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Car Magazine Comparative Test

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by jdp1962, Nov 8, 2005.

  1. PPPMAT

    PPPMAT New Member

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    Some excellent posts here - People buy for different reasons. badge, quality whatever.

    I still believe though that the golf in particular might be cheaper than the equivalent audi but there is quite a step down in quality of materials used (not fit)

    Also if you think about it there is absolutely loads of platform sharing throughout the whole car industry, its just that everyone seems to know about the audi/vw/skoda thing.

    A saab 93 is a vauxhall vectra in drag. A BMW 1 series is the same platform as the 3 series. A chrysler crossfire is an old merc slk - i could go on.....Point is that they all do it to some degree
     
  2. Horchsense

    Horchsense Member

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    Back in 1475, my old MGB was affectionately reffered to as a Morris Marina in a frock - didn't realise the 1 series was based on the (presumably new) 3 though...! Definitely agree about the 159 - seriously sexy wheels...
     
  3. bacardi

    bacardi Active Member

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    Bowfer - have driven a few alfa's, mainly 156's but also some 147's - they did drive well but thats not what I was saying, All of the 156's I know (Friends owned, some company some private cars) have had half the dashboards to the right of the steering wheel fall off, the one guy with a selespeed has now had 4 (Yup 4) gearboxes..................

    They do look damned sweeeeeet though, no discounting that

    and yeah, I'm very easily amused /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
     
  4. stressfrees3

    stressfrees3 Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I wouldn't buy another A3,that's for sure (no surprise there).
    The trouble is,even though my A4 before it was as faultless a car as I've owned,my A3 experiences have put me clean off Audi for good.
    I've gone from thinking they're good solid cars to over-priced charlatans.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Likewise too. same thoughts this moment in time..what are you gonig for next
     
  5. stressfrees3

    stressfrees3 Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    That's just ******. Chinese culture my ars* - if they were so happy with their situation why are they be so busy making cheap TV's for westerners?

    Personally I'm glad its ****** too. Otherwise we'd be sat in caves looking at our hairy wives preparing another serving of raw meat surprise and grinning inanely at our lucky lives. And then you wouldn't have an Audi to be happy about and I wouldn't have a forum on which to complain about it.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    because westerners want it......look at the cheap cars that are made, now they are everywhere. why? because the westerners want it. Back there they are rubbing their hands.....Ha Ha Ha
     
  6. benw123

    benw123 Moderator

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    Did the Car magazine article mention depreciation? If they're recommending everything else than an A3 then I couldn't be happier - fewer sales mean better residuals for me.

    For the record, my Sportback has been totally faultless in the year I've had it and I really like it a lot. But it's not a car that gets under my skin; the Focus ST170 I owned before it handled so much better. And I've decided I no longer like diesel-power. Fine for 90% of the real world of driving, when you just have to get about, but unrewarding and boring to drive hard.
     
  7. Horchsense

    Horchsense Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    That's just ******. Chinese culture my ars* - if they were so happy with their situation why are they be so busy making cheap TV's for westerners?

    Personally I'm glad its ****** too. Otherwise we'd be sat in caves looking at our hairy wives preparing another serving of raw meat surprise and grinning inanely at our lucky lives. And then you wouldn't have an Audi to be happy about and I wouldn't have a forum on which to complain about it.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    “So what did the Chinese ever do for us then?”
    Well there was the gunpowder, the printing, the nautical compass…”
    “Yeah well, besides the gunpowder, the printing and the nautical compass…”
    “The multi-stage rocket, the observational kite, decimal mathematics…”
    “OK – besides the multi-stage rocket, the observational kite, decimal mathematics…”
    “Paper money, the wheelbarrow, the game of chess, brandy, whiskey…”
    “Yeah well….”
    “Astronomy, physics, chemistry, meteorology, seismology…paper-making”
    “Paper-making? - Pah! Stupid bxxxxxds…”

    OK - bit off-topic...
     
