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8L S3 vs 8P A3

Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by 1animal1, Feb 10, 2010.

  1. 1animal1
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    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!

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    Had a play last night with a xenon equipped early 8P model..... the car came up behind on the private road obviously wanting to race, traffic was quite bad so i took the odd opportunity to boot it when a clear lane came up..... it ended up annoying me cos i couldnt shake it, defo wasnt an 8P S3 which i have matched on pace with mine before.....it only had twin exhausts on the left, im guessing 170bhp diesel or 3.2....either way i know i could have took it on the straight based on the S3 scenario, in the end he passed me cos he was prepared to drive far more dangerously than me to prove a point...a point flawed i thought

    still gutted though :)
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  2. <tuffty/>
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    <tuffty/> Badger 5 Edition Staff Member Moderator

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    you need a bigger turbo mate ;P

    <tuffty/>
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  3. wibble111
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    wibble111 needs to scratch the itch

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    I had a 170 tdi A3 loan car when mine went in for the roof rails and it was really nippy, but did run out of puff early prompting swift gear changes. In remapped form i'd expect it to be really quick, would have been nice to see how it performed against my S3.
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  4. mk1chopper
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    mk1chopper Missing the S3

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    Are you sure it wasnt a 2.0 turbo? 200bhp as standard
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  5. jdas03
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    jdas03 Member

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    I went up against a 2.0tdi 8p with my 2001 210 S3, Kicked his ass off the lights round the roundabout and on down a dual carridge way, he tried to keep up but failed! a good day :)

    How would a remapped S3 8l fair against a standard 8p S3? anyone had a tangle with one?
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  6. DionBullock
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    DionBullock Dion

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    theres a local lad with on 53 plate 8p tdi 140, everytime he's behind me in traffic he thinks its a duel between the old V new! its nippy fairplay, but not much guts after 80mph on long straight private roads *cough* :)
    #6
  7. 9099
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    9099 TDi? Liberties!

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    I call for a trackday to settle it. lol
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  8. S3 Rav
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    S3 Rav Well-Known Member

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    Bare in mind a remapped 2.0t will be a good match for a remapped s3. Interested to see what it was exactly though.
    #8
  9. S3 Nattie
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    S3 Nattie Quattro ist für sissies

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    I raced a 8P S3 for fair few miles through the rual part which has some longish striaghts coming back from Audi Driver International and he was definatly trying to lose me for some time but he couldnt pull any length on me at all.

    One my neighbours had a 2.0T A3 with 200bhp standard and it is pretty quick, now has a 8P S3. Has a little less power to weight ratio as a S3, but very similar performance to a 8L S3.
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2010
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  10. Y83OLK
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    Y83OLK Hulk Smash!

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    Same here... i bet its an animal with a remap.
    Doesnt feel as steady without 4wd though.
    #10
  11. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    seconded, 8L vs 8P
    bring it on i say!!!!
    :racer:
    #11
  12. nimby
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    nimby Member

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    This is not a performance or out and out handling comparison, more everyday 'driveability'. My missus got her 8p 2.0 tdi Sport S-Line a month after I got my S3, hers came standard with 18inchers and 225 Bridgestones and mine had 18" S4 reps with same size cheapo tyres, mine felt heavy, solid and hard. The 8P was firm, well damped, lighter steering and much more 'feel' it felt like a toy by comparison initially but after a mile or two much more enjoyable, especially on the A and B roads where we live. I think the suspension set up is streets ahead of the S3, Am I mad?
    #12
  13. Y83OLK
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    Y83OLK Hulk Smash!

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    Bang for buck though... the 8l s3 is 1/3 of the price.
    However if i had a spare 20k kicking around i would not hesitate getting an 8p tdi
    #13
  14. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    No, you're not mad. I had an 8P courtesy car overnight once, it was only a 2.0 FSI, but it handles as well as my 8L S3(out the box) on a dry road, despite having 100bhp less.
    #14
  15. Gareth_RS3
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    Gareth_RS3 Member

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    From my experience an 8l S3 even when mapped would be slightly behind a standard 8p most make more than the 265 that audi claim, my old car as per my sig was only just ahead of a standard 8p. I still think the 8l is prettier though :)
    #15
  16. DJ_Troopa
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    DJ_Troopa K1 Driver

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    Sod people who drive like arses when they wanna play around! I always let them go when they start doing that. Let them crash their car, that's what i always say lol. Sounds interesting though seeing as it wasn't an S3.
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  17. 1animal1
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    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!

