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A4 Strut brace and suspension mods

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by Spacecowboy, Jun 30, 2010.

  1. Spacecowboy
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    Spacecowboy Member

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    Hi All

    I have a NA 1998 1.8 A4 and need to dial out the roll in the chassis. Whats the best strut brace to fit? What else should I look to mod suspension wise? Its only a NA so not got the poke behind it - is there anything I can do to give a little more pull?

    Thanks

    Rog
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  2. Jonion
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    Jonion Member

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    Strut braces will do almost absolutely nothing to dial out the chassis roll (and that's being generous), they will stop some chassis flex but that's not the same thing.
    You need to look at spring rates and anti-roll bars to remove chassis roll.
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  3. Spacecowboy
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    Spacecowboy Member

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    Ok thanks for that. SO what should I be looking at? Which kits, brands etc
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  4. Jonion
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    Jonion Member

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    Sorry I can't help you much there.. I'm not an Audi man ;-)
    But I suspect decent kits would come from Eibach, Bilstein and maybe whiteline for anti-roll bars.
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  5. Spacecowboy
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    Spacecowboy Member

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    No prob Ill hang fire till someone else comes along :)
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  6. Oranoco
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    Oranoco Active Member

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    Depends on budget and what you want to do with the car. You can fit uprated springs for a start but to be honest you would want to be changing the dampers as well. See what size ARB you have on teh car as you may be able to fit a beefier one on from a more powerful model. If not Eibach do an uprated set as I beleive do Neuspeed but they are quite pricey kits (circa £250). You can fit a set of budget coilovers for about £500 these days, I fitted AP's kit to my A4 at a cost of £400 but I did fit them myself to save cash
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  7. Jonion
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    Jonion Member

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    As it's relevant and I'm lookign in to it myself...
    Is there a better rear anti-roll bar from other models that will fit the 2.8 Quattro? (I know unlikely but hey)
    Looking to dial out a bit more understeer on mine.
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  8. Spacecowboy
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    Spacecowboy Member

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    Oranoco many thanks some good info there. Are you able to point me in the direction of any suppliers? Also, when you say circa £250 did you mean £2500?
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  9. jcb
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    jcb Active Member

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    any quattro ARB should fit the rear frma eof yours, the RS4 has a befier ARB but there is not much in it. get saving and get the hochkis one.
    decent shock spring combo with subtle lowering (40mm is a good start) will transform your handling.

    as with any quattro a decent 4 wheel alignment can be as much use as doing the shocks.

    touchy subject around her but the is not much point sharpening up the shocks and ARB without sorting the 10 year old bushes.......get some Poly! or at least a tube of Tigerseal/Sikaflex and start filling some gaps in the crappy ones
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  10. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Sport, S4 and RS4 ARBs are all the same unless it's the GMBH 17mm rear jobbie that was specified at build time.I have been looking for one for ages to no avail
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  11. jcb
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    jcb Active Member

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    find a decent engineer and I bet they could make one
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  12. floyd 1.8 turbo
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    floyd 1.8 turbo Mirror, Signal, Outmanoeuvre

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    Then why are you on an AUDI forum????!!!
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  13. Jonion
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    Jonion Member

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    :ermm:er.. maybe because I have an Audi:think:
    Yes I know, wierd and wonderful concept that one.

    Why are you on an Audi forum ?
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  14. Broken Byzan
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    Broken Byzan Photographic Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Anyone tha has or likes Audi is welcome here. We have all sorts of people from the complete novice to the the super experienced tuner.

    Play nice guys....:asskicking:
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  15. floyd 1.8 turbo
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    floyd 1.8 turbo Mirror, Signal, Outmanoeuvre

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    I'm playing nice, just curious when someone says 'they dont know cos there not an Audi man', on an Audi forum! Seems a bit odd thats all.
    Oh, i'm on here cos i'm an Audi man!, funnily enough!!
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  16. Oranoco
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    Oranoco Active Member

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    To be fair mate loads of people have a car for the passion and then drive something else for daily stuff. To be fair that's how I came to be here as I own a Ford for Sunday best andonly got an Audi as Ford didn't have a blind thing I wanted. Ended up getting my old A4 as a stop gap until I found the ST170 I wanted but ended up diverting funds and liked the A4 opted to look for the turbo version
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  17. Jonion
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    Jonion Member

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    Wel I'm simply not an Audi man.. my car passion lies elsewhere (and always will). So while I know a fair bit about cars (some more specifically as I specialise) I don't know Audis well enough to give specific advice or opinion.
    TBH the comment read more like : "How dare you be on an Audi forum if you don't know everything there is to know about them?"
    Which is odd because I find most people visit forums to get advice not to give it.

    Like Oranoco, my A4 was bought as my runabout/workhorse car (to save my track car for it's real work).
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  18. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Spacecowboy:

    FWD A4's only have Front antiroll bars. Yours will probably have the thin 25mm one, where as sport models (irrespective of the engine) will have 29mm ones.

    The only downside is that while the larger front bar will dial out some roll, it will increase understeer, as you cant up the rear to compensate. It will most likely make the car feel better near the limit, but it will also most likely reduce total grip.

    I'd be doing dampers and springs first, and going from there

    Jonion: Neuspeed do a 19mm rear bar, and they're the only company that does one any more. Whiteline used to do one (also 19mm and also rear only) but they've discontinued it. Most other suppliers seem to provide a kit with both front and rear bars, usually upgrading the front by 50-60% and the rear by a HUGE amount to compensate (like 150%) but i cant help feeling that this will only result in a very unsettled car over anything other than glass smooth roads.

    I personally suspect that the difference is simply that whiteline (and neuspeed) produced a product that was actually designed to maximise the cars handling, and they've correctly realised the car really doesnt need any more front ARB, something that audi also realised, given the S4 and RS4 also kept the same 29mm bar, and the quattro gmbh upgrade for the RS4 was also rear only.

    The other firms are pandering to people who dont really have a clue about suspension design, but who think more is better, and are therefore providing two bars must be better than one. They are still addressing the stock cars balance issue, by upgrading the rear bar by a lot more than the front, but that doesnt get round the fact that the unneccesary front bar upgrade will have negative effects on the car.
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  19. Marc1
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    Marc1 Member

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    I did look at just replacing the rear bar, as this is what I'd done with the previous B6 to cancel out some of the understear, although that was a FWD car.
    I was going to follow suit with the B5 (quattro) and did as much reading as I could into what was best. I very nearly went for the 19mm Neuspeed bar as it came with the sub frame brackets and I thought I wouldn't need to uprate the front. I read reviews from people on Audizine that had added just the rear, then the front to see what a difference it made. Some even used different branded bars front and rear. Those that had uprated the fronts said it worked well, reducing body roll, aiding turn in and being more nuetral aposed to understeer. I took the plunge and went for the Hotchkis F&R kit, and notice the same. It now goes where you point it, and I've never reached a point when it has understeered, as it would have previously. Granted I didn't try just the rear bar on the B5, but I'm happy with the bars.

    Ideally it'd be great to have a range of different bars to fit, front and rear to play around with and see what works best for each individual. I think the rear bar on it's own would be a great addition, but the F&R bars would be better IMO, as I definately noticed body roll in the front of the car that has now been greatly reduced.

    Some of the bars are bigger than others but equally the materials are probably different and some are hollow, whilst some are solid.

    Dosn't help the OP though if B5 FWD cars don't have rear arb's to begin with.

    What about selling the 1.8 N/A and getting a 1.8Tq and upgrading that instead or is that not an option at the mo?
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2010
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