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A3 S Line brake upgrade.

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by Phil-1, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Oct 30, 2013]
    I need to replace the front discs on my 170hp 09 plate S line

    I have been offered, Porsche Boxer callipers and carriers for free but would need to buy front and rear discs and pads.
    I think this could be a bit of over kill.

    However I like the idea of something a bit more special than just the standard discs like Drilled or grooved.

    What are your thoughts?

    Phil
    #1
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  3. SPARTAN91
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    SPARTAN91 RED FIVE STANDING BY Regional Rep

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    [Oct 31, 2013]
    Drilled discs can suffer from cracking from the holes outwards if they get really hot and are cooled to soon so grooves are best, some now come with dimples like EBC's or M-Tec's. Like most upgrades it all down to your budget Tarox AND Brembo top end brakes and M-Tec/EBC low end price wise
    #2
  4. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Oct 31, 2013]
    I'm now thinking of using RS3 brakes. But need to check my wheels will fit.
    Anyone know if my wheels will fit with this setup, they are 18" S Line?

    Phil
    #3
  5. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Oct 31, 2013]
    Is there anyone that can help me with this?
    I don't want to get the wrong bits.
    #4
  6. Mr. B
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    Mr. B English...not so good

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    [Oct 31, 2013]
    #5
  7. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 1, 2013]
    #6
  8. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 2, 2013]
    I have Decided to go for the Porsche brake upgrade, just need to source the discs and pads.

    I have read that people have changed their brake fluid after a brake upgrade. What fluid would you recommend and where from?

    Thanks
    Phil
    #7
  9. OCD-A3
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    OCD-A3 Member

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    [Nov 3, 2013]
    Boxster calipers work with stock size front rotors. You'll need brackets to mount them, I got mine from Apikol. They also supplied M10x1.5 banjo bolts to fit stock brake lines to the Boxster calipers, as well as mounting bolts to attach the calipers to brackets. As far as fluid, I'm using Mogul RBF600 which is great stuff, but pricey.

    A couple more things: the Boxster calipers' bleeder nipples will face down when mounted on the A3. To correct this, you'll need to remove the bleeders and swap the crossover tubes, left caliper tube to right caliper, and right caliper tube to left caliper. They'll screw in where the bleeders were, then just fit the bleeders where the crossover tubes were. I installed speed bleeders in the front (two per Boxster caliper) and back (one per stock caliper) and it made changing the fluid by myself so much easier.
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2013
    #8
  10. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 3, 2013]
    Thanks

    I'm running 18" S Line black Edition wheels at the moment, I don't want to swap them. I have been told my wheels will fit no problem.
    #9
  11. OCD-A3
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    OCD-A3 Member

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    [Nov 5, 2013]
    I should've mentioned, the Boxster calipers fit on 312mm stock rotors. I wasn't considering that your car may have different rotors equipped than what mine has.
    #10
  12. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 5, 2013]
    It's going in on Saturday we are going to do one side first and check everything fits before doing the rest.
    #11
  13. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 12, 2013]
    Update.

    I have now been told that the Porsche brakes I had been offered will not fit behind my Wheels :banghead:

    As I have 312 mm front discs already should I stick with the same size discs and callipers and just get some Grooved/Drilled/Dimpled discs?

    Decisions: Decisions :sos:
    #12
  14. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    Just need some help here.

    I have searched the forum and the web but I can't find the answer to what I need to know.

    I already have 312 mm front discs. I would like to up grade them to the following.

    1. Bigger disc, I don't want to change my 18" wheels.
    2. I don't want to change the hubs (S3 brakes)
    3. I want to get the bits over the next 2 months, second had callipers and refurbish them.