  8. tinka

    tinka Guest

    looked at the lexus is250 yesterday,and it was realy nice,the diesel isnt out till next year though,and theres nothing to tempt me back to petrol power(speed cameras are getting their way)and speed asnt an option anymore,so ill wait,

    its also got flappy paddles,and loads more over the 3 series as standard,but im not buying new anymore ,as its out of my own pocket,so 6 months old will be the newest ill get i think,ive waisted enough.
     
  9. madvw

    madvw Active Member

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    whats with the fascination with lexus here?

    Personally i think lexus are a bit like a clip on tie, yeah they look okay from a distance, but up close they look about as distinguished as dog sh!t on your trousers.
     
  10. cdb2

    cdb2 Member

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    Have to say the current IS200 now looks very dated. Think people on here are quite interested in the new model because of the legendary customer service.
     
  11. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Have to say the current IS200 now looks very dated. Think people on here are quite interested in the new model because of the legendary customer service.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Toyota make a great car and there is no denying that - and their customer relations department isn't in the RAC building at Walsall either.....
     
  12. tinka

    tinka Guest

    im starting to realise,its not about image anymore,or the badge on the grill, it means nothing,if the image was true there would'nt be so many dissapointed owners on here,i only wish id realised this before i parted with my money,

    because a car stands out, does'nt mean its better than another ,the lexus i suppose is descreet,and a change to another brand will be next,so why not,i like it.

    cars are like clothes,houses,beds etc,you keep on trying untill you find one your comfortable with,not literally,but do you see my point?.
     
  13. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    cars are like clothes,houses,beds etc,you keep on trying untill you find one your comfortable with,not literally,but do you see my point?.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Not exactly, cars are more like women, when they are good, they are VERY good, and when they are not, well.............

    Sooner or later you wake up and think, F**k me you are annoying - then it is time to say goodbye......

    Did I mention I was divorced? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/woohoo.gif
     
  14. madvw

    madvw Active Member

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    cars are indeed very much like women. In fact far too much like women to list all the points.. man thats scary.

    and to pick in either case a bland one thats 'comfortable' seems criminal. Wheres the passion in that? Lifes for living, sod the safe option, enjoy it.
     
  15. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    cars are indeed very much like women. In fact far too much like women to list all the points.. man thats scary.

    and to pick in either case a bland one thats 'comfortable' seems criminal. Wheres the passion in that? Lifes for living, sod the safe option, enjoy it.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Before we go two far off topic - I'm advocvate of two, one fast and unpractical (the TT version) and the other safe and comfortable but ultimately not very exciting...A6 Estate?

    And you think I'm kidding don't you?
     
  16. yak

    yak Member

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    Heck, if I wanted a working car, I'd buy a 1986 E-class 200D Mercedes-Benz. I'm sure it would bring me some lovely joy .. and, wait. Stop there.

    I've had my share of problems with my A3. I've had my share of problems with BMW as well. I had a working Mitsubishi. Yet I wouldn't trade back to Mitsubishi even if it worked all day.

    What's the point in buying expensive car (cars are never cheap here, even Toyota Aygo is expensive), if you don't enjoy it? It's more than point1->point2 moving, I would be best off with a bicycle in that case. I however like few facts: a) it's good looking, b) it's an Audi, it's brand sounds good, makes an impression, c) it's still a joy to own.

    It makes me happy to drive it, not like in any Toyota where I hope that I'll be soon at the finishing line. I actually drive slower in my own car than in older cars. I'm not in a rush to get out of there. And quality as in material quality matters even more than actual technical quality. And A3 isn't that boring to drive, it's kinda nice actually. I sure miss it after driving Mini's and 1-series/3-series BMW, I feel more home at it (might be due to having it for almost 2 years now, but still).

    And who would buy a Lexus? Pay more for same Toyota? They just change badges depending on the country where they're sold and where either one has better name. And boy do Lexus' feel cheap inside and boring. But that's pretty common to every Japanese car.

    Skoda is a nice car, yet how many parts are same as in A3? Surprisingly little when it comes to what the driver can see or feel. Every interior part is different, every outerior part is different. Looks different, sounds different, .. I don't think anyone would guess A3 is same car as Golf, if they didn't know that.

