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Discussion in 'Audi S4/A4/A4 Cab (B7 Chassis)' started by VagPro, Sep 25, 2011.
I bet you any money that your next post will be saying the the roof is working
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I pulled the motor unit out again and matched it up with your pictures. It is the same with the wire leads coming out of the motor at the bottom. Now I'm stumped. I was hoping that was the problem.
You shouldn't have to takeout the motor off the hydraulic block, just the two long 7mm head bolts and the bell housing will come off. Then turn out 180 degrees....
Ok, I did take the bell off the hydraulic base and re-installed it. I put the back end of the motor back on and it works now. Maybe I did rotate it 180 degrees, I'm not sue as I did not mark that part. I thought you meant the larger bell of the hydraulic unit. Inside the outer motor cover are only two magnets and they both look identical. Why would that make a difference as to which way it goes on? I've worked on plenty of wiper motors, starter motors and all kinds of other 12 volt motors since the early 1970's and never heard of this before. All I know is that it worked 4 times in a row for me without any hesitation and I am happier than all you know what. Thanks, Jim
PS, I know where I goofed on the bell housing. I'm used to using that phrase for the end of the motor where it attaches to a pump or whatever.
Glad you got it sorted
When the bell housing (motor cover that holds the magnets) is on 180 degrees out it causes the motor to run backwards, hence it reverse pressurises the system. :-/
Must be because turning the bell housing switches the magnet poles.
Hi Krumz from sunny Cyprus
thanks for all detailed explanations. I had same problem, hood opened few inches and stops. I done all the steps and the motor start to work again. here in cyprus, the cost of the maintance probably much more than the uk. so thank you again for helping me save thousands of euros. But i have another problem, now, the hood unlacth, moves up, rear part up, trunk component open then stop. I still heard the voice of motor but the hood doesnt go in and complete the roof open. When i help the hood to open completely, hood closed up with no problem. I tried to ignition on and do it manualy 3 times suggest but it didnt solve the problem. I dont have a software to seen if there is any faut in the car by the way.
thanks in advance
Now I understand. So originally when I cleaned the armature I must have put it back on 180 degrees off. This time it went back on the right way. I'll remember that in the future.
Hi, did you mark the motor bell hosing when you took it off ?
Yes i did. I dont know if it is important but I also took it off the bottom part aswell for check if the components are in good order and didnt mark it.
Sorry mate, did you or did you not mark the bell housing? If it is 180 degrees out you could have the problem I believe you are explaining
Sorry, the body which have 7mm bolts, yes i did like you described. I also took off small 2 bolts in the bottom part and check inside. When i did it, i didnt mark that part. Sory again, i am not good at mechanical stuff so i dont know what is the bell housing.
The part held in place with the two long 7mm bolts is what I am calling the bell housing. If you have marked it and you are 100% sure it's on the right way then you need to get a vcds cable.
Also post me a video of the fault please
Yes i done each of the steps properly, so i m sure 100%. I have already ordered the vcds and will expect to get in next week. Where do you prefer to i will send the video? Thanks all your help again mate
No problem at all mate, post it on YouTube and put the link on here...
Hi Krumz, you can see the video on Audi A4 2007 model roof problem - YouTube
Roof getting worse today. Yesterday when I closed the roof, the trunk component opened with no help but today, as you seen on the video, I help the trunk component to open.
Only thing I can think to check without a vcds check is to make sure that none of the hydraulic hoses are trapped anywhere. Also I assume you have already checked the fluid level?
Bit of history check .... Before you did the motor repair, the roof used to lift a couple of inches with no motor noise, after you did the motor clean, the motor works but not the roof gets stuck?
So basically the roof worked fine prior to the motor stopping working and doing the clean ?
yes the roof worked fine before the motor stop
ehm i didnt check the fluid level but when i took the motor out i saw there is enough fluid in. Is tere any level indicated to show min level of fluid?
i am not sure about if the hydralic hoses are tapped anywhere. What i m sure is, i couldnt put it back boot trim so the storage box is not moving easly. I guess i need to the the motor out again, check the fluid level and trying to open it when the motor is out. What do you think?
Ok, there is a level indicator on the fluid reservoir, unless you have a leak the fluid level should be fine. Yes definitely check if any of the hoses are trapped in particular under the bolts for the hydraulic motor assembly. Also what is wrong in the storage compartment, that could also be impeding the movement of the roof.
Firstly check what's up with the storage compartment, then make sure everything is put back correctly. Something's wrong somewhere.... If you are 100% sure everything went back correctly then next step is Vagcom scan.
i just checked and the fluid evel is fine, and i tried while the motor out in the place. All the hoses were free while the motor is out. Nothing is changed.
