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help!!!advice needed cambelt jumped off 2.5tdi v6 2004 cabriolet

Discussion in 'General Automotive Chat' started by davidfox280585, Nov 15, 2009.

  1. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    rightly first,i bought the car in june, had the belt changed at audi specialists on 18,08,2009 ....today is 15,11,2009 just under 3 months,(not disclosing which specialist as it possibly isnt there fault)
    the car had around 97680 on the clock and currently has 100255 on the clock,
    i sourced the kit from gsf and they supplied my own kit,charged me labour only,
    when the belt was refitted he rang me and said previous mechanics have cross threaded one of the roller pulley bolts and it needed rethreading so i said do whatever it needs to be right,
    the car full front was then stripped including aircon rad etc so the engineers could come in and rethread it they helicoiled it,then everything was rebuilt and fine for 3000 mile,
    i was doing around 30mph,when i heard a bang and cut out,i immediately thought belt so whipped cover straight off and the o/s bank belt was all loose and free though the injector belt was fine,

    now what i need to know is where i stand and is the engine is a safe engine ie pistons mis valves?
    opinions and help needed thanks guys:(
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  3. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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  4. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    I would contact the Audi specialist that fitted it to see what they have to say first.
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  5. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    i tried with no answer on mobile as i was going to get it recoverd there instead i had to take it home,i will ring tomorrow and speak to them,should they collect it?or should i have to take it to them?
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  6. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    Doesn't help that it's a Sunday, I would just call them first thing in the morning and see what they say. They will most likely say to bring it in for them to have a look for diagnosis. It will most likely be at your cost to transport the car to their premises.
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  7. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    Most likely the valves hit the pistons and there is dammage. I never liked helicoils, did a cambelt last week to a 2000 passat v6 tdi and the tensioner bolt had been cross treaded/stripped by previous mechanic. I had an engineering shop make a special bolt with larger threads for the tensioner and re-tap it as there wasnt enough meat for the helicoil to go in. Fitted it back with threadlock and jobs a good one ! I am sorry for you but there will be highly 2 grand worth of engine rebuild in your case... Also i hope they fitted a new water pump as well and a new thermostat...
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  8. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    thanks for the reply adam if this is the fault am i liable for the damage as i was told this would be plenty suitable,apparently the tensioner screws into a large alloy section,if i knew it wouldnt be suitable i would of rather paid more and it be 100% correct,
    than have this happen thanks
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  9. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    Yeah, thats the crankshaft oil seal housing, dont know why the german engineers did not tap the hole for the tensioner in the head wich is cast iron ? To be honest with you, if every tech (especially the big fat grease monkeys!) would use a calibrated torque wrench or a small stubby ratched then the threads wont strip ! Its only when you overtorque the bolts things like that happen ! I need to ask dealers if there is a repair kit for these bolts...
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  10. quattrojames
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    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    You will need to get the front off and establish exactly what has happened first. If the roller pulley bolt has broken/come adrift then obviously you will be in touch with the specialist, and the success you have will depend on their warranty conditions. I assume new bolts and pulleys were fitted at the time?

    When the idler puller disintegrated on my 2.5 and caused the belt to skip 4 teeth it destroyed the engine. Then just to please me, after 4 days with my new engine the tensioner pulley bolt broke and destroyed the engine for a second time...... Virtually one year ago to the day in fact :(
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  11. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    yes adam thats what he said it was,
    and james am i better stripping the front off myself to verify so he cannot say it was something else to cover himself,
    also are they hard to strip only worked on vauxs and boras before though im fairly competant i do all my own stuff bar the audi belt cheers guys your a great help,
    really annoyed as just bought some s4 mirrors and loadsa goodies for it also anyone know how much an engine is?:(
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2009
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  12. quattrojames
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    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    £1500 to £2k typically I expect - not common but they are available.