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    na i think it was a diesel as the exhausts were pointing downwards...the 2.0T's are straight pipes IIRC

    8P S3.....ive had a blast from 20mph upto god knows what, perfect conditions etc etc and it was neck and neck.... assume it was standard based on the driver
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  18. DJ_Troopa
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    DJ_Troopa K1 Driver

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    Is your car mapped Tim? Didn't think diesels were that nippy tbh.
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  19. 1animal1
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    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!

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    yeah it is mate..... the 170bhp diesel is and if mapped has loads of torque.....
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  20. nimby
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    nimby Member

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    The S3 has qualities I value e.g. the 'hewn from solid' feel to the whole car and the exclusivity, up here anyway. Mine was a trade in and before I bought it the dealer brought it back up to as near 'new' as possible replacing dampers, anti roll bars bushes etc so it was as good a 'standard' car as you could hope for. At that time my wife had a 55 2.0 tdi sport against which the S3 more than held its own. it was her latest car that was a revelation and it made me source some 17" Avus which I fitted with Rainsport 2's which helped a bit.
    I'd like to know what Audi changed on the latest A3 as it is so much better than its immediate predecessor, never mind the S3. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, the S3 is still a lot of car for the money.
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  21. jonny87
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    jonny87 Active Member

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    if all you're doing is comparing the two as every day drivers then i fail to see how a 10 year old car can compare to a 12 month old car, as obviously audi will have done more research and development into all aspects of the car and improved in every single area, safety, comfort, driveability, economy etc

    question is do you want to pay £20k (as a guess) for the above when the s3 8L can still give all of the above if well maintained for half the price?
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  22. Y83OLK
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    Y83OLK Hulk Smash!

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    Did replacing the dampers/ arb bushes make it feel more like a 'new' car? as im thinking about doing mine. I have no record of them being done since new, so should imagine after 9 years and 70k miles there pretty tired.
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  23. s3 Hoggy
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    s3 Hoggy Whats going on???

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    If the pipes were pointing down it won't be the 2.0tdi 170bhp as these had straight pipes too but the 2.0tdi 140bhp pointed downwards (as did mine)

    Cheers Matt
    #23
  24. The Doctor
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    The Doctor Well-Known Member

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    In my view...

    S3 8L = quality, understated exclusivity, lovable.

    A3 8P = another modern hatchback.
    #24
  25. 9099
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    9099 TDi? Liberties!

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    I agree with the above... When I see an 8L on the road, I always flash or nod at the driver. They are a less common sight on the roads. However, when I see an 8P I just think another modern hatchback. Would not swap my car for an 8P at all. I know what is under ever panel in my car.... I would feel too scared to take apart an 8P.

    Gotta love the old skool. Old is better than new IMO. And I could have stretched to a 2.0tdi 8P, but having spoken to various people before buying I was advised that the power to weight ratio of the 8L 1.9 130 is better. Just an observation... But they don't seem to like me much. :)
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  26. nimby
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    nimby Member

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    Mine was on 68k when it was done 11 months ago and is now on 75k, I don't know what a 'new' S3 would have felt like but it is rattle free and tight as a drum as any new A3 we've had.
    Our A3 ownership began in 99 with a 1.6 sport, then an 02 1.9tdi 130 sport, followed by a 55 2.0tdi 140 sport, then my S3 and lastly the 09 S-Line tdi 140. Having driven all these cars extensively the best overall IMHO was the tdi 130 closely followed by the 09. The 55 variant was such a backward step compared to the tdi130, sterile and with shitty brakes. I've left the S3 out as it's beyond comparison :laugh:but I wish it soaked up the bumps like the new one.
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  27. MURRAYS444
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    MURRAYS444 Member

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    Yeah my mate had a 130 tdi and for a diesel it was rapid apart from the time the air mass meter went on it the only thing bad about it was it went through a lot of front tyres my mate still regrets selling it he has an alfa 156 2 litre t spark don&#8217;t know why!!!
    #27
  28. 1animal1
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    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!

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    that clarify's things..... hmmm what pipes does the 3.2 have? theres no way this guy should have stayed with me even for the short stints if it were a 140bhp
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  29. alijames
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    alijames Active Member

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    Tim,

    3.2s have, as standard, twin straight pipes I believe. At least according to pics on the 'trader anyway... I looked at getting one when I got my S3, but having driven one, thought the S3 an overall better package. More aggressive stance, better seats etc.

    Cheers,
    #29
  30. mk1chopper
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    mk1chopper Missing the S3

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    the 140bhp tdi has more torque than a standard S3 (320/280) and if it was only fwd would weigh about the same, so at speed accleration might be similar if the 8p driver knew what he was doing
    #30
  31. 9099
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    9099 TDi? Liberties!

