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Brake Squeal - update from Bavaria

Discussion in 'RS3 Forum' started by Alanjp, Apr 2, 2013.

  1. Alanjp
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    Alanjp New Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Just took my RS3 into my local dealer in Munich to have the summer wheels/tyres fitted, they informed me that there was a couple of factory updates outstanding on my car, one of which was for the brakes and that they would have to replace the front discs, callipers and pads. Hopefully the car will come back tomorrow with no more brake squeal !
    #1
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  3. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Damn that's a large recall for brake squeals, calipers, discs & pads seems extreme.
    #2
  4. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    You ARE! the man!!! Danke!

    Please keep us informed!

    So much Danke! Danke! Danke! Danke! Danke! Danke!

    Just to emphasise: "replace the front discs, callipers and pads"

    Danke! Danke! Danke! Danke! Danke! Danke!
    #3
  5. MBK
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    MBK Active Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Blimey, I will be holding off on my brake upgrade then!
    #4
  6. knobby
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    knobby Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Wow... Fingers crossed this will filter thought to the UK soon.

    Can you get some information on some sort of recall ID perhaps?
    #5
  7. robbiemac
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    robbiemac 'S' Button engaged....

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    [​IMG]
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  8. P_G
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    P_G Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    You are a brave man going for summer tyres now, it was still snowing in Munich last week and forecast for more! Keep us posted on the recall and picture would be great to see what the difference is.
    #7
  9. Alanjp
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    Alanjp New Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Yep, still got snow on the ground, but at least its above zero now and can only get warmer, so given the difficulty in getting appointments for wheel changes at this time of year it was either keep the original appointment or wait another month to get a new date. So looking forward to getting the car back with its shinny new summer wheels - only driven it so far on the winter wheels so interesting to see the effect of the big 19" rims especially as I took the option of the wider 8.5" rims
    #8
  10. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]

    I do hope the man's giving positive information robbimac, for all of those RS3 owners suffering with this annoyance... RESPECT!!!
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2013
    #9
  11. P_G
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    P_G Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Will Audi GmbH not store them for you if you take them away, fit them yourself and bring your winters back for them to store?
    #10
  12. Alanjp
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    Alanjp New Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Deal is they swap the wheels then store the spare set till next required - all very civilised, as its now a legal requirement here to have winter tyres fitted everyone has to swap there tyres 2x a year and a lot of folks don't have the tools or where with-all to do this the dealers set up a service to handle.
    #11
  13. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Well said Alanjp: for me winter tyres are an absolute MUST, NO question. The grip for drive and/or acceleration, and/or braking is beyond measure, my life is worth more than the costs, I only wish others would realise/understand before it's too late.
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  14. P_G
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    P_G Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    I understand that folks don't have the tools but if you did then it is an easy job and would be a shame if part of Audi's terms for storng the tyres is that they have to swap them over. Even if you didn't there are places where you can rent a ramp at a garage for £10 in the UK. Just thinking for the times where you are waiting a couple of weeks and the time slot is inflexible for changing conditions.
    #13
  15. Macdaddy
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    Macdaddy Active Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    Well dont hold your breath on a UK fix!!

    I've been told today AGAIN that the UK fix is at least 3 weeks away.... Thats direct from Audi UK following last weeks meeting.
    #14
  16. elton121272
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    elton121272 Member

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    [Apr 2, 2013]
    As I said in the brake squeal thread - I believe a fix is imminent and by that i mean within the next 8 weeks and one of the reasons it's happened so fast (if you follow my positive mindset) is down to Audi UK, us and this forum.

    Like most gazillion £ turnover brands though, thousands of safety checks have to be undergone before an update can be issued and when you filter down to our fairly exclusive RS3 and TTRS models and consider the fix has to go through ALL the bench safety tests again across both wear and tear and warranty periods, it's not quite as simple as we would all hope - an no I'm not on the payroll ;-)

    Yes, you may say that "I'm alright Jack" having been given a full refund - but my confidence in the brand isn't diluted....so much so I will have another 'baby' in my driveway soon and will be on the same list once again as the rest of you. If the locals are being looked after first, fair enough, but new callipers, pads and discs should be comforting as well as any goodwill offerings.
    #15
  17. wickedstef
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    wickedstef Active Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    I hope we don't end up with lower rated, smaller discs/callipers, I love the size and strength of mine. I want to see pictures as if they look smaller I'm gonna have a tantrum...
    #16
  18. quattro81
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    quattro81 All the gear.. No idea

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    The TTOC seems to be aware of this already........ They have posted a translation to the German website detailing the fix...

