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Brake judder

Discussion in 'RS3 Forum (8P & 8V Chassis)' started by Macdaddy, Apr 15, 2013.

  1. Macdaddy
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    Macdaddy Active Member

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Yesterday i came across the 'well known' delayed brake pedal feel whilst in the wet on the twisties around Wales which tbh was pretty damn un nerving however i also felt slight vibration through the pedal.

    It was a bit drier on the journey home so i pushed on a little only to find that under a reasonable load the brakes ever so slightly vibrated/juddered which didnt instill confidence.

    The brakes didnt seem to work as hard as they should either, so much so on the journey home from the mother inlaws later the Mrs (driving normally) commented on how the brakes felt like there was a vibration

    Is this a normal characteristic for the rest of your cars ?

    Getting immensely p*ssed off with the whole brake thing now.
    #1
  2. robbiemac
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    robbiemac 'S' Button engaged....

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Morning mate,
    I'm the opposite, weirdly my brakes feel great....... no more squeal. Will not last due to my driving style and environment, car's not suited to slow traffic with high braking frequency at low speeds.
    The guy based in German reported a similar problem and he's had the brake fix and so far reported a clean bill of health, hopefully the fix filters down to us mere mortals soon and this problem will become a bad memory.
    Cheers for yesterday
    robbie
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  3. CatnipRS3
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    CatnipRS3 Active Member

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Mine performed great also....maybe your discs are warped?, I do know some have suffered this and loads of TT-RS owners have also.
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  4. MBK
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    MBK Well-Known Member

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    A couple of suggestions:

    - you might have some pad material stuck on the disc after the hot brakes/wet roads combination yesterday. If you can do a couple of maximum braking runs from high speed this should clear. I pretty sure you won't have warped the discs on road especially with the extra cooling ducts but Audi could easily measure the disc if so. Sadly this pad material build up is a common occurrence on Brembo set ups. It can be cured with softer pads but then you will be changing them more often - ask Klauster he knows more about this.

    - if that doesn't clear the problem, are the holes on your discs blocked with dust. If so jet wash them clear. They are needed for cooling and clearing any pad glazing (be much better if they were grooved but it seems everything is built to a price).

    - I'm not sure of your mileage so if that still doesn't help check the inner pads, as discovered by Bilen, at 10k the inner pad was worn. Mine were about 1mm off the wear indicator after 11k miles.

    All the performance cars I've owned, once used to their full potential, have had braking issues of some kind. The S2000 warped its discs, The Scooby pad material would catch fire! The Evo ate discs and pads. Stopping 1200-1600kg takes some doing. All these issues were resolved by high quality aftermarket grooved floating rotor discs and road legal track biased pads (very occassionaly these do squeal!). I can understand people might not want to do this with a fix in sight.

    Hope those suggestions help.
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  5. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member Supporter

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    My brakes were fine too, and they came of the track smokin'

    Running back down the A5 the brakes were similarly A1' no complaints at all.

    The only issue may have been that the brakes were having to work harder, Bluey now considerably heavier, due to the amount of liquefied Welsh sheep sh*t deposited on her previously clean rear...

    Gonna try and get the sheep sh*t off and into the greenhouse as I'm told it'll be good for our new found love of Chillies; thanks Andy, they will always remind us of you, in a nice way...
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  6. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member Supporter

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Hey Macdaddy: I'll willingly strip and check your calipers for you, fronts and backs if necessary - no worries for an OAP with time available...:readit:

    May be counterproductive, however, if an official 'fix' is imminent; but the offer is made!
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2013
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  7. P_G
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    P_G Member

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    macdaddy, sound like you are suffering what the B7 RS4 owners including myself used to suffer which is pad deposition onto the discs or high spots caused by the cross drilled holes clogging with pad dust which is as said in this thread is fairly common to the Audi Brembo discs. Main reasons are that the crossdrilled holes are not big enough and because they are pinned / slotted discs in the middle rather than directionally vaned they are a poor design. I used to normally getting 'warping' when the holes were clogged which causes heat build up and high spots around the holes. I purposely used a bradle on the 3's brakes last weekend to unclog them when I changed over to summer wheels. The cure on the RS4 for me was EBC yellowstuff pads (slightly harder and importantly less brake dust) and others went Ferrodo DS2500. In truth the RS4 suffered because OEM Pagid's were too soft, caused loads of dust which clogged the holes cause high spots and vibration compounded by pad depoisiton

    Looks like in your case that perhaps holes are clogged or pad deposition. That's why I am serioulsy looking at MBK's AP / Loba solution in a year or so's time. Not ideal I admit that I have to spend more money to make it work properly but in some instances the Audi / Brembo partnership has not been a good one and Brembo have designed to a budget.