    Whether you do it yourself or not depends on your abilities and how much you trust the garage - be aware they may not cover any warranty repairs for their work if someone else has been working on the vehicle though.
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  13. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 15, 2009]
    not good then its 1800 for a recon fitted ive found still not good i dont beleive this to be my fault so i need to see citizens advice really dont i?
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  14. quattrojames
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    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 16, 2009]
    I would speak to the specialists initially, see what they say and then you will know where you stand.

    You don't actually know whats wrong with the car yet do you?
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  15. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 16, 2009]
    no ive soke to them today he said try to get it recovered there and he will take a look to see whats gone wrong,but if i cant get it there he will get somebody to collect it,a guy in the village is taking it there for me 30 mile away for £40 which is reasonable
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  16. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 18, 2009]
    he seems to think the water pump has collapsed even tho it hasnt been stripped to confirm,though on autodata it shows the water pump in the middle of the 2 heads just slightly lower,well the top belt covers are removed and you can grab the waterpump and there seems to be no play i think the tensioner guider wheel has come off on the bottom right,

    also should i have been advised the water pump should ideally be changed with the belt kit as i werent to know it wasnt and should it have been checked for noisy bearings on belt fit,
    also if the water pump had collapsed there seems far too much slack on the belt(can lift easily off both heads at same time,and shouldnt it have dropped its water too ?

    any vw audi mechs opinions would help loads as im going to see citizens advice i think to see my rights but your opinions would be grateful thanks
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  17. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 18, 2009]
    [​IMG]
    c= water pump
    b=tensioner
    d-guider wheel
    i think d has gone i grabbed c and there was no play as i could just reach it with the top covers removed opinions please
    #16
  18. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 18, 2009]
    anyone? opinions much appreciated
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  19. quattrojames
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    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 18, 2009]
    Arse :(

    Replacing the water pump is infinitely desirable - but according to Audi not compulsory. The reason my engine went was because at the 80k cambelt change (prior to my ownership) the pulleys were 'inspected' and not replaced (unknown to me). They may have been fine at 80k, but when they collapsed at 125k they clearly weren't!!

    This happens time and time again it seems. At every belt change the advice is to do both pulleys and bolts and water pump - but unfortunately it's not done as a matter of course by dealers and some specialists. Anyone with a working knowledge of the engine should have recommended this to you, but if they didn't it's going to be hard to pick them up on it as at the end of the day they did the work you asked.

    What damage to the engine?
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  20. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 18, 2009]
    unsure yet james he hasnt stripped it though it had new pulleys and bolts,i did however check the water pump and there were no play though if it was that i cannot understand why the belt was so slack surely it will have gone slack but not slack enough to be able to lift both sides off at the same time?and it has lost no water at all cheers
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  21. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 23, 2009]
    result=cambelt snapped on join line, was a dayco belt kit from gsf parts all pulleys etc was ok any opinions where i stand now?
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  22. quattrojames
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    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 23, 2009]
    How much damage to the engine?

    Your contract was with the garage, I'm no expert but I would imagine that you would hold them liable and they would seek recompense from the belt supplier.
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  23. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 23, 2009]
    Ring GSF and go from there, Seeing it was fitted correctly, IE by a garage, there should be no problem with blame, however, they may just offer a new belt...

    Start with GSf anf see what occurs, as you were their customer, they in turn have to go back to their wholesaler, then them the manufacter etc.

    Big pain in the ass, but hopefully will have a satisfactory outcome
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  24. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 23, 2009]
    Why you used Dayco belts ? They are known to go, had 3 customers cars with dayco belts wich failed, thats why the genuine dealer supplied kit has Contitech cambelt and Dayco pump belt !
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  25. davidfox280585
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    davidfox280585 Member

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    [Nov 23, 2009]
    didnt know they were that bad and gsf said they were upto manufacturers spec, i will upload i video link of the belt in question and i am sending the belt to qh for there guys to do a full report before i send it back through gsf as i think i will never see it again if i send it gsf direct i hope everything works out ok though my engine hasnt yet been looked at for damage
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  26. satyak
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    satyak New Member

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    [Dec 4, 2009]
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