    "It looks like Audi will do a recall in a couple of months (March 2013) of all TTRS/RS3 produced since Model Year 2010 (2011 for the RS3) to fix all the braking issues: squeak, delayed braking in the wet, stuttering, high wear, etc.

    Erlkönige, Neuheiten, News, Tuning, Wirtschaft - AUTO MOTOR UND SPORT ... 92557.html


    (link is in German)




    edit: google translation provided below:


    Audi has responded to technical problems with the brakes at the top models Audi RS3 and TT RS and offers a free brake replacement on a modified brake system.


    Once customers have been complaining about a half years delayed braking in the wet, stuttering, loud squeak and high wear, the manufacturer has redesigned the brake system on both models. Stephan Reil, Head of Development at quattro GmbH in Neckarsulm, where RS3 and TT RS will be built, and Florian Heuberger, Head of Technology at Audi Service, announced in Auto Motor und Sport that the operator of the affected vehicles can free replacement of the brakes. Affected up to 5700 models of the RS3 from model year 2011 and 6100 TT RS from model year 2010.


    Exchange for parts availability from March


    "All customers will be helped - free", Quattro Manager Reil insured against auto motor und sport. Audi has modified the brake caliper and the brake pads to eliminate the most common and occur mainly at low speed squealing when braking. The delay in braking effect when wet Audi plans get through a software update in the handle. "An increased since June 2012 and employed in the service aufspielbares ESP update the frequency with which after turning on the windshield, the brake pads are always easily placed on the discs to displace splash," said Quattro development chief Reil. To reduce the thermal load on the RS3-brake, since June 2012 protects the right of the front apron a breathable pinhole built in, which is also upgradeable.


    In mass production, the changes in the coming weeks will also be incorporated. Could, however, the exchange in the workshops ", depending on the availability of parts at least until the end of March or longer extend" estimates Heuberger. Audi sees no need to act on the other hand wear. "According to our specifications and hold the brake pads about 30,000 miles, the discs get twice the mileage -. Provided proper treatment"


    Switched for individual questions for conversion (workshops, events) Audi on 0800/02834664 a service hotline"

    so this is looking likely as to what we are going to be offered over here really soon...... As our German counterparts are getting theirs done as we speak......
    #17
  19. Oli.
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    Oli. Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Blimey, that'll cost Audi a few bob! Mine is still very intermittent, but annoying all the same.
    #18
  20. Alanjp
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    Alanjp New Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Just collected my car back from the dealer, outcome was as they initially stated complete replacement of both front discs, calipers and pads - this was documented in the Service book as 'Aktion 4716' there was also another outstanding recall - 'aktion 20T9' which requires checking and potential replacement of the fuel pump, I need the replacement so waiting on the parts for this one & have to go back in again in a few weeks - not sure if this was an RS3 specific aktion or a generic A3 check.
    #19
  21. robbiemac
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    robbiemac 'S' Button engaged....

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    post a picture of the front wheel assembly please..... We'll try to spot the differences if any.........
    [​IMG]
    #20
  22. Mr_Freeze
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    Mr_Freeze Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Alan. thanks for taking the time to update us.
    #21
  23. JonnyG
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    JonnyG Active Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Thanks for the update Alan. I've experienced both the squealing (since fixed by 45Vbtcv's Mintex shims) and the wet weather braking delay which was quite a heartstopper for a second, so look forward to a UK fix. These are my originals, as at 2700 miles miles :-[​IMG] [​IMG]
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2013
    #22
  24. Alanjp
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    Alanjp New Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Heres a few shots of the new discs & calipers

    Attached Files:

    #23
  25. quattro81
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    quattro81 All the gear.. No idea

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    [​IMG]

    I'm liking the pattern on the disc.. I'm sure somebody will be along shortly to give me the technical name for the criss cross swirlyness:readit:
    #24
  26. Oli.
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    Oli. Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Its just where the disc face is cut
    #25
  27. quattro81
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    quattro81 All the gear.. No idea

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    oh ok :( I thought I'd seen something exciting lol.... I'll go back to my corner
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    robbiemac, Kelza and monkeyboy_marcus like this.
  28. quattro81
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    quattro81 All the gear.. No idea

