1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

ECU Upgrade options

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by Broken Byzan, Apr 23, 2009.

  1. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    Righty then guys, i realise there are several off the shelf options available to the guys in the US or BT and K04 and the like. Also it has been noted that most of the later ECU's over there are flashable.

    We have the early 96/97 wth the square type ECU that most tuners run away from due to the type of chip contained and the lack of avaliable maps.

    Then we have the 98/99 AEB/AJL engined cars that contain the "newer" style ME5 ECU, these cannot be flashed and are also a chip out job to tune, these however use a style of chip that is still available.

    Next comes the ME7 DBW flashable lovely ECU that allows you to tweak yourself if necessary with the likes of Lemmiwinks.

    Some of us on here are running non standard turbo's and mods and would like a more OEM way of tackling this problem without having to resort to standalone. There has to be an option from another vehicle in the VAG stable.The idea that an ECU from a different model could still be flashable but be compatable with DBC cars such as the AEB/AJL so tuners can easiy read, adjust and re flash the ECU without resorting to removing the chip each time.

    Having spoken to Andy B form his experiences with Jabba, they suggested that the M3.8.3 ECU from a Golf/A3 with an AGU engine is still DBC but still flashable and for a few small exceptions will run the AEB no problems.

    M ECU is the later type 8d0 907 558e and the dull grey one is from a 1999 Prefacelift ( so hopefully still immo 2) A3 part number 06a 906 018cj .
    [​IMG]
    #1
  2. Ads

    Ads

    [Dec 20, 2014]

  3. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,847
    Likes Received:
    350
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    I wonder what the story is with immo1-3 on these. The ECU will likely be 2 or 3 depending on year, whereas if lee installs it in his car it will be hooked upto an immo1 box...
    #2
  4. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    I am aiming to plug it in later and see what it says, surely i should be ale to communicate with it to discover the Immo status even if it wont register with my dash as unlocked as it were
    #3
  5. jcb
    Offline

    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    4,118
    Likes Received:
    13
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    Not according to Jim at Star Performance. he reckons they ran out a while ago.
    maybe the reason none of the big names do flash tuning on DBC anymore.
    #4
  6. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    Thanks Ed, i should have been more explicit, they are available while stocks last. I noted a disgruntled customer on the Chip n spin section the other day complaining, as he had the old type on.

    Ok, i went out andstuck 06a 906 018CJ onto my car, it fits the AEB loom perfectly. I switched on the ignition and as expected had the immo light, she was able to start all be it breifly. I went in with VAG-Com and adapted the insturments and loe and behold no light and she ran. I didnt drive her with it on, but idle was constant and she revved smoothly enough.

    I stopped i and read the codes from the ECU and she gave me the following code.
    Control Module Part Number: 06A 906 018 CJ
    Component and/or Version: 1.8L R4/5VT MOTR HS D01
    Software Coding: 04000
    Work Shop Code: WSC 06435
    1 Fault Found:
    18259 - Powertrain Data Bus: Missing Message from ABS Controller
    P1851 - 35-00 - -

    So some more tracking required, but i feel we are on the right track with this.

    So far the compatable ECUs are
    A3 1999 Agu engine, 06a 906 018 cj
    Golf 1999 AGU engine 06a 906 018 r
    #5
  7. ian52
    Offline

    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,199
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    jim at star has a few left there.
    #6
  8. jcb
    Offline

    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    4,118
    Likes Received:
    13
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    oh well, he is too late now. he should have had some when I rang him last year!
    its his fault I now have a 630cc file from Tapp auto!

    I have an AUM ECU from a Mk4 Golf, its DBC.
    might see if that works on mine.
    any things I should be wary of when swapping over ECU's?
    #7
  9. Andy.B
    Offline

    Andy.B Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2007
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    Thats good news then! I thought it might have worked plug and play style seeing as Jabba didnt say to do any wiring changes :S but that could have been the next phone call once i got all the gear together.
    #8
  10. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    I checked the engine side of the wiring and the power and negative and all of the signals engine side are on the same pins.

    I was worried, but went for it and she worked fine once sorted with the Vag-com. I assume you have it? (sorry had to ask)

    Do you have Elsawin or similar to compare wiring for your specific number AUM Ecu against the AEB one?
    #9
  11. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    Stolen from a Golf forum.

