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3.0 TDI Intake Manifold Runner Problem

Discussion in 'A6/S6/Allroad forum (C5 Chassis)' started by hazey7, Nov 15, 2011.

  1. hazey7
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    hazey7 Member

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    [Nov 15, 2011]
    INT MAN RUNNER B2 LOWER LIMIT NOT REACHED fault code.....

    So, according to the Independent garage, to fix this tiny fault costs £1200 in parts plus one or two hours labour.

    Searching the web finds lots of people ignoring the problem and continuing to drive around. Others say why can't you just replace the runner motor(s) rather than the whole manifold? Can't find anyone who has just replaced the motors and that definitely fixed it.

    Anyone got any actual fixes for as least money as possible?

    Any advice gratefully received!!
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  3. hazey7
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    hazey7 Member

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    [Nov 16, 2011]
    If anyone is interested in following this thread, I posted on the A4 B7 forum and got some great replies.
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  4. crispin
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    crispin Member

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    [Nov 16, 2011]
    what is up with these cars, they are great on so many levels but have problems that costs 1000's to fix, I feel for you mate, maybe try ebay for 2nd hand. I have just had to replace 6 x injectors that Audi charge £480 EACH for!!!!!!! excluding fitting, the car has only done 75,000 miles, I found them on ebay 2nd hand £500 all in but it took ages to find them and I was lucky. you fix one issue and then you may have another? I would say look on the internet for ages as you may find a fix, you never know?? good luck.
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  5. hazey7
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    hazey7 Member

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    [Nov 17, 2011]
    Seems incredible that basically a tiny plastic rod on the end of a flap breaks or becomes slightly worn and brings up a fault that then requires the whole inlet manifold to be replaced.

    What with this problem, the injectors and the probability that the turbo won't last either I am seriously considering getting shut of this car.
    However, I do think that for this problem there is a 'workaround' .... to be continued.
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  6. murran
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    murran Active Member

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    [Nov 17, 2011]
    hang on, we had this at work last week, the motor itself has the position sensor in. motor 2 is the one on the n/s. if you pull the engine cover off, find the motor..... with the engine ticking over can you push the rod with your finger or does the motor resist you? try the o/s one too.....

    what quite often happens with these is the motor works fine but the position sensor (integral to the motor itself) packs up giving this fault.
    do you have the facility to do an actuator test on your diagnostics? you will find the motor moves between its range of movement but the actual value stays at 89%. if this is the case it wants the motor replacing!

    if not..... swap the motors side to side. they might look sided but they arnt. one is upside down! clear the fault codes. run the basic setting and go for a test drive, if the fault comes back, see if it now says motor 1 if it does then it just wants the motor replacing. if it still says motor 2 then theres a mechanical problem with the flaps in the manifold itself. resisting the motors movement.

    the one we had at work, we replaced the motor and it hasnt been back, so i think you could call it fixed.
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2011
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  7. hazey7
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    hazey7 Member

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    [Nov 18, 2011]
    I wonder why Audi and (at least the garage I dealt with) want to replace the whole inlet manifold? Is it that the motors can't be purchased by themselves?
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  8. elan2s
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    elan2s Member

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    [Nov 18, 2011]
    I suspect it all comes down to economics (on their side not ours!!) It is simpler (and quicker for the garage) to simply swap the whole manifold rather than all of the individual parts that go into it. Doesn't rely on the mechanic remembering to order all of the right pieces or indeed (heaven forbid) actually doing something that takes a bit of skill and knowledge. Also reduces the number of individual line items each Audi dealer (or country) needs to keep in stock to support all of the current and previous model ranges. Sounds as if Murran above, is a mechanic of the old school where repair is better than replace. Probably find the motors have to be sourced from the manufacturer rather than Audi
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  9. murran
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    murran Active Member

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    [Nov 18, 2011]
    actually, and i could believe it myself given i had just been reading this thread..... a q7 came in today for confirmation on what gilders have told him.
    same fault as you have on motor 2.
    but its not the motor but the what the rod connects to on the manifold has quite obviously come adrift....... something tells me this is going to be causing problems on ALL 3.0l tdi's at some point.

    also i changed probably my 15th throttle body on a bkd engined car today (a seat leon as it happens).
    #8
  10. Gavin0478
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    Gavin0478 Active Member

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    [Nov 19, 2011]
    is it not worth keeping all the broken ones and possibly makeing some good ones out of them?
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  11. wjam
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    wjam New Member

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    [Nov 22, 2011]
    I'd just prefer to fix the damn things open (there is even a handy lug to bolt them too) and plug in some form of emulator so that the ECU doesn't throw a MIL. Doe anyone know of successful emulation for Audi ?? Then i can chuck the motors in the bin.

    I tried a fix using rod end bearing from RS. It sort of worked, but I noticed the lower joint flexing. and sometimes that triggered the MIL. I suspect I could get it right with a little time and effort, but I simply cannot be bothered any more.

    Basically the whole assembly is p1ss poor plastic rubbish designed to fail and take your money. And the benefit is questionable. My car even idles smoother when it's not working :-|

    But as I type I think a little more. If the end stops were adjustable - on the motor housing - then a slightly loose linkage wouldