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Audi 2001 8L - ECU

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by NethanB, Jun 20, 2013.

  1. NethanB
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    NethanB New Member

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    First Post

    I have an AUDI 8L A3 1.8 2001 [RN51 reg]
    Engine code: APG
    Instrument Cluster: 8L0920950E

    Last week my Engine Management Light came on,
    First starts in the morning i would have to give it a little petrol to help turn it over but no biggy
    N.B (it would turn over by itself but i don't like to hear it struggle)

    This morning (4 days of perfect driving later[minor clunk noise when steering sometimes, intermittent, not frequent])
    I go to start my car and the EPC light is also on now and the car wont start ---->>
    Turn the key, its turns over and dies within a second (same result with both flick keys and black plastic key)

    RAC cover: Technican had a wireless VAGCOM (Snooper) and the car wouldn't communicate with it at first, then technician tells me all of my keys have lost their coding (at the same time?!) - Wouldn't give fault code

    I arrange a call out from ProKeys to check the coding and the technician laughs on arrival to tell me that all my keys losing their coding at the same time is impossible and highly unlikely - His VAGcom also wasn't receiving comms from the car

    [He phoned a mate who said the ECU had probably gone due to the cluster being damaged]

    Prior to this the instrument cluster was playing up (none of the gauges would work correctly until car was 'warmed up' also the fuel gauge doesn't display accurately although the other instruments do)

    So now im stuck on what to do next...

    If i get my cluster repaired and the car starts - great

    If i get my cluster repaired and it doesn't - Change the ECU? [Cant loosen wiper bolts as they were tightened by god himself]

    And if i change the ECU [with the same model number etc] will any further programming be required?

    I have tried to include as much information as possible
    Please help or pass any relevant knowledge if you can
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  2. @udi A3
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    @udi A3 Active Member Site Sponsor

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    Sounds like the cluster. Easy job to replace, if you get stuck for somebody more local feel free to contact me I sent a pm. Bit disapointed that an established auto locksmith couldnt deal with this. Start looking for a new cluster same part number, I could possibly recode them by post if you send me both.
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  3. @udi A3
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    @udi A3 Active Member Site Sponsor

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    Also check nothing fell off under steering cowling, then check ecu for water damage. Whatever is replaced needs recoding/ adapting, or codes programming on the bench.
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  4. NethanB
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    NethanB New Member

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    Cheers, i will definately give you a call as i seem to be getting nowhere with this issue

    Would the cluster be responsible for the Engine Mangement, EPC lights being on and the car not starting?

    Not sure what the steering cowling is...

    Haven't been able to check ECU for water damage "[Cant loosen wiper bolts as they were tightened by god himself]" but will give this another try tomorrow

    Also, If the cluster is repaired and doesn't lose it's coding and it turns out the ECU needs replacing, how would it be programmed?
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  5. @udi A3
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    @udi A3 Active Member Site Sponsor

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    Ecu can be programmed by adaptations in VCDS software, but the pin numbers from original ecu and replacement will be needed. I can extract them if you dont know them.

    The immobiliser failure is indicated by the car starting then cutting out after a few seconds. also maybe a flashing light on dash. The faults leading up to this should be readable with vcds assuming there is no communication error. Might be worth finding out if the locksmith was using a genuine vcds or another tool to try to read, and what he was looking for, some tools are better than others depending on components fitted. Did he use a laptop at all or a big handheld scanner?

    If there is no power/ground or a break in kline connection from obd socket, it may be impossible to read without removing them from the car.

    Very hard to be certain without trying to read the cars faults in person. I cant find a matching cluster on ebay, but there is an ecu for your engine available with key reading coil and key. These wont work without coding unless the dash is available too.
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  6. NethanB
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    NethanB New Member

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    Right been on to ASM and they have a 2000 Audi A3 [W417 RYD] with the cluster that i need (well looks it)

    There not prepared to remove it just to find the part number as the whole car is intact, is there anyway to find out the part number from the reg? ALSO do i need to get a cluster with matching part number or will i be ok as long as the year and design are the same?
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  7. @udi A3
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    @udi A3 Active Member Site Sponsor

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    If the part number is the same grab it, i couldnt find any on ebay. sometimes they work if the last few digits are different, for instance swapping to full dis display would mean a different part number.

    Can only get the part number by removing the clock or maybe quizzing audi parts team? or with a vcds or similar scan.
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  8. NethanB
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    NethanB New Member

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    ECU: 06A 906 032 EE
    No damage, looks perfect BNTP28qCIAAWIGZ.jpg
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  9. @udi A3
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    @udi A3 Active Member Site Sponsor

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    Good to meet you Nethan, would you mind putting the part numbers of your original clocks and those S3 clocks up for anybody else searching to avoid the next person buying the wrong clocks!!

    As you now know, the cluster had failed, preventing the ecu and cluster from communicating through the k line with VCDS or any of my other scanning tools. I think you should investigate the following ecu fault codes further before driving the car to be sure they did not contribute to the failure,

    Address 01: Engine Labels: None
    Part No: 06A 906 032 EE
    Component: 1.8L R4/5VS MOTR 0001
    Coding: 10500
    Shop #: WSC 06435
    VCID: 65C10F5FFF7AE7B
    WAUZZZ8L22A033866 AUZ5Z0A8215041

    2 Faults Found:
    17848 - EGR Valve (N18)
    P1440 - 35-00 - Open Circuit
    17524 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating; B1 S1
    P1116 - 35-00 - Open Circuit
    Readiness: 0110 1101


    However open circuit is probably unlikely to have shorted the board out. they need fixing anyway though. Its a shame we had to do all that running around otherwise id have had more time to investigate!

