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How often change Oil

Discussion in 'A4/A4 cabriolet/S4 forum(B6 chassis)' started by ang12el, Jul 4, 2007.

  1. ang12el
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    ang12el Member

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    [Jul 4, 2007]
    in my old car used to service every 10K with new air filter Oil and Oil filter .. what is the recommended service interval for Audi A4s? My timing belt is up for change in the next few ks and have been quoted a price for that and a service from Awesome < what would be the mileage before I had to think about renewing or changing again. Some say 20K others say 5K

    Is there recommended service interval ?
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  3. golf
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    golf ***** rent boy VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 4, 2007]
    The people who change oil every 20,000 miles simply do not know how to maintain their cars properly.

    If your car is the 1.8T variant then it is imperative that oil is changed every 5,000 miles along with the filter otherwise the well known sludge problem may render your engine obsolete and your wallet severely depleted.

    For what it's worth, I think every 5,000 miles is ideal. Oil is not too expensive and the filter can be had for around a tenner. It's simply not worth having the same oil for 20,000 miles. 10,000 is acceptable but any more and you risk damaging the engine.
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  4. JGrant1285
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    JGrant1285 Sir Scouser Benitez

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    [Jul 4, 2007]
    What about a 1.9TDI...how often then?

    Cheers
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  5. doogleman
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    doogleman Member

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    [Jul 4, 2007]
    Ive had and worked on a number of different cars & I always replace the oil and filter every 7,000 miles. When a car gets over 10 years old I would knock it down to every 5,000 miles. Id do the timing belt every 60,000 miles.
    You'd be safe enough at that.

    I must admit though I am going to get my timing belt on my 1.9TDI done at 100,000 again as I am a little unsure that the last owner changed it at all, even though it is in the log book!!! Call me paranoid maybe. :detective2:
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  6. ang12el
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    ang12el Member

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    [Jul 4, 2007]
    flippin eck this is going to cost me a fortune :faint: what type of Oil am I wanting to be using and what type of air filter being a 1.9TDI 130.?

    Overall how much would I be looking at spending and can it be done by anyone ie myself or are there pitfalls ie the air filter is inside the engine and can only be accessed by a code written in Egyptian and were there is only one known survivor who can translate it!:noway:
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  7. golf
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    golf ***** rent boy VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 4, 2007]
    Air filter's don't need changing along with the oil changes.

    I'm not too sure about TDI engines but with my 1.8T a full oil change costs around &#163;35 and I do it myself, it's a simple case of taking out the old filter, letting the oil drain out in a bucket. Put new filter in and top up with new oil, and away I go. I do about 5,000 miles in around 8 months so it's not too bad for me.
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  8. doogleman
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    doogleman Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    Ah it wont cost that much......Oil and filter changes are not expensive. Timing belts on the other hand have much more labour involved and therefore cost alot more. Here in Ireland you could pay Euro300 for a timing belt change. What is the mileage on your a4 an12el?
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  9. Macduff
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    Macduff Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    Sounds cheap for a timing belt change.
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  10. ang12el
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    ang12el Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    Mileage on me A4 is 111K and service timing is up in 3K so getting the whole lot done at same time service and timing etc . Just wanted to know going forward how often I needed to change me Oil and Oil filter every 5K seems a bit steep I know its an Audi but Owned other VAG cars and they aint as money guzzling as these things.. Well aware that these cars are not exactly known for being cheap and economical runners - just didnt realise I need to speak to the World bank :icon_thumright:
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  11. doogleman
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    doogleman Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    Yup Macduff, probably is a slight underestimate although I am talking about the price from a local mechanic rather than main stealer. Again though you're correct, might even be another E50 - E70.

    To ang12el, as I said every 7000 miles for the oil and oil filter is perfectly acceptable. Obviously glow plugs and air filters are to be changed also at longer intervals.
    BTW how much are you getting quoted for the full service and timing belt deal?
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  12. ang12el
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    ang12el Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    Well the timing belt and tensioners and metal impeller water pump is costing me £320 and the service is another £180 although I didnt ask exactly what was included as it is not due for a few k yet ..

    By the way you mention spark plugs and air filter at what periods are thest to be changed so I can fully apraise the bank manager (wife)
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  13. golf
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    golf ***** rent boy VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    I am a bit over cautious when it comes to my car (and yet I still get major probs) and I change my plugs every 5,000 miles along with oil. I change all my filters every 10,000 miles (air, pollen, fuel).

    Diesel cars do not have spark plugs they use glow plugs, which are similar to spark plugs but also act similar to coilpacks. These do not need to be changed that often, which I'm sure your wife will be happy about.