Storage componet doesnt fully move up (close up) anymore. When i put the storage component up my hand, it fall down in half way. But when it is opened, its not problem. So i dont think it is related with roof fault but i dont have any experties to surely say.
so, i gor for the last option and already bought the pirot one i guess from amazon uk. I hope i will give you better accurate information while i get it. Thanks again mate
Hello fellow enthusiasts,
I recently purchased an Audi A4 2007 cabriolet, with faulty roof.
I experienced the same issues as yourself, roof light flashes 10 times, pops open then goes no further. I tried a manual reset as did the local VW audi guys, with no luck. VCDS showed no faults at the garage and they asked me to take it back next week so they could have another look. They reckon it might be the storage shelf as it does close fully (I think the cable is damaged but its in the fully open position and doesn't show any errors in dash. When i leave the storage latch/bar to closed position it does show in dash.
So today i followed your instructions including the marks and removed motor, cleaned up and replaced but no difference at all. What i did notice was that the 3 aluminum cylinders adjacent to the motor were very hot, could this be where i had repeatedly tried to open/close the roof?
I then got a multimeter (set it to 20V) and then connected it prior to where the wires enter the motor housing, it showed as NEG zero. I then closed the boot lid and operated the roof switch and the reading increased to 12.9V. Does this mean that power is being delivered to the unit but its not operating?? I could not hear any motor type noise throughout.
I'm really confused as the stealers want £100 and the local audi specialist wants to strip open the storage area and rebuild it as they think this is where the problem lies.
I tried VCDS and found no faults prior to repair attempt, nor did the audi specialist however after my attempt i did get these following codes:
3 Faults Found
02000 - Switch Position
008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
03245 - Canopy Position Implausible
008 - Implausible Signal
01997 - Convertible Top Locking Motor (V223)
011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
Great bit of diagnosis, yes it does mean that the motor is getting power and your should be hearing a motor noise. Did you check the brushes are free to move in the carriers?
Wow, that was a super quick response! Thanks...
Sorry, i did push back both sides with the tip of my stanley blade and one of them sprung back out whilst the other did not pop back out again, i tried to free it but no luck so i pushed it back to original position. Im quite sure they were both touching.
Also, i used wet and dry 600 which was slightly more coarse and then followed by wd40 on the end of a cotton bud to remove any debris, there was lots of grime that was removed as a result. Hope that didn't cause any damage?
Is there any sure way of telling that the problem is in the motor?
Haha I aim to please
I don't think you've done any damage at all, but the brushes should spring back and if you had to push one back against the commutator that is the problem, it needs to be constantly pressed against the commutator to work.
Pry open the brush carriers, make sure they spring back under the force of the spring and it should be fine.
In response to the other questions, yes the metal solenoids do get hot, don't worry about the fault codes yet as manual operation does register some codes.
Ok,will try your suggestion tomorrow and see how i get on....
If that fails, is there anything else it could be?
I'm 100% sure it is the sticking brush. The fact that you've tested it with a multimeter proves that the motor is at fault. I'm assuming the motor is not burnt out (which I have not come across yet !)
Worst case, new motor is 180+ from the dealers on trade
Hi again, how do I pry open the brushes?
from which side do I insert the screwdriver?
sorry to ask such a basic question but want to get it right first time before I break it?!
If I say pry open the brush carriers (they are the brass rectangular tubes which have a slot down one side for the copper cable) does that make more sense ?
There is a photo on the first page with an arrow in where to insert a screwdriver and pry them open
Krumz! You are the man!
I reopened the motor and inserted a screwdriver like you said and twisted it so the brush suddenly popped out. Now both brushes are correctly touching the commutator and no longer sticking when pulled back.
I reassembled everything and hey presto, it worked!! After many months of no roof operation (the previous owners didn't want to go down the road of fixing it!) it worked just like that with no hesitation. Needs a good clean though.
Thanks very much mate, i'm so grateful for the thread and your advice.
All the best!
I had the same problem with my A4 cab 2008. Audi quoted much the same figure, then I looked on these forums and saw several comments about Mervyn and how brilliant he is with this problem. I rang him first, he assured me he could fix the problem, said he has done loads so we made an appointment one Saturday and drove to Harragate. We dropped the car off at Mervyns unit and took the train into the town whist the car was fixed. Mervyn rang after a couple of hours, the car was ready. Sine then we have told several people about Mervyn, my boss has been to see him too. It's well worth the trip and saved us hundreds. I even keep a note of his number etc in my car should any one ever ask me about my roof as this is a big problem it seems with this car between the 2002 and 2009 models. Audi really should do something about this, how dare they charge so much, how can they justify this when Mervyn can fix so easily and cheaply. Please anyone with the same problem don't hesitate to use Mervyn. You can google him like I did or search through eBay. I would like to know how only one man is able to do this, I reckon he has the market cornered.
