bits to add that are not there and then to re make the white plug wires if you removed the ends like i did because it was buried in the loom
    #37
  39. gmx
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    [Aug 19, 2014]
    Something sparked me about the <2002 requirement. Is this because of VSS sensor differences? Are the main engine looms a different part number between 2000-2002 AWT & 2002+ AWT?
    #38
  40. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Aug 19, 2014]
    the engine loom changes part number after 2002, but i dont know why.

    Maybe to coincide with the facelifted C5 A6 that happened around the same time?
    #39
  41. gmx
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    [Aug 19, 2014]
    I have a feeling it is to do with the gearbox VSS, CAN communication & integration (cluster speedo input). Possibly talking out of my arse.
    2002+ B6 A4s this was one of the major differences, moving the VSS front the front diff output flange to the wheel speed sensor at the hubs.

    Another thing is, I have found a couple automatics, wondering if I should bite the bullet and roll with it? Apart from not having the clutch position switch+loom, am I in for any other surprises apart from the cranks?
    The auto I'm looking at has experienced oil pump failure as per the seller so it's got to come apart anyway to drop in an AEG/FSI crank
    #40

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