    Cheap fix is to have them skimmed, other fix if to have Audi measure them and replace. IIRC someone else (RS3) has just had discs replaced under warranty for the same issue? On RS4's some extreme cases saw steels replaced with ceramics but since the 3 never had the ceramic option I can't see this happening.

    First and quickest job however is unblock the holes and then try using the brakes heavily to see it it will reduce the issue. Also, is it fronts or rears?
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2013
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  8. RS3Shuk
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    RS3Shuk Daytona Grey RS3

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Only done 250 odd miles in my RS3 since picking it up on Saturday and one of the things I will say is that the one let down is the braking performance (car has done 19k miles). My E46 M3 with standard brake set up smashes the performance of the big brake Brembo set up.
    Overall performance is not up to scratch, and on closer inspection I see that most of the holes in the discs are clogged. So much for me telling the dealership that I wanted them to go over the brake setup properly. On heavy brake load there is a rough feeling through the brake pedal (kind of like when you leave the car sitting for a week and your clearing surface rust on the first drive back) and a bit of vibration.

    Will clear out the holes in the discs tomorrow and see what that does. You can even feel the heat from the fronts when you get out the car without having really driven hard.
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  9. wickedstef
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    wickedstef Active Member

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    RS3Shuk, have you had the pads checked? If the car was tracked or pushed hard, 19k miles looks quite a bit if they are the original one.

    We all agree that the brakes are excellent unless you get issues like Macdaddy's...
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  10. Bilen
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    Bilen Member

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Juddering and iffy sounds was due to worn inner pads for me and the sensors were just beginning to touch the disc. The discs do looks sh*t too.. noticed that yesterday that the holes were blocked. Think I will need to spend some time "down there" and do some err grooming to stop try and minimise her squealing....
    #10
  11. RS3Shuk
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    RS3Shuk Daytona Grey RS3

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    [Apr 15, 2013]
    Will be in touch with Guildford Audi tomorrow. Only just picked the car up on Saturday, so would have thought they would have checked all brake components prior to sale. Lets see how this works itself out.
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  12. Bilen
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    Bilen Member

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    [Apr 16, 2013]
    Don't expect them to check the brakes before flogging... I think if they had done it on me, I wouldn't have needed to replace the inner pads which appears to be an issue on some, although I'm not sure on how many cars... wear and tear item they can get you to pay for.

    I think (?) so long as they are within legal limits (e.g. your tyres) they had no requirement to replace unless damaged... hence they'll sell it to you that way.... good luck
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  13. Macdaddy
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    Macdaddy Active Member

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    [Apr 16, 2013]

    My car tbh has a tough life as its driven hard whenever possible, Its less than 4k on the clock but even so i'm still not expecting the brakes to be in need of changing.

    I didnt think they were great on the way to the karting track but we werent pushing hard enough to test them properly, On the way home they were shocking although the speed had increased dramatically.... Wasnt sure if it was me being paranoid until the Mrs drove later on and commented.

    I noticed on the way to work yesterday the vibration had gone or so it seems as it was moderate traffic so no chance to use heavy braking............... Seemed ok again on the way home too in traffic up until the last set of lights where it squealed lol.

    I'll check out today the suggestions about blocked vents and report back, It could explain why they were **** down in Wales with all the salt/gravelwater flying about. Loathed at the minute to drop it into Audi as they've been told not to touch any brakes because of the fix thats coming out. Means a courtesy car until then if it goes in. :ohmy:
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  14. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member Supporter

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    [Apr 16, 2013]
    Feel free to visit if I can assist - lunch provided: I know my way around - down there =^_^=
    #14

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