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AAN v's RR engine

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by 20vK, Nov 7, 2007.

  1. 20vK
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    20vK New Member

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    [Nov 7, 2007]
    Hi Guys,

    I am from the VW modding world, but am now dipping my toe into the audi sump oil.

    I was originally looking at an RR quattro set up for my project, having researched the power it can handle / generate. I was going to use indepentant coil packs and a Motec ECU, given that I am going for very big power (4 figure bhp)

    However, I have been offered an AAN engine and box. I've heard that the intake is slightly different and requires more space, but other than that, I know nothing about the engine.

    Is it basically the same setup, or are there significant differences in the hardware? I guess what I am getting at is: "for a similar cost, can the AAN engine be beefed up to handle the same power as an RR can"?

    I'd be looking at up to a 10k redline.

    Oh, one other thing, this is going into a (spaceframed) mk2 golf. Space would have been tight with the RR, so considering that, do you think I'd have a problem fitting the AAN?

    Thanks very much,

    Rich
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  3. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 7, 2007]
    both 5pot 20v engines.
    AAN has independant coil packs and is a newer generation block.
    Why 10k redline since you will be running a minimum of GT40/45 anyway to get those numbers? if you are not getting your required 1000 by 7500-8000 anyway 2500 more ain;t going to help you

    20 5 pots have been fitted to Mk1 and Mk2 shells before.
    Your issue is packaging of the 4wd running gear not the intake.
    Any intake you need for 1000+ bhp is going to have to be custom anyway.
    check out vortex, guy spent a year fabricating a whole new floor pan for a Mk2 only to find the front suspension fouls the front drive shafts!



    Dialynx have a RR (IIRC) in a quattro sport conversion running close to 1000bhp
    Why are you looking at a 20yr old engine for your project?
    personally I would have thought a 2.7-3.0l v6 from the B5 S4/RS4 would provide a much more scaleable and advanced unit. your going to need a complete set of new internals anyway so it doesn't really matter
    packaging will be easier as well.

    just my 2p
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  4. 20vK
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    20vK New Member

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    [Nov 7, 2007]
    Thanks for your reply - much appreciated.

    I'm not using a turbo! I wanted a high redline to spread out the huge torque I could end up with if I limited myself to 7500 - 8000. I also intend to track this car on Nurburgring and I love revs, so think it could be quite thrilling!

    Have been doing my research and have come to the conclusion that is just the intake, crank and coil packs that are different - at the time of writing, I didn't know if the head / intake ports were different to the RR.

    On your reccomendation I'll have a look at the V6, but I reckon that would deliver too much torque over the rev range. In my experience, unbreakable custom driveshafts can only be made "X" strong! the less torque I can put through them and the box, the better!

    I understand that the engine is old, but new engines still have cylinders, pistons and valves, if you know what I mean. CR, valves, pistons, rods, camshafts will all be changed (as they would need to be on a new engine), and the head will be fully worked, too. A lot of the newer engines have been designed with economy / emissions in mind, which the earlier designs didn't focus on so much.

    Incidently, the "new" 1.8 20vT, (when worked and ported), with its modern combustion chamber and valve design can not provide the top end flow of even older head designs (worked and ported), so newer isn't always better, in my experience.

    It was Dahlback that got me thinking along the lines of a 5 pot. If you know someone has made x power out of an engine, then at least you know it is possible. Thanks to a good friend, I now know that the modern engine I have in my warehouse can not make the power I was planning. :)

    Thanks for your reply,

    Rich
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  5. jcb
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    jcb Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Nov 7, 2007]

    not sure where you got this from.
    teh NA 20v 1.8 flows better than a race standard 16v
    don't think VAG would have invested billions in an engine design that spans 5 brands if the previous generation was better.

    when Cosworth tinkered with the 30v V6 of the RS4 they did little to the design of the head. they know.

    both the RR and AAN engine's are designed from birth to be Forced Induction.
    think you may be starting with a less than perfect engine for a high revving NA track beast.
    have you ever driven an older audi with one of these?
    I had one for 2 years, all the torque is way down low due to the extra pot, they don't rev anything near as easily as you are hoping for.
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  6. Rev-head
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    Rev-head Active Member

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    [Nov 7, 2007]
    Hi Rich

    I run a AAN and ABY engines

    AAN set up




    [​IMG]




    The RR engine is very similiar to the 3B engine which is close to the ABY set up (mine slightly different with 1.8T coil conversion on my S2)

    [​IMG]


    If you were looking for ideas this thread here has great detail

    http://www.s2forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19402

    cheers
    #5

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