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Balance shaft inspection by adamss24

Discussion in 'Audi S4/A4/A4 Cab (B7 Chassis)' started by matthew999, Jun 3, 2013.

  1. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Hello All,

    I had been in discussions with Chris aka adamss24 for a while now about inspecting my balance shaft, all we where waiting for was a spell of good weather for the surgery to start. In the mean time my clutch had started to slip so it made sense to tackle both at the same time. My car is on 80k and oil has been changed at 10k intervals since 55k. The hex key was as expected and very worn with lots of slop and play in the keyway which also looked like it had seen better days. So balance shaft will be posted to powermax tomorrow for a refurb.

    Clutch and flywheel where knackered too, there was lots of play in flywheel and a very worn and glazed clutch plate. So i went for an upgraded Sachs SRE clutch and pressure plate and LUX flywheel from darkside, this should handle the remap and any future big turbo plans that Chris has planted in my head.

    I must say if feels good not to have that constant worry in the back of my mind about an impending potential engine failure :) And of course a massive thanks to chris for making this happen cheers mate!

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    #1
  2. Paul B7
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    Paul B7 Active Member

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    Looks nice work and very well done
    What is your engine code ?

    Paul B7
    #2
  3. Paul B7
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    Paul B7 Active Member

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    Oooooooooooooops, ignore that question , I see from the footer in your posting it's a 170 BRD Tdi.
    #3
  4. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Hi Paul,

    Yeah it's quite mesmerising watching Chris work, he makes it look so easy.

    Cheers

    Matt
    #4
  5. unitzero
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    unitzero Active Member

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    I have the same engine on 135k. I dread to think what mine looks like !?!

    looks like an expensive and time consuming task too
    #5
  6. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Who knows, it seems a bit of a lottery how fast they wear, can't say anyone has ever posted one coming out like new though. I just wanted piece of mind as it was spoiling my fun.
    #6
  7. jdp1962
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    jdp1962 Grumpy Old Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Great pics; most important components of all being the two cups of tea!
    #7
  8. Macdoon
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    Macdoon Well-Known Member

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    Had mine done today, peace of mind...definately

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    Hex drive.....Top one is new one, middle is mine and the bottom is from an 06 passat
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    #8
  9. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Good work looks pretty similar to mine. Even the little bit of wear half way down and on one edge is there also. What's your mileage and service intervals?

    Cheers
    #9
  10. Macdoon
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    Macdoon Well-Known Member

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    82k, oil service every 6-10k, cambelt done at 70k, next on list is DPF delete & remap
    #10
  11. Gates
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    Gates Member

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    Where is the best place to get replacement hex drives from as I think I'm going to get ours checked over as we've already had it to once and put a second hand engine in, they did check before fitting it but I'd just like to be sure :)
    #11
  12. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Dpf and egr delete are worth it, well the remap that comes with it :) my old clutch didn't last too long though so be prepared.
    #12
  13. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    From Audi, there are two lengths 77 and 100mm, the later being part of the revision to the whole balancer unit by Audi around 2010. Or just get an allen key and cut it down.
    #13
  14. Macdoon
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    Macdoon Well-Known Member

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    After a lot of research and reading thread on this issue, this is how I went about it (company used through recommendation)
    http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/audi-s...-0-tdi-oil-pump-balance-shaft-failure-24.html

    #952 onward
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2013
    #14
  15. Macdoon
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    Macdoon Well-Known Member

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    I hear good things about Unicorn, what was your mileage when you had the DPF delete/remap fella
    #15
  16. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Sorry gates I misread your post, as macdoons says for the remanufactured balancer there are a few people that do it these days, I opted for powermax engineering maybe a little more expensive but I liked their big machines lol.

    Macdoons, my car has been mapped for about 15k but with rick for maybe 2k, I think his map might have been a little torqueyer than the orignal one, that coupled with a very old clutch and flywheel it was only a matter of time. Anyway got an updated are clutch capable of 500nm of torque so will handle map no problems and anything I decide to throw at it in the future.

    Cheers

    Matt
    #16
  17. Macdoon
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    Macdoon Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Matt, was thinking of selling mine but as she looks at the moment, still loving the look, so next will be engine mods, damned modding never ends lol

    Mac
    #17
  18. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    yeah do it you wont regret it! also if you have tackled balancer surely its a keeper.... for a good few years anyway :)
    #18
  19. Macdoon
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    Macdoon Well-Known Member

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    Only concern to tackle first is cold start lumpy idle and blue smelly smoke grrrrr
    #19
  20. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    oh smokey with a dpf on, sounds ominous but then again i know nothing :)

    Mine was fine before i got dpf delete no smoke and squeeky clean exhaust tips now its off it does smoke a bit under load and is a little bit smelly on occasion. Good luck on tackling those issues!
    #20
  21. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    Done a bit more to Matt's car the last few days: new, refurbished balancer shaft from Max Power engineering- to be honest it's a bit of a rip-off at 350 quid ! I could have had a similar bush made and pressed to the balancer shaft for under 100-150 english pounds !
    Anyway, new clutch is in and hope to get it running this week end ! Few more pictures...
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    #21
  22. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Hi Chris,

    Was just thinking of texting you to see how you where getting on then I saw your post.

    Thanks for the update. It's looking like its coming together nicely. Let me know how the new clutch feels when it's all back together.