    Anyway, enjoy the car now it works :D
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  10. NethanB
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    NethanB New Member

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    RESOLVED

    Audi A3 S3 1999 Cluster

    Firstly: An IMMO2 is not backward compatible with IMMO3
    Second: The cluster needs to be replaced like for like (IMMO, YEAR & MAKE)
    Third: You need to VAG plus to read pins and then to program new cluster to current ECU (You can use existing keys)

    My cluster was bad. Couldnt read ECU via it.
    Replacement cluster - even though it didnt start car, allowed reading for pins etc
    It took several clusters to get to resolution

    IMMO2 - reads but wont adapt

    After mismatching and several cluster purchases, the S3 cluster was able to be adapted to the ECU

    Lambada Sensor was giving an error code, unplugged the sensor (1/3 up the chassis [approx under drivers seat] removed 2 screws unplugged 2 harnesses and then screwed casing back up, car performing as per normal])

    It seems as though it would be cheapest to repair cluster, but you need to pinpoint original issue to this

    @Udi A3 was able to scan via equipment to provide pins etc for coding, flawless execution, perfection to completion

    It was a long process but for us it was literally a process of elimination

    Circuit testing would definately speed resolution up
    Seperate procedure to test ECU without relying on OBD would be helpful

    BASICS:

    Cluster make: JAEGER & VDO seem compatible, else: like for like swap outs
    ECU: Part number HAS TO match existing unless you want to program transponders for replacement keys

    I have pins for clusters:
    MK4 GOLF
    AUDI A3 2000

    if interested, let me know or they will hit return/ebay pile
    Faulty clocks i will pay for diagnostic just to see root fault and report

    FULL CAR SCAN AFTER IT STARTS:

    Saturday,22,June,2013,21:36:16:05185 VCDS Version: Release 11.11.2 (x64) Data version: 20120126
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Chassis Type: 8L - Audi A3/S3
    Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 16 17 22 35 37 45 55 56 57 75 76
    VIN: WAUZZZ8L22A033866
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 01: Engine Labels: None
    Part No: 06A 906 032 EE
    Component: 1.8L R4/5VS MOTR 0001
    Coding: 10500
    Shop #: WSC 06435
    VCID: 65C10F5FFF7AE7B
    WAUZZZ8L22A033866 AUZ5Z0A8215041

    2 Faults Found:
    17848 - EGR Valve (N18)
    P1440 - 35-00 - Open Circuit
    17524 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating; B1 S1
    P1116 - 35-00 - Open Circuit
    Readiness: 0110 1101

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ESP-F.lbl
    Part No: 1C0 907 379 E
    Component: ESP FRONT MK60 0104
    Coding: 0011266
    Shop #: WSC 06435 000 00000
    VCID: 2C57BA7B8C10163

    3 Faults Found:
    01314 - Engine Control Module
    013 - Check DTC Memory - Intermittent
    01314 - Engine Control Module
    004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
    00778 - Steering Angle Sensor (G85)
    004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: Redir Fail!
    Part No: 8L0 820 043 H
    Component: A3 KLIMAAUTOMAT 0105
    Coding: 00041
    Shop #: WSC 06435
    VCID: 2D51B77FE70A1FB

    No fault code found.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 15: Airbags Labels: 8L0-959-655-AI8.lbl
    Part No: 8L0 959 655 J
    Component: Airbag Front+Seite 5008
    Coding: 01104
    Shop #: WSC 06435
    VCID: 4581EFDF5FBAC7B

    No fault code found.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 17: Instruments Labels: 8L0-920-xxx-17.lbl
    Part No: 8L0 920 980 L
    Component: AB-KOMBIINSTR. VDO D12
    Coding: 00442
    Shop #: WSC 00000
    VCID: 3C778A3B2C70863
    WAUZZZ8L22A033866 AUZ5Z0A8215041

    No fault code found.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 35: Centr. Locks Labels: 8D0-862-257.lbl
    Part No: 8D0 862 257 E
    Component: CV-Pump, Alarm, RC D17
    Coding: 15178
    Shop #: WSC 06435
    VCID: 2F6DAD77ED066DB

    8 Faults Found:
    01367 - Central Locking Pump Run Time Exceeded (Likely Leak)
    35-00 - -
    01371 - Alarm triggered by Door Contact Switch; Driver's Side
    35-00 - -
    01374 - Alarm triggered by Terminal 15
    35-00 - -
    01370 - Alarm triggered by Interior Monitoring
    35-00 - -
    01368 - Alarm triggered by Luggage Compartment Switch
    35-00 - -
    01366 - Opened Due to Crash Signal
    35-00 - -
    00991 - Interior Lights
    28-00 - Short to Plus
    00957 - Key 3
    09-00 - Adaptation Limit Surpassed

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 45: Inter. Monitor Labels: 4B0-951-173.lbl
    Part No: 4B0 951 173
    Component: Innenraumueberw. D03
    Coding: 00001
    Shop #: WSC 00000
    VCID: E0CF9E4B6058023

    1 Fault Found:
    01381 - Alarm triggered by Anti-Theft Sensor; Rear Right
    35-00 - -

    End -------------------------------------------------------------------
    #10

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