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    I wouldn't be so sure about that, I am going to level a claim that my car has a similar power/weight ratio as a TT/ Porsche Boxter (Can't say which model/engine spec since I didn't ask ;)). I can justify those claims because "spirited drives" on an A road against both vehicles have proven my point. It's also down to the driver.

    I am willing to concede that a Tdi 130 is not faster... But in real world terms the 310NM of torque is the secret ;)

    In addition... This matrix does not show the 30-70 accelaration time... That would be interesting to know because on the move the TDi has the edge.

    [​IMG]
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2010
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  32. 1animal1
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    1animal1 The Clar!! it mouves!!!

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    interesting that....my guess is then that his will run out of puff if i have a long enough drag
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  33. s3 Hoggy
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    s3 Hoggy Whats going on???

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    I had my 8p 2.0tdi 140bhp remaped and she flew! Not a touch on my S3 now but was still a powerfull car!
    #33
  34. emery1990
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    emery1990 Active Member

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    Yer if the road had been clear enough you would of caned him, he only has that much torque for a short while, we can rev up to around 6000rpm from 2500rpm with the torque the s3's got.
    The caddy tdi ive now got does feel nippy when driving it but its when i gets in my car i relise why petrols better

    I sometimes gets vans leveling my pull offs for the first second or two untill they change gear and i dissapear. Can you map desiels to make them have a longer power band.?
    #34
  35. nimby
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    nimby Member

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    You're quite right, I wouldn't want to pay that simply for improved handling as I'm more than happy with my S3 although that may not be evident. I've driven a variety of A3's over the last 10 years, all with Audi's 'sports' suspension and they all felt pretty much the same IMO until the 09 8P where there was a 'night and day' improvement. It was just such a contrast
    #35
  36. 9099
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    9099 TDi? Liberties!

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    In fairness to the TDi crew... You're car ain't exactly standard. ;) But then I am not saying that a standard PD stands a chance against a remapped S3. Did you know that in a staightline (standard) the 130pd is faster than the 140pd... I can't say how I know this. lol

    You can alter the way a tdi delivers the power (torque), but having said that, I am generally speaking about standard cars NOT mapped ones. ;)

    Care to test your theory? I know a nice private road if you don't live too far from me? Infact... even if you do, I get better fuel economy, I can drive to you if you like :p

    I hope this isn't turning into a "my toy is better than yours thread".

    People! What about the trackday? anyone keen?
    #36
  37. Pat J
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    Pat J Getting there

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    I've had a couple of diesels remapped, My Leon Cupra TDi went from 150 to around 190 had two runs on different rolling roads and had figures of 187 and 189 and it could quite easily stay with an Astra VXR and a civic type R when I had a go at a trackday at Cadwell Park.
    I've also had my A3 done and it has gone from 110 to around 150 going to get it rolling roaded soon as I've fitted a full turbo back Milltek exhaust and getting a green cotton filter fitted shortly. I've found the in gear acceleration awesome and it gives the traction control a headache and can scrabble the front tyres in third under spirited driving conditions :whistle2:
    #37
  38. 9099
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    9099 TDi? Liberties!

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    With a hybrid/bigger turbo, larger FMIC/injector nozzles/fuel pump... 260+ is achievable with a PD (ASZ).

    How much difference did the remap make to the LCR? I am about to have a triple stage map that can be switched using vag.com, and was wondering whether the power was really noticeable? Obviously there will be some difference, but will it be massive?

    EDIT: Forgot to mention... With a remap to 180-190 the torque figure would be somewhere around 390-410 nm of torque. ;)
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2010
    #38
  39. Pat J
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    Pat J Getting there

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    The difference to the Leon took it from fast to rapid and with all the extra torque you didn't need to change gear as often and in gear accelleration was unbelievable on the autobahn it would still squat under acceleration at 80+ and pulled like a train. Sometimes regret getting rid of it. I was looking at going down the hybrid turbo route but other things came up.
    On your PD130 a lot of the Seat guys have fitted the larger PD150 turbo and got good gains.
    The difference to the A3 is good as well gives the same feel as the Leon when it was standard. Gives a few boy racers a shock at the traffic light grand prix especially when they realise they've been dieseled :lmfao:
    #39
  40. MintyS3
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    MintyS3 Works 60% the time, Everytime.

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    Only 8P Ive had a go against was a diesel. Im assuming the 140 as it wasnt even close. My brother had a mapped mk4 golf gttdi 150 and that would keep up to an extent up steep hills but still wasnt nearly as fast on the flats despite the monumental torque. I'd asume a mapped 170 to be similar.
    #40

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