    Chat when I get back to uk.

    Cheers

    Matt
    #22
  23. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    Pedal feels very soft for a performance clutch, did not get the engine running yet but i will get it running tomorrow, might take it for a spin as well ! I'll keep you posted...
    #23
  24. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    Engine back in, gave it an oil change, got the engine started- took a while as the battery went flat so had to put it on a trickle charge, clutch feels ok and takes drive fine but there is a rattle from the engine, particularly from idler gear/balancer shaft assembly ! It clears with gentle acceleration but it's rather loud at idle, oil pressure is good and there's plenty splatter when the oil cap is removed- the engine has oil pressure !
    I suspect the idler gear is not torqued properly -spec says 20Nm + quarter of a turn ! or poor engineering of the balancer shaft... I will whip the sump off again tomorrow and update the thread with details...
    #24
  25. hollow
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    hollow Active Member

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    did you align the balancer shaft with the idle gear ?
    #25
  26. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    Yes mate, aligned the balancer shaft with the engine at TDC as per Book ! The idler gear had some slope and i ordered a new idler holding bolt, getting it from TPS tomorrow..
    #26
  27. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    After fitting the new, refurbished balancer shaft assembly, i had to pull the sump again due to loud ratling noise from the balancer shaft area ! Upon inspection, the new intermediate gear that Matt bought was a different kit than what was fitted on the car so the bolt was coming off and the gear would have slope in it ! Re-fitted with the correct intermediate oarts and new oil and got it started today. Few pictures of the new parts vs old parts:
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    #27
  28. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    Drove the car for 50 miles today, drives well but it has a few flat spots-map needs a tweak or two, clutch holds fine and feels like stock ! Still needs bedding in for a good 500 miles without too much slip to stop it from glazing ! Very nice, sorted car but brakes suck ! S4 brakes to follow !
    #28
  29. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Hi Chris, thanks for keeping us in the loop I'm back in uk on Friday so wouldn't mind picking the car up on Saturday if you are around. You reckon you will be able to get brakes installed by then, not to worry if u have other commitments they can't wait a little longer

    Cheers

    Matt
    #29
  30. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    No problem mate, got more pictures on the camera but photobucket plays up so cannot be bothered to do it tonight ! Saturday's fine to collect the car, i had to disconnect the battery to stop sparks/shorting the starter so the computer might need time to adjust a little...I will see if i can get the brakes sorted for you, got a few jobs lined-up for the rest of the day so might be pressed for time... See you saturday !
    #30
  31. adamss24
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    adamss24 Well-Known Member

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    How was the drive homme Matt ? Enjoyed the power ? Tried to follow you but you quickly disappeared in the distance...granted my mate Nicu was driving his 5 series which is heavier and more underpowered than your a4 !
    #31
  32. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Haha thanks for all your work mate, I didn't think I was ragging it at all. Drive was ok, I stalled it twice thought :( clutch feels very different that coupled with the fact I was trying not to slip it at all while bedding in didn't help. see you soon for the break upgrade.

    Cheers

    Matt
    #32
  33. upcreek123
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    upcreek123 New Member

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    Hi

    Just in the process of upgrading my balancer shaft module. I seem to have been given the idler gear kit with one washer and thicker gear. On elsawin and the recon geared balance shaft module i have bought it had two eared washers and slightly thinner gear. I am now in doubt as to which is correct or whether the one washer kit with thicker gear has superseded the two washer kit.

    Any chance you could shed any light?

    Much appreciated, thanks.

    pete
    #33
  34. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    The new intermediate gear only came with one dog eared washer mate. Also this washer didn't have any grooves init. Ad yeah the gear was different to original.

    Cheers
    #34
  35. upcreek123
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    upcreek123 New Member

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    Thanks top man.

    So are we saying the one with one washer is the right one then? Sorry just want to be sure.

    thanks again

    cheers
    #35
  36. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    Yeah thats what i fitted so i hope so. if u want to be extra sure call Audi or tsp with your chassis number and cross ref part number with the one you have.
    #36
  37. upcreek123
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    upcreek123 New Member

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    ideal thanks again for your help.
    #37
  38. Andy021
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    Andy021 New Member

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    sorry I know its an old post, ive just done the same thing to my car and the idler gear bolt torque is stated as 20nm +1/4turn on some references or 90nm +1/4turn, that's a big difference and as the bolt is holding the gear in position with the oversize hub I went for the 90nm.
    #38
  39. upcreek123
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    upcreek123 New Member

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    Hi Andy,

    Yep you did the right thing 90nm + 1/4 turn for idler gear. 20 nm + 1/4 turn is each of the 4 small bolts on the balance shaft spur gear.

    Hope this puts your mind at rest.

    cheers

    Pete
    #39
  40. Andy021
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    Andy021 New Member

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    yes it does thanks for the quick reply, here is the offending reference page 26 http://pics.tdiclub.com/data/3419/BHW_Balance_Shaft_Module_Replacement.pdf

    still helpful but incorrect torque mentioned

    here is my story https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tideo4TmGM

    hopefully drive the car for more than 3 weeks now and enjoy it! hell of a job, if the sump just came off without any hassle to upgrade the hex and balance shaft easy but oh no!!!!! sub frame, gearbox in the way! and if gears need doing cam belt and front of the car to come off too

    cheers
    #40

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