    If the mileage is at 111k then I would seriously recommend saving yourself &#163;180 and doing the service yourself. The parts will be cheap, and fitting filters is a doddle. Also, the timing belt and water pump can be bought from places like GSF or EuroCarparts and then supplied to a garage and all you pay is labour.
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  14. doogleman
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    doogleman Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    &#163;500 total, thats E750, fvck that is expensive, must be all genuine parts gold plated and signed by Jesus!! :faint: Id say you could get it cheaper than that man. Dont ask me where though cause Im in Ireland. :o.k:
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  15. doogleman
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    doogleman Member

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    [Jul 5, 2007]
    :o.k: Sounds like a good idea.
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  16. ang12el
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    ang12el Member

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    [Jul 6, 2007]
    Thanks for the info but if the price is high then maybe a certain sponsor of this board should review there prices. Ohps just noticed you have added VAT on the price £500 is inc VAT My local Audi dealer wanted £600 just for the timing belt but now you have me thinking

    So what would be the cost of paying for the parts and then getting a local garage to fit them (would it be a lot cheaper)
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  17. doogleman
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    doogleman Member

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    [Jul 6, 2007]
    Ill tell ya what, Im getting my belt done in the near future so Ill price it in total over the weekend and let you know what i would cost here in Ireland.
    Update next week or late weekend.... :salute:
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  18. ronny
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    ronny Audi A4 1.8TQ

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    [Jul 9, 2007]
    I had a cam belt done a month ago, I also had new water pump, all belts and paid £350, that included a oil and filter change, plus anti freeze G75..

    That is plus VAT, place was BODYCRAFT in Ashford Middlesex, took 2 days.
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  19. jibbajabba
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    jibbajabba Member

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    [Jul 9, 2007]
    I got my 2002 a4 tdi serviced, including standard service + timing belt done at dealer in Dublin last year and all-in including a days car hire @45euro, it cost me 1100 euro I think...

    I think the normal servicing was working out at about 400euro with one day's car hire, so take the rest as timing belt.

    I done my own oil service last weekend. Changed the oil/fuel/pollen/air filters and changed oil, 250 euro plus and afternoon of my time.....might go down that route again in future...
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  20. ronny
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    ronny Audi A4 1.8TQ

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    [Jul 9, 2007]


    Another thing I had done at the same garage and I recommend it to everyone is a new header tank and cap, cost is 13 quid and mine was filthy and you could not see the water level properly. (just a thought :))
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  21. Macduff
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    Macduff Member

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    [Jul 9, 2007]
    There's a big difference between being cautious and pouring money down the drain which is what you're doing. It's your car at the end of the day but if you put a decent oil in it WILL protect the car for at least 10k as oil technology has moved along quite a bit in the last 50 years and spark plugs every 5k! Are you mad.
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  22. golf
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    golf ***** rent boy VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 9, 2007]
    Plugs cost £10. Oil filter £6. Oil £25. I only do around 6,000 miles per year, so it's not too often that I do all this by the way. I'd rather this, than my engine get the dreaded sludge.

    Audi of America refuse to pay out for a new engine (if ruined by sludge) unless it can be proven that fully synthetic oil was used and that it was changed every 5,000 miles.

    Out of interest at what intervals do you change your oil?
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  23. Macduff
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    Macduff Member

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    [Jul 9, 2007]
    Fair enough if you're doing such low mileage although I'd just do the oil annually. Americans are well known for changing their oil at ridiculously low intervals though although they do a lot more short urban driving than UK drivers so it will need changing more often. Fully synthetic oil WILL protect the engine for more than 5k - easily.

    I still think you're wasting £40 a year on plugs. I'm sure you could easily go 2-3 years between changes with no ill effects.

    My first oil change was an AVS service at 17.5k. Our usage didn't fit with the variable servicing so I had it switched onto interval servicing i.e. every 10K
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  24. Teutonic_Tamer
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    Teutonic_Tamer GreasedMonkey HoofHearted

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    [Jul 9, 2007]
    It isn't the excess length of time/mileage of the oil that caused the sludge issue. It was merely the fact that non fully synthetic oil was used in a turbo engine! :no:

    That is because the thick Yanks refused to accept the Audi service schedule, and more importantly, refused to use the VW spec fully synthetic oil. :motz: :keule:

    The AoA schedule for the 1.8 20vT was never every 5k miles anyway - it was after the first 5k, and then every 10k miles. :rtfm:
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  25. golf
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    golf ***** rent boy VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 10, 2007]
    I happen to think the Yanks on AW and AZ know a lot more than the average UK Audi owner, so take that into account Mr Tamer.

    I'll stick to my oil changes at every 5,000 miles thanks. Clicky
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  26. Teutonic_Tamer
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    Teutonic_Tamer GreasedMonkey HoofHearted

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    [Jul 10, 2007]
    <yawn> I suppose you think yanks are better drivers than Brits/French/German too!

    I'll state again - the sludge issue in the 1.8 20valve turbo engines was soley caused by "users" on the North American continent refusing to comply with the strict requirements of the Audi/VW serving schedules - and also refusing to comply with the correct specification of oil. This is clearly documented and proven on a number of sites in the public domain.