    Or when it comes to Audi is Skoda, then Passat is Golf. And so on, same base doesn't bother myself, it means less likely to have failures, and better designed. Golf platform is hugely well built for winter use for example. When that's almost half of the year, it counts. And Japanese cars don't come close to that. So much for technical quality when heater isn't suffient.

    - Yak
     
  17. [ QUOTE ]
    Speaking as one of the few that paid for and runs a car from my own pocket - I like my A3 a lot

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Same here. After 13 months of trouble free happy motoring in a new 1.6 fsi sport I just changed to a new 2.0 tdi sport.

    I remember when I bought my first A3, I ordered it then spent three months reading various car mags for reviews, car magazines are highly biased against Audis for some reason, in the end out of all the criticisms of the A3 the only one that I thought was true was the poor visibility out the rear window...

    TBH, I need something to get me from a to b, looked nice and isnt so common and it meets those requirements.....
     
  18. marriedblonde

    marriedblonde Moderator

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    Cosmic,

    In your sig you have s555 jww are your intials Jww? If so there the same as mine!

    J.
     
  19. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]

    Cosmic,

    In your sig you have s555 jww are your intials Jww? If so there the same as mine!J.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yes, John William Wxxxxx
     
  20. d3fy

    d3fy Active Member

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    Thats exactly the same amount of characters as some thing else /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
     
  21. Karcsi

    Karcsi Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    Perhaps you were very lucky with the Alfa, and very unlucky (certainly) with the A3.

    I considered a 147 before I bought the A3. I've always loved the shape (before they turned into a Seat Ibiza!), and said, that'll be the car for me. But, looked inside and around it. Looks cheap. Residuals are hopelessly bad (although you can get a hefty discount on them these days). Read owner reports, which were not very complimentary on realibility and dealers. So, I went with the Audi. Had no problems with it, other than the wiper motor being changed because of a manufacturer's fault. Everything has been perfect (touch wood).

    [/ QUOTE ]

    What would the Alfa have cost you,out of interest,compared with your A3 ?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think it would have been £21k, with the same kit. It would be £22k today for the 1.9 JTD Lusso. My A3 was £23k. So, bit of a no brainer. Actually, it was a brainer. Because if I had gone completely with my heart, it would have been the Alfa. My brain got in the way - not often I can say that; usually it's my foot!
     
  22. Karcsi

    Karcsi Member

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    [ QUOTE ]


    “So what did the Chinese ever do for us then?”
    Well there was the gunpowder, the printing, the nautical compass…”
    “Yeah well, besides the gunpowder, the printing and the nautical compass…”
    “The multi-stage rocket, the observational kite, decimal mathematics…”
    “OK – besides the multi-stage rocket, the observational kite, decimal mathematics…”
    “Paper money, the wheelbarrow, the game of chess, brandy, whiskey…”
    “Yeah well….”
    “Astronomy, physics, chemistry, meteorology, seismology…paper-making”
    “Paper-making? - Pah! Stupid bxxxxxds…”

    OK - bit off-topic...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Decimal mathematics? I'm afraid that was the Indians. Well, at least they invented decimal system.
     
  23. Horchsense

    Horchsense Member

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    No no Karcsi - the Indians invented the teepee & the bow and arrow... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
     
  24. bunny

    bunny Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    "In Chinese culture, discontentment is represented by the "hungry ghost" - a character with an enormous belly, but a tiny mouth - eternally hungry.

    The art of living is not to have what you want, but to want what you have - here endeth the lesson "



    [/ QUOTE ]



    “So what did the Chinese ever do for us then?”
    Well there was the gunpowder, the printing, the nautical compass…”
    “Yeah well, besides the gunpowder, the printing and the nautical compass…”
    “The multi-stage rocket, the observational kite, decimal mathematics…”
    “OK – besides the multi-stage rocket, the observational kite, decimal mathematics…”
    “Paper money, the wheelbarrow, the game of chess, brandy, whiskey…”
    “Yeah well….”
    “Astronomy, physics, chemistry, meteorology, seismology…paper-making”
    “Paper-making? - Pah! Stupid bxxxxxds…”



    [/ QUOTE ]



    Sorry SteveB you seem to have missed the point - I do not think that the Chinese are "stupid b*stards" - it would be rather odd as I am part chinese myself.