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    mines in for the action 20t9 fuel pump replacement.. And I had to wait two weeks on parts after the initial diagnosis... And if we have this brake fix I guess my car will go back in again!? :laugh: they've had it for longer than I have at the minute
    #27
  29. CatnipRS3
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    CatnipRS3 Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Thanks for the updates Alan...but what is the verdict?...squeal gone!?!
    #28
  30. Alanjp
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    Alanjp New Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Too soon to tell, only driven it 10km home from the garage.
    #29
  31. CatnipRS3
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    CatnipRS3 Member

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    [Apr 3, 2013]
    Ok...keeps us posted Sir! :detective2:
    #30
  32. monkeyboy_marcus
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    monkeyboy_marcus Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    Is the fuel pump replacement a recall issue for all RS3s?
    #31
  33. robbiemac
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    robbiemac 'S' Button engaged....

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    big enough to apologise..... cheers Alan, we've been given many false starts here. Sorry for the early sceptical post, I'm enjoying a large slice for breakfast.
    [​IMG]
    #32
  34. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]

    Thanks Alanjp! Great pictures.

    The finish quattro81 is called a "crosshatch ground finish"; usually found on high performance brake discs and said to give a precision friction surface for optimum braking performance and brake pad life. My original brake discs (RS3) had this same finish.

    But far more interestingly from Alanjp's photographs, thanks Alan; I can't see any external difference to the brake disc and/or calliper; so have Brembo changed the piston diameters within the calliper to ensure that the lower edge of the brake pad meets the disc first as this would most certainly eliminate the low-speed brake squeal.

    If Brembo have just changed the brake pad material and/or anti-squeal material then why would they have changed the brake calliper? Interesting stuff! No wonder, if true, it's taken the time it has.

    Can't wait to view mine being changed for closer inspection as there has to be a mega reason to substantiate the costs involved for changing the brake calliper - on 5700 RS3's and 6100 TT RS's (data again from Quattro81). Wow, that's some hit!
    #33
  35. Macdaddy
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    Macdaddy Active Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    I've had a call today, my dealer has 5 sets of pads coming to them and I'm first to be offered them.

    Apparently they are made from a different compound.

    no mention of new discs or calipers tho
    #34
  36. quattro81
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    quattro81 All the gear.. No idea

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    apparently not for all, Marcus.. Depends on date of manufacture (mine is '62 and its more likely on the later ones). They are being typically evasive when I ask about it though - first they said it was a software update, then they said they had to wait on parts, and now they're saying its a 2.9 hour job as its both! Lol
    #35
  37. quattro81
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    quattro81 All the gear.. No idea

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    It's starting to look like it might just be the pads...
    here is an extract from the TTOC in the USA:

    "Got my TTRS in early December, 2013 model and it came with brake noise at low speed and light brake pressure. This is not unique to Audi, had the same problem with my earlier model Porsche's. Filled out an Audi new car customer questionnaire indicating my displeasure with the brake noise. A couple of weeks ago I was contacted by Audi USA (phone and email) notifying me that there was a fix and to let them know which dealer I wanted the new brake pads shipped to. It only took a couple of days and the dealer called to notify me they had a box with brake pads ready for my TTRS. I scheduled an appointment this last Monday. I asked to see the pads, they look about the same except there are thin pads (cork?) on the back. The service manager stated that the pad material was also different and that this was only the third set shipped to dealers so far.


    I waited a few days to see if the squeal returned. When I cleaned my brakes previously they would be silent for about a day, hence the wait. The brakes are just as responsive as before and totally silent. The fix appears to be successful. I had tried bedding the brakes previously and ABS stops mentioned in the various forums. Those approaches didn't work so contact your dealer for a proper resolution."
    #36
  38. P_G
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    P_G Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    Looking at Alan's pictures it does look like just pads and possible refacing the discs because the disc design, carriers and calipers look the same. I suspect it will be new pads and a software flash on the ABS so that that brakes clean the surface of the discs under excessive water / wet conditions like the RS4 does with ceramics to eliminate the initial wet braking dead pedal feel Jonny G and I have experienced.
    #37
  39. KKM
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    KKM Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    This is all very interesting stuff. Going to contact my dealer and find out if/when they can do the work.

    Brilliant news :thumbsup:
    #38
  40. wickedstef
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    wickedstef Active Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    I hope it's only the pads. I must be paranoid as I find those discs smaller :-/
    #39
  41. PigPen
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    PigPen Member

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    [Apr 4, 2013]
    What are the signs / issues for this being a problem?
    #40

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