    What can I fit on my hubs and inside my wheels. And have something that looks good?
    #13
  15. OCD-A3
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    OCD-A3 Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    I didn't realize that S3 brakes require a different hub, hadn't seen mention of that before. If you want to run the Boxster calipers you can likely fit them with a very minimal spacer. Of course it will depend on your wheel, but I've seen several people fit them with various stock wheels using a 3mm or 5mm spacer. Besides S3 or Boxster brakes, you're probably looking at a much more expensive big brake kit, but chances are there will still be clearance issues with your wheels. Best bet is probably just to get more aggressive pads, braided steel lines, and a robust fluid. Slotted or drilled/dimpled rotors won't offer much beyond aesthetics unless you are tracking the car. TyrolSport in the US offers upgraded front caliper bushings and a master cylinder stiffening bracket that will both improve brake feel on stockers too, though I don't have any personal experience with either upgrade. Depending on your mileage, you may consider rebuilding your stock calipers. The piston seal and dust boot kits are fairly inexpensive, and though it likely won't show any noticeable improvement it's easy preventative maintenance.
    #14
  16. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    Thanks.
    I'm sure i have read on here that the S3 brakes are on different hubs.
    I want something that will stop me when I'm doing 70ish and someone pulls out on you, and looks good at the same time.

    I was offered some Porsche callipers for free, but I was then told they would not fit even with new carriers. So I'm a bit confused on what to get. I have also read that Golf R32 callipers will fit on my hubs with calliper carriers and bigger discs. But I can't find anyone that has done this. Or what size the disc will be.

    Or I could get some pads and slotted/drilled disc and good pads like you say, but they will still look small behind the 18" wheels.
    #15
  17. manor13
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    manor13 Active Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    S3 345mm brakes should just be a bolt on option to the A3 s-line 312mm set up.Things i found on upgrading my 312mm setup on my ed30 was the weight of the 345mm s3/R32/Cupra setup It was damn heavy hence why some change hubs and opt for tt arms to compensate for the weight of the brakes, if your fitting just the fronts then get some braided hoses as this will do away with the snatchiness of the brakes at slow speed( what i found anyway) There is a porsche setup that fits our cars you just need to change the callipers mounting points to the other side see Brotec for the sellers details.
    #16
  18. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    Thanks
    I have been reading up on this and have now found several post on the web about using S3 or R32 callipers and 345mm rotors.

    This is going to be a project over the coming months, just need to find some secondhand callipers now 😄
    #17
  19. manor13
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    manor13 Active Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    I have done it a few times so dont be put of with rough looking callipers as I did a how to on splitting R32 callipers on some Vag site years ago. the beauty of them is the arch bit seperates from the main calliper allowing you to blast them and repaint without fearing of damaging them, before they became popular i got a front set for £105 of ebay including pads and discs but now everyone is after them so prices are roughly £350 for a good set of fronts.
    #18
  20. manor13
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    manor13 Active Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    and here you go, went on a nostalgia trip, I have missed out all the blah as pics paint a thousand words so you get the drift
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    #19
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  21. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    So R32 or S3 callipers will fit with the correct calliper carriers. I would then just need to get a pair of new 325mm rotors?
    What about the stone guards, will these need to be changed to?
    #20
  22. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    Now I like them. That's the look I'm after. Are those R32 callipers?
    #21
  23. manor13
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    manor13 Active Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    and another fitted with BBS CH's and R caps
    [​IMG]
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  24. manor13
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    manor13 Active Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    Yes they are MKV R32 callipers they need the guards as well. 345mm discs
    #23
  25. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    Need to start searching for some callipers now 😉
    #24
  26. S3_Jacko
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    S3_Jacko Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 18, 2013]
    They look identical to the s3 calipers aswell... I take it they are the same setup between the cars.... i'm not doing anything to my brakes, just knowledge hunting haha
    #25
  27. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 23, 2013]
    Sorry to bring this up again.

    Here is my problem.

    I want to up grade my front brakes, because the discs are badly lipped and the pads only have a bit of life in them.

    I don't think a need a BBK as I won't be tracking it, but I do like to drive at 70 mph when I can. So as it already has 312mm front discs do I

    1. Replace with OEM discs and pads and then paint the calipers.
    2. Replace the discs with something different ( grooved, slotted, drilled. I do want it to look different)
    3. Upgrade the disc size to the S3 I think it's 345mm and find some S3 calipers
    4. I have been offered a pair of front Porsche 968 calipers, what would I need to fit these, if possible.

    I don't want to spend lots on big brakes if it's not going to be used, if you know what I mean.

    Please advise me

    Phil
    #26
  28. OCD-A3
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    OCD-A3 Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    I have always felt that the stock 312mm rotors looked small under 18 inch wheels (not bad under 17s) and slotted or drilled rotors tend to exacerbate the effect in my eyes. You won't see any improvement if you're not tracking, but if you really want something that looks different I would suggest slotted. Drilled rotors tend to be prone to cracking.