    Audi A3 8L 1.8T AGU ECUs
    06A906018D - 0 261 204 254 - Bosch M3.8.3
    06A906018AQ - 0 261 204 678 - Bosch M3.8.3
    06A906018AR - 0 261 204 679 - Bosch M3.8.3
    06A906018CJ - 0 261 206 516 - Bosch M3.8.3
    06A906018CK - 0 261 206 515 - Bosch M3.8.3

    Golf MKIV 1J 1.8T AGU ECUs
    06A906018R - 0 261 204 673 - Bosch M3.8.3
    06A906018BB
    *06A906018CG- 0 261 206 518 - Bosch M3.8.3 - OBDII not CAN - 1.8L R4/5VT MOTR HS D02 - German made 2002 VW Golf GTI 4 doors 1.8T AGU engine EGY 5spd manual tranny
    06A906018CH - Bosch Mxxxxx - CAN not OBDII

    Skoda Octavia 1U 1.8T AGU ECUs
    06A906018CF
    06A906018DM
    06A906018GB
    06A906018GA - 0 261 206 519 - Bosch M3.8.3
    #10
  12. jcb
    Offline

    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    4,118
    Likes Received:
    13
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    I have VAGCom but nothing to compare wiring for the ECU.
    Mine is AJL (late 99)
    #11
  13. jcb
    Offline

    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2005
    Messages:
    4,118
    Likes Received:
    13
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    #12
  14. ian52
    Offline

    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,199
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    i think you will still need to go to audi to get the coding for the ecu to work. i did when i swapped my ecu for one the same but with a chip in it. cant do it with vag-com. think the facelift quattro sport must be immo3. cost me £56 for them to do.
    #13
  15. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    I am lucky as mine is immo2 and 98.5 so i can VAG-com them to recode it. Gonna sit down with the wiring in a bit and see what other differences there may be, like the ABS connection etc.

    If i had Immo 3 i would buy a vagTacho cable to be able to extract the skc and all that as the cost is probably much the same but i could use it again
    #14
  16. ian52
    Offline

    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,199
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    it would be good being able to use an ecu that can just be flashed anyway.
    #15
  17. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 23, 2009]
    I am 99.9% sure the actual wiring i the same AJL to AEB but the connectors are different "D" shaped facelift type.

    I will take a peak for you in a bit if you like, want to tracemine first,lol
    #16
  18. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
  19. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Apr 24, 2009]
    Mark- So it's looking like the ECU is compatible then? I pressume I will need to swap my wiring loom to a later spec?
    #18
  20. docurley
    Offline

    docurley Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2003
    Messages:
    3,859
    Likes Received:
    25
    [Apr 24, 2009]
    Mark you are the man.
    #19
  21. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 24, 2009]
    Yeah mate, mine in the car costed £25 as the one i had for Dave from a AJL engine had different connectors for the engine switches. So an AEB one from a 1998 Passat or A4 will plug right in. I think as your immo is a seperate box you shouldnt have any issues there either

    Nah, if it wasnt for Andy B starting this off with trying to sort tuning for his T28, and the not so good tuning others have had this would have gone no where. Now needs must before we can all continue. Dave you are lucky with your B6, as you should see good power from the outlaw on there, DSMIC and flashable ECU etc. (Git !)

    Shame the silver one had to die to provide you that opertunity:sign_unfair:
    #20
  22. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Apr 24, 2009]
    Top work mate.. I'll keep my eye out for an ECU and loom then.
    #21
  23. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Apr 24, 2009]
    JCB The wiring i printed says its the same routing/connector pinouts for AJL/AEB drawing number 5/1 to 5/8 1998 on for both. The one i have compared with is for an Audi A3 1998 drawing 30/1 to 30/8

    I can only assume at this stage a Golf ECU is the same
    #22
  24. ash_pearce
    Offline

    ash_pearce Member VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Messages:
    322
    Likes Received:
    0
    [Jul 14, 2009]
    any updates guys? I was following this in hope i can change my ecu for a flashable version.
    #23
  25. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Jul 14, 2009]
    Its Finding the time to play,lol

    I am also awaiting replies from some recent enquiries with tuners too, so stay tuned as we need something to happen