    I was merely questioning your assertion that Chinese culture teaches you to be happy with what you have rather than yearn for improvement - hence my question about China's drive for increased earnings and industrial growth.

    And then you list a number of improvements that the Chinese have contributed to civilisation. If you cannot see the contradiction between satisfaction with the status quo and an enviable track record of intellectual and economic development then perhaps you should have another look?

    In the meantime I suggest you stop speculating about other people's IQ and concentrate on making your posts less offensive and more coherent.
     
  25. Karcsi

    Karcsi Member

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    To want what you have does not mean that you need to be content with what you have, but actually want (need, even) what you have. You can be motivated to do better, have more influence, earn more and also want what you have, rather than simply have everything you think you need.

    However, that only works if the Hungry Ghost's mouth is in proportion with its body - that it is sufficient to supply his body with what it needs (wants). If not, then it needs a bigger mouth!

    Oh hell. This is getting far to surreal for a car forum!!
     
  26. Horchsense

    Horchsense Member

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    One can clearly see the laser like clarity of your thought process and erudition Bunny, confirmed in the well rounded articulation of your vocabulary – carefully chosen words and phrases such as “******” and “my arse” indicate a formidable intellect. Amply demonstrated throughout the realm of scholarly debate, this command of language can only add to the balanced polemic.

    Why only the other day I was listening to John Humphries interrogating the prime minister on the re-introduction of internment.

    “Prime Minister,” said John, can you really justify the suspension of this habeas corpus ******?”
    “Suspension of habeas corpus?” responded the pm, “Suspension my arse…”
    “Ah” quipped John Humphries “better suspension by your arse than your ******… /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif
     
  27. miketweed

    miketweed Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I think it would have been £21k, with the same kit. It would be £22k today for the 1.9 JTD Lusso. My A3 was £23k. So, bit of a no brainer.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sense at last!

    How anyone can moan at a 23K (or 30K) A3 when you pay 22K for a rattlebox tin-can Alfa is beyond me.

    At least the A3 isn't worth only 5K or less after 3 years!
     
  28. Karcsi

    Karcsi Member

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    Glad you found it more noteworthy than Bunny's "arse" or Steve's "******". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif Unless Bunny is female, then I may have to have a rethink... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush2.gif
     
  29. bunny

    bunny Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    One can clearly see the laser like clarity of your thought process and erudition Bunny, confirmed in the well rounded articulation of your vocabulary – carefully chosen words and phrases such as “******” and “my arse” indicate a formidable intellect. Amply demonstrated throughout the realm of scholarly debate, this command of language can only add to the balanced polemic.

    Why only the other day I was listening to John Humphries interrogating the prime minister on the re-introduction of internment.

    “Prime Minister,” said John, can you really justify the suspension of this habeas corpus ******?”
    “Suspension of habeas corpus?” responded the pm, “Suspension my arse…”
    “Ah” quipped John Humphries “better suspension by your arse than your ******… /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Aaah stevie, if only a display of irrelevant semantics were the true display of intellect then perhaps you would have a point, but I believe that straight teeth in your mouth are less important than the words that come out of it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
     
  30. Horchsense

    Horchsense Member

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    Another piece of ancient Chinese wisdom presumably??? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif
     
  31. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Another piece of ancient Chinese wisdom presumably??? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Will you two children cut this out, it is boring for the rest of us. No more please.
     
  32. jdp1962

    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator
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    Hear hear! This has been one of the most thought-provoking discussions for a long time. Let's not spoil it.
     
  33. bunny

    bunny Member

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    Yeah sorry.

    In a nutshell, my expectations were too high. I chose the Audi because it "looked" like it would be sporty, refined and fun to drive. From the very first drive I was disappointed. Coming from a 3 series the A3 was noisy, wanted to run wide all the time and was not fun to drive.