    S3 calipers are a nice option in that they are OE quality and fit, plus you can get the S3 rears too if you want as they will work with your existing handbrake mechanism. The downsides are that they are heavier, you're adding a bunch of unsprung weight in the calipers and rotors, and aside from the greater clamping force they really don't bring any improvements... They're basically just larger versions of what you have (single piston floating calipers.)

    I don't think your 968 calipers will fit without custom brackets, and they may not even be an improvement coming from a car last produced in 1995. The only off the shelf brackets I've seen for adapting Porsche calipers are for the Boxster and Cayenne. Both of those are multi piston monoblock calipers, so in addition to greater clamping force you get a stiffer caliper and better pedal feel. Boxster calipers are lighter than stock, use your existing 312mm rotors, and fit behind most aftermarket wheels as well as most OE wheels with 5mm spacers. Cayenne calipers are heavier than stock, require Mercedes rotors and hub rings, and won't fit behind most wheels without spacers or grinding part of the caliper down.

    One thing to keep in mind too is if you upgrade your front rotors and not the rears you may upset the balance in how your braking system is setup. If you do S3 fronts and rears you'll be ok since they'll still be in proportion. Boxster calipers are close enough that you can run them with stock or S3 rear calipers. Cayenne calipers will bias the system quite a bit, but there's not much you can do... Can't fit Porsche rears since your handbrake is integrated in the caliper.

    If you decide to paint your stock calipers, a steel wire wheel that attaches to a drill will clean them up in short order, takes the dust off and levels out the casting marks pretty nicely. To get into the nooks and crannies I use a small handheld wire brush, not much larger than a toothbrush. Then the last little corners that are still unreachable can be gotten with a narrow grinding stone and a rotary tool. Once I did all that, I sprayed mine with 4 or 5 light coats of rattle can caliper paint and they came out pretty nicely and have held up fine so far.

    Oh, and I should have said this at the beginning, if you haven't already bought tires with decent grip, do that first. That will make the most dramatic difference in braking (as well as all other aspects of the car's performance,) but also any additional braking power will be wasted if your stock brakes are outperforming your tires now.
    #27
  29. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    OCD-A3

    Thanks for the reply.

    Are S3 rotors 345mm front and 288mm rears?

    If I was to go for the larger S3 rotors then change to the Porsche caliper would it still fit?

    I'm going to paint the standard calipers today and will keep and eye out for S3/Porsche calipers.


    Thanks again
    Phil
    #28
  30. tdi-man
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    tdi-man Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    I have r32 front and rears on mine stops on the dot

    Rear discs are vented 310mm
    Fronts are vented 345mm
    #29
  31. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    Thanks.
    I will start looking for the calipers and then the rotors.
    This is a project for next year now.
    #30
  32. downtothebone
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    downtothebone Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    I have the Forge 330mm setup on my fronts ...

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    #31
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  33. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    They look expensive 😳
    #32
  34. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
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  35. manor13
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    manor13 Active Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    looks fine mate, Black get lost in the void. should have dont the bell hubs as well since wheels were off.
    #34
  36. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    I did paint the bell hub gloss black. Might redo them red then.
    #35
  37. c_w
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    c_w Active Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    Paint the disc bell silver as a new disc would be - but really not much point if the disc is worn as they are really cheap for new discs!

    But back to you OP, the car will stop great from 70 with the factory brakes. The only thing that might suffer is repeated stops from 70, but a pad upgrade would solve that.
    #36
  38. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    Thanks
    I did think about silver or even gold 😉

    I do fancy bigger rotors to fill the wheel, and possibly grooved as well.
    #37
  39. c_w
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    c_w Active Member

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    [Nov 24, 2013]
    I'd personally avoid grooved as they can be noisy sometimes.
    #38
  40. MattKeating
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    [Nov 25, 2013]
    Phil, if you upgrade and need to get rid of your carriers, pls let me know. I have the pd140 and thinking about upgrading to 312mm.
    #39
  41. Phil-1
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    Phil-1 Well-Known Member

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    [Nov 25, 2013]
    I will let you know 👍
    This is going to be a project for next year now. Need to find the calipers first
    #40

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