    Lee has emailed some US tuners too, so lets hope we can get it back on track
    #24
  26. gmx
    Offline

    gmx Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2009
    Messages:
    139
    Likes Received:
    2
    [Oct 12, 2009]
    any progress guys?
    #25
  27. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Oct 12, 2009]
    Nothing constuctive tbh as all of us concerned have changed cars to start agin,lol

    I know Lee will be looking at sorting this for his T28, i am currently in talks with a tuner over whether they can stick a std k03s map on the Me3.8.3 ECU that will suit the quatty. So it's not forgotten?
    #26
  28. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Oct 13, 2009]
    Right, i have been out to play( as you do) and find this car seems to have immo2 the same as my last one. I thought great ans carried on and synched the ECU with the dash. immo light stopped flashing as it should but somehow the immo is still cutting the engine. It throws a code on the ECU to say Immo blocked car from running etc.

    I have even aquired the SKC for the dash and logged in that way to be sure, still the same. So for a reason i am not sure of my AJL won't stay running on the ME3.83 ECU. Odd one huh!
    #27
  29. ian52
    Offline

    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,199
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Oct 13, 2009]
    i had to go to audi with minw to swap the ecu. could not do it with vag com.
    #28
  30. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Oct 13, 2009]
    Did you notice what they did by chance? and what did it cost you?

    Edit, has your dash got a digi clock or analogue one
    #29
  31. ian52
    Offline

    ian52 2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,199
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Oct 13, 2009]
    i have a digi clock. they plug it into some computer that goes on line with something in germany to code it or the car to work together. cost me £56,that was about 40 min. i had everything ready so they just had to plug it in.
    #30
  32. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,847
    Likes Received:
    350
    [Oct 13, 2009]
    digi clock will probably mean immo3, which explains why we couldnt do it with vagcom.

    Doesnt help explain marks problem though :(
    #31
  33. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    So anyway, i now have a TQS with ECU number 8d0 907 558DA and i think Immo 2 on the dash, i can adapt the new 018 CJ ECU to suit the car and the immo light goes out, but she will not start, and when reading the codes i get start blocked by immo code.

    Its odd as i have pullled the SKC and logged in to be sure and this has no effect.

    So i am guessing it's mainly because the file sizes are different from the DA @ 128 iirc to 256 on the 018CJ. Maybe an immo bypass flash /code at the same time as the file being stuck on will suffice.?
    #32
  34. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    That is odd!

    Out of interest what did the ME3.83 ECU that you have come off of?
    #33
  35. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    1999 Audi a3 1.8t facelift. AGU IIRC
    #34
  36. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    A3 1999 AGU engine.. just found it earlier on in the thread.
    #35
  37. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,847
    Likes Received:
    350
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    I think its the Immo unit in your car not playing ball with the ECU tbh, either the immo only wants to talk to another 558DA ECU, or theres something not quite right with the SKC/Login procedure.

    It ran perfectly fine on your old car, with what now appears to be an Immo1 cluster.

    You have a spare cluster from purple car, i'd perhaps look at temporarily slotting that in (do you have/can get a key thats still coded to that old cluster?) and seeing if it will start/drive.

    Or as you say, get whomever maps it to disable the immo, however i'd rather be running immo1 than nothing...
    #36
  38. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    Beat me to it!
    #37
  39. Lee Goodall
    Offline

    Lee Goodall ..got my head together!

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,231
    Likes Received:
    1
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    So the purple one is Immo1 then?
    #38
  40. aragorn
    Offline

    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    15,847
    Likes Received:
    350
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    seems so.

    Early immo1 cars had a white box under the column, i assumed when they integrated it into the dash in 97-98 they went immo2, but it turns out immo2 didnt come in until mid-99

    So your car has immo1, but its integrated into the dash rather than being a seperate box.
    #39
  41. Broken Byzan
    Offline

    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,770
    Likes Received:
    322
    [Oct 14, 2009]
    Tis all odd and strange, maybe it's my car being a crossover being facelift dash but still analogue clock perhaps i have immo 2.5,lol

    Its daft that it will put the light out so it accepts the ecu to the cluster, maybe i need to somehow tell the ecu to open up??
    #40

Share This Page