    I was thinking about this earlier today on the M1, and to be honest the A3 is still a very good car. I think maybe my disappointment had more to do with;

    my previous car being too good
    my trackday (bike) experience
    Audi being too good at marketing.

    This is why I am sure I would have got on better with the Golf. Not because it is any better, but because it "looks" like it is - a decent car and nothing more.

    Hope that makes sense?
     
  34. Horchsense

    Horchsense Member

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    "Mmm..." he said, lobbing another toy out of his pram - "It's just that..." then he shut up...
     
  35. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Yeah sorry.

    In a nutshell, my expectations were too high. I chose the Audi because it "looked" like it would be sporty, refined and fun to drive. From the very first drive I was disappointed. Coming from a 3 series the A3 was noisy, wanted to run wide all the time and was not fun to drive.

    I was thinking about this earlier today on the M1, and to be honest the A3 is still a very good car. I think maybe my disappointment had more to do with;

    my previous car being too good
    my trackday (bike) experience
    Audi being too good at marketing.

    This is why I am sure I would have got on better with the Golf. Not because it is any better, but because it "looks" like it is - a decent car and nothing more.

    Hope that makes sense?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    There is a real risk of big disappointment if you compare your current car to whatever you had in the past. I look back at my beloved 9-5 Aeros and somehow forget that aside from the plus points they gobbled fuel, and tyres, the internal trip computer/climate displays died in less than two years, shocks packed up not long after that along with the Direct Ignition packs and the whole thing depreciated at a scary rate - and yet I still have good memories.

    If you went and bought another 3 series and I another 9-5 the chances are that we would both be disppointed....."not as good as the last one syndrome".

    I've drawn the conclusion that one is safer to consider the merits of the current vehicle - and enjoy it. At the end of the day these things are just cars, simply chunks of metal/rubber and plastic - what is there to get worked up about?
     
  36. bacardi

    bacardi Active Member

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    and i think this is another case of "don't believe the hype" and "try before you buy"
     
  37. jdp1962

    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator
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    I think this thread, on the same forum, is quite illustrative of the extent to which Audi's image is not quite as deep as we might have believed. I have to say I found this scandalous!

    Press Here
     
  38. cosmicblue

    cosmicblue Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I think this thread, on the same forum, is quite illustrative of the extent to which Audi's image is not quite as deep as we might have believed. I have to say I found this scandalous!

    Press Here

    [/ QUOTE ]

    There seems to be a touch innocence here, cars are, in reality, just expensive bits of metal/rubber/plastic and a commodity in the same way as a pop up toaster.

    The challenge is that cars are also objects that incur emotional feelings so people feel that their choice of vehicle is a reflection of their status in society and therefore there is an expectation that they should be treated in a particular way having 'invested' in a particular brand.

    The comments from that VAG executive over the relative values of the respective brands shows the real extent of the manufacturers utter contempt for the end customer.

    We bought pop-up toasters, they know it and are laughing at us now. Sad isn't it?

    In amongst all of this there are one or two good dealers really trying to exceed our expectations and deliver really special customer service.
     
  39. h5djr

    h5djr Well-Known Member
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    Couldn't agree more. Some dealers really go out of their way to make sure you enjoy for Audi experience - Some just cannot be bothered.

    At the end of the day, however good the cars are, if a driver gets a lousy service from the dealer, then Audi are the lossers as that driver may not buy another Audi.
     
  40. OutLore

    OutLore VOIP Dude

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    [ QUOTE ]
    Couldn't agree more. Some dealers really go out of their way to make sure you enjoy for Audi experience - Some just cannot be bothered.

    At the end of the day, however good the cars are, if a driver gets a lousy service from the dealer, then Audi are the lossers as that driver may not buy another Audi.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Precisely - so if you have had a bad experience with a dealer, let Audi UK know about it - and compare it to a good experience you have had (if you have had any), at least that way they dont just think you are never going to be happy with any dealer.

    Dealers are "marked" by Audi UK - thats why you (should) get a questionnaire either when you are in the dealer or in the post, although they do become rather pointless as they are dealt with by the dealer themselves, so they can choose to chuck out the bad ones and keep the best......
     

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