Hi Miss Marples,
Yes Mervyn is really good and a very nice person too! However the issue with the roofs is simply the brushes sticking in the carrier, unfortunately most people clean the brushes and don't bother to resolve the sticking issue and have the problem again. Provided the guide is followed correctly the issue will not reoccur.
I'm having a problem with my A4. With the roof open, when trying to close it just opens the lid a few inches (2 max) and does not do anything more. When closed some times it opens correctly and some times don't but allways unlatches the roof. I've found out that when the roof is unlatched and not opening correclty, if i lift the front of the soft top while pressing the close position button, it at a certain point starts making pressure on the roof to close it, and after that if I try to open it it opens ok. Do you think it is because of the engine and is the same problem reported in the topic?
Anyway, I can't remove the rear panel cross trim... Tryed lots of times but i'm affraid of get something broken. Can't anyone upload a video of how to do it (or even the all process)?
It would be perfect for newbies like me to learn how to do it.
Thanks in advance for everything.
On the guide there are links to the workshop manual. Download them and check
I've read those pdfs but still can't do it...
Does the simptoms i have described seem to be the same off yours? Do you think this will solve it or does it seem to be the position sensor? Thanks
I don't quiet understand what you are explaining on the roof operating, but in summary if it opens a couple of inches and you don't hear any whirring noises then its the motor.
You have to apply a bit if force to take out the cover. Remove the two clips and pull it in the direction shown in the guide. Alternatively are you in the leicester area ? I offer a 12 month warranty on the repair....
I think it's your roof motor brushes sticking in the brass housings or a dirty commutator, the boot plastic cover comes off if you pull it upwards, it just clips off, mine was tight but came off ok.
Dear VagPro, brilliant write up. Had exactly this problem on Tuesday. Searched the net and found your post. Absolutely spot on. Took about 2 hours in total and no hitches along the way. I could see where one of the brushes was sticking in the holder. Slight tweak with a screwdriver and all is well. Thank you so much, couldn't have done this without your fab post.
This is caused by a blockage of the drain holes in the door seal. The seal then backfills with rainwater, eventually overflowing back on the interior side of the seal and into the sill/footwell area. Easily spotted, as you can feel/hear the seal is full of water by running your finger along it.
Solution: Simply clear the drain holes on the lower edge of the door seal ( you'll have to lift it up as the holes are concealed on the bottom edge ).
Usually caused by road grit thrown up by the front wheels penetrating through the lower edge of the door.
Sometimes the problem goes a bit deeper. The door seal actually has an inner and outer component - a seal within a seal. On occasion the inner seal can also become blocked with grit. You then need to take a sharp point, and going ( carefully!) through the drain hole in the outer seal, punch a hole in the inner seal. This will then allow trapped water to escape the inner seal into the outer seal and thence the drain holes. You can speed up this process by 'milking' the seal i.e. running your finger from the top end of the door seal to the bottom towards the drain holes. It helps if you do this from both ends simultaneously.
You will find a lot of dirt/grit in the water expelled through the drain holes.
....... Problem solved.
Hi, my A4 B7 seems to be suffering from the same problem. I've just been following your awesome instructions to get to the motor. I've got access to it but have noticed theres a residue in the bay below it. Am wondering if perhaps some of the hydraulic fluid has leaked at some point (it looks sticky / dried rather than fluid). Shown in attached photo.
The reservoir has fluid in it, I'd say approx 1/3 full, its below the Min level indicated on the reverse side of it. Should I top it up? What should I use to top it up with?
Any tips or advice gratefully received!
looking for some help with leak from Cabriolet roof. Water coming in at front driver's side corner where it meets the door post. Checked that roof is properly locking and lubricated latches. Is there anything anyone can suggest?
I had the same thing on my previous B6 Cab. As Willf92 said - it's caused by grit / debris blocking the drains. I used a straightened coat hanger inserted at the top of the drains and threaded it down, then tested it with water through a funnel. A load of **** flushed out and then the water whooshed through - was fine afterwards.
Just reading round the net - it seems that I need to measure it with the roof down not up - so perhaps this explains it. The residue is still a little concerning though, unless it's been serviced previously and someone 'missed' when topping it up?