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Any professional sparks on site?

Discussion in 'General Technical / How To' started by NHN, Oct 10, 2008.

  1. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 10, 2008]
    Any professional sparks about, question, just working on my mates house & switched his old fuse based consumer unit to a split load box, all connected up fine & working, except the rccb, its crabtree split load rccb on of course split load busbar, has top/bottom neutral & I am assuming its an in/out neutral that seperates the neutral circuits from the standard unprotected circuits, so I then stuck mcb on the protected side & wired in a circuit, but as soon as I turn mcb on the rccb trips every time, tried different circuits, lights, ring etc, no matter what it has connected the rccb trips, I got another one but havnt tested yet but they're fairly reliable so thinking maybe its a wiring issue

    Any ideas?

    Could it be a bad earth, as the main earth comes of the gas pipe from the ground & cable isnt that thick of diameter, do you think it needs an earth stake & larger cable for decent earth or reckon its a fecked rccb cause I can of course turn it on but whenever current passed through it trips.

    Any help would be much appreciated.

    Thanks.

    NHN
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  3. davidhodgkinson
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    davidhodgkinson Member

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    [Oct 13, 2008]
    Hi - it sounds like you've not sorted out the neutral connections.

    From the "out going" side of your main incomming isolator, you should take the neutral connection to the bus bar (NON RCD NEUTRAL BAR) and one to the incomming on the RCCD unit.

    The neutral from the "out going" side of the RCCD unit MUST go to it's own neutral bus bar (one that is NOT connected to the NON RCCD Bus bar).

    Any circuit that you want RCD protecting - should be connected to the RCD bus bar - not the non RCD bar!

    I hope this makes sense......

    (Have a look at figure 2 on this PDF http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/pdfs/59/p3983259.pdf )
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  4. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 13, 2008]
    Many thanks for the reply, yeah I already isolated the rccb neutrals as per the pdf but I have an idea that somewhere along the line the neutral is joined on the circuit connected to the rccb to the normal neutral somewhere else in the house, this maybe is whats causing the trip huh, its an older house so stands to reason fella, should have thought of this before, I will isolate a temp socket directly & test with that then it proves my theory, thats kinda **** if so cause means I have to hunt it down, tried another rccb which did same so at least I know its the house wiring
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  5. davidhodgkinson
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    davidhodgkinson Member

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    [Oct 14, 2008]
    Disconnect every appliance, and switch off all the lights.

    Then disconnect the neutrals in the board and test with a meter to see which circuits have the neutrals connected. At least it should give you a starting point where to look at.

    You sometimes get items such as fridges tripping the RCD module! Thats why it is recommended that the fridge/freezer is on a non RCD circuit (plus you dont want spoilt food when the RCD trips).
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  6. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 14, 2008]
    Am I to assume you're a full on sparks then fella, help is much appreciated.

    What is the norm for rcd circuits then, I was gonna stick the cooker & shower on this given the high current circuits they will have, any advice would be great thanks.

    I was testing it 1st on other circuits, but even a lighting circuit tripped it when turned on, so I am assuming the neutral is linked anyway outside of the board, I'll do what you advised then report back.

    Thanks again.
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  7. jamieface
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    jamieface the only S3 in the villiage

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    [Oct 14, 2008]
    Fully qualified spark here and just to warn you that if you fuckup and yopur mates house burns down he will get NO insurance claim because you cannot certificate the work you have done. Also the fridge thing is ******** they can trip RCD's but only on start up, remember that all sockets feasible for outside use should be RCD protected, basically all the down stairs ring.
    Not having a pop at you just dont like DIY electricians lol It takes 4 years to train and become JIB approved, Horses for courses you wouldnt have a painter change your gear box or do a BT conversion for you wouldyou ????
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  8. jamieface
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    jamieface the only S3 in the villiage

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    [Oct 14, 2008]
    oh and btw drop out the neutrals one at a time you should be able to isolate the offending circuit.
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  9. KoFidee
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    KoFidee S-LINE VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 17, 2008]
    TUT !!
    You are not able to certify to part "P"
    changing a consumer unit is reportable

    also you mention earth being inadequate (If earthing arrangement is not up to standard no work should be carried out on the consumer unit till rectified)

    http://niceic.org.uk/inc/file-get.asp?FILE=niceic_partp_factsheet.pdf&RURL=/en/householder/section.asp||12

    REGARDS JIB approved
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  10. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 17, 2008]
    Lighten up Kofidee, I asked for help not a lecture thanks.

    Thanks to Jamie for his advice, I will do as you mentioned.
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  11. KoFidee
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    KoFidee S-LINE VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 17, 2008]
    not a lecture or a directed @ U personally

    it just peeves (Us time served ) Electricians who have to adhere to the rules etc etc or are liable..
    yet joe bloggs can go to the local diy megastore and buy all the kit required installing "without required knowledge or experience
    (then crying out help when things go wrong LOL)!!

    TRUST ME WE SPARKS THINK THE PART p IS A Farce..

    jamie you should no better.

    nhn take a chill pill!! not getting @ ya just stating fact....

    like some early post wud you let anyone @ your audi??

    stay good
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  12. KoFidee
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    KoFidee S-LINE VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 17, 2008]
    p.s. sounds like neutral problem btw


    p.s. what system type and ze taken I hope

    joking
    lol
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  13. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 18, 2008]
    For a start they dont all adhere to the rules, 2nd of all the kit was from CEF on my account which I used regularly given my background, I've seen some real shitty sparks jobs over the years I've worked on sites & some house god awful wiring, plus they overcharge & take to bloody long to do the job, "oh just gonna pop out to get some parts" then dont see them for hours on end, then have the audacity to charge for the time they were gone, I know them all fella, I'm a well seasoned cabler, telecom systems installer, IT engineer, structured cabling installer, trunking systems installer for 18 years now, all involved electrics of some shape or form at some time so not exactly wet behind the ears, now the average joe then yeah probably does appply to, not to say I know as much about electrics as you may do, but I know enough for what I need to do & do it safely.

    But something I'm not sure of I always ask as I'm doing on here

    & yeah I suspect neutral aswell, I have a feeling the neutral is linked across the circuits somewhere so its not completely free just on the rcd, will test over weekend with clean circuit.

    Anyone see the hanging sparks on Sky cleaning the pylons, feck that for sure.
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  14. KoFidee
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    KoFidee S-LINE VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 18, 2008]
    ahh fibre optics

    so you have a van that can park on yellow lines
    bee tee open
    LOL

    you got lucky then!!

    cty dont usually have it in stock

    but can get it next day from another branch..

    cheers
    #13
  15. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [Oct 18, 2008]
    I'd be careful who you insult with that BT ****, I've never & will never work for BT so no I dont drive a van & I get tickets like everyone else, even BT arent legally allowed anymore as its a private company not state, I'm not external fitter for optics & splicing, I tend not to do the cabling anymore tbh, I'm not so much a cable monkey, lol, got bored so pay someone else to do it when I have to that is, I just do the occasional thing for my mates when they need it to help them out as do number of things & saves them getting 4 tradesmen in.

    yeah my city been good over years tbh, always supplied when needed with minimal if any delay
    #14

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