    When the "sludge" issue originally started to occur, Audi of America and VW of America initially covered warranty repairs on a "good-will" basis - but they also subsequently re-stated their oil specification requirements (by TSB), and would go on to subsequently deny any engine related warranty claim, in the event of non-specified oils being used.

    If, according to you the Yanks were/are more knowlegeable than us Brits - why then, is that the sludge issue WAS/IS an endemic problem in the US, yet was NEVER an endemic issue in Blighty, and the rest of mainland Europe also?


    Fine, good for you. Just don't try and force your personal preferences as the "de-facto" advice on oil change intervals in the UK.

    However, in the UK and Europe, there is absolutley no evidence to prove any detrimental damage to the 1.8 20vt when used on the LongLife servicing schedule (usual common sense caveats, along with ensuring the correct spec oils apply). Providing that the car in question is NOT modified, and is driven within the guidelines of the LongLife regime, then the 20k miles for the LongLife servicing is perfectly adequate.

    If, on the other hand, the vehicle useage does not meet the requirements of the LongLife regime, and/or the engine has been tuned for more performance, then the LongLife is NOT suitable, and the 10k miles conventional "time and distance" regime is more than adequate.


    And that link simply proves just how un-educated the Yanks are in relation to (a) the specific requirements of turbo engines, and (b) modern advancements of lubrication technology.

    They clearly don't know know that a correctly specified fully synthetic oil will NOT break down from the heat generated in the turbo, even in an heavily modified engine!

    They also fail to post any oil analysis data, which proves that the correctly specced oil has broken down before, say, 10k miles.

    Furthermore, in the 43 posts in that thread, not ONE post mentions the vital OEM oil specification!

    They basicically hark back to old-skool methods, when mineral oils were cheaper than bottled water, and changed their oils every 2-3k miles, just because the oil was so cheap! Unfortunately, old habits die hard.

    Finally, they fail to even mention the most crucial factor - regarding the 5k oil change intervals as detailed in the TSB - that this advice was a remedial action only for those engines which had already developed sludge from prior use of incorrect oils. For engines using the correct spec of oil, and/or no evidence of sludging, the 10k interval still stands in the US.
    #25
  27. Teutonic_Tamer
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    Teutonic_Tamer GreasedMonkey HoofHearted

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    [Jul 10, 2007]
    Back to the OPs concerns.

    The 1.9TDI 130PS engine is a PD (Pumpe Duse) engine, and therefore you must only use the specific PD rated oils. If you are on the traditional "time and distance" (max 10k miles or 12 months), then you must use an oil approved to VW 505.01 standard.

    If you are on the LongLife regime (upto 20k miles or 24 months), OR if you are ON T&D servicing with a chipped engine, AND/OR are prone to regularly red-lining your motor - then you must ONLY use an oil approved to the VW 506.01 (LongLife II).

    Dependent on the year of your A4, the B6 models had a 4 year/40k miles interval for the air filter; 2 yr/20k for the pollen filter and brake fluid change.

    HTH
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  28. golf
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    golf ***** rent boy VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 11, 2007]
    Jeez Sean, I was merely stating that 20,000 miles is too long for the same oil to be in a car. I personally change every 5,000 miles, but I never claimed this was de facto, 10,000 miles is recommended.
    #27
  29. Teutonic_Tamer
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    Teutonic_Tamer GreasedMonkey HoofHearted

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    [Jul 11, 2007]
    OK, but that is (now) obviously based on your own personal opinion!

    I'm sure you don't need reminding that the "internet" can get very clouded between personal opinions and hard facts, and I was merely trying to illustrate that.

    For the record, I too change my oil every 5k miles, but again, for the record, I do that for a number of reasons. Firstly, as a qualified motor tecchy, I am able to do so, secondly, I purchase my oil in bulk at very cheap prices, and thirdly, I do drive my cars very hard, fully loaded often in high altitude conditions.

    However, providing the correct high-spec VAG LongLife oil was used (even with my drving style) I still would not have a problem keeping the oil in for 10k miles. Furthermore, regarding the 20k LongLife schedules, providing the driver is honest about their own driving styles, again, I wouldn't have a problem with recommending the 20k intervals.

    Incidentally, on one of the other forums, a chap has an extremely heavily modified Fabia vRS, running (I think) somewhere around 300 bhp, up from the standard 130 bhp. He repeatedly takes it down dragstrips, and changes his oil every 7k miles, and has reported no wear from the engine!

    BTW, what spec/brand of oil are you using, 'cause £25 sounds a little cheap for fully synthetic?
    #28
  30. Teutonic_Tamer
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    Teutonic_Tamer GreasedMonkey HoofHearted

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    [Jul 11, 2007]
    Whoops - forgot to answer your Q.

    Righty, being as you have a PD engine, you MUST only use a PD oil. These would be the VW 505.01 for 10k intervals, or the higher spec 506.01 for the 20k LongLife intervals.

    However, because you are chipping your motor (from what to what ??), then I would recommend using the higher spec 506.01, but to change it every 10k miles.

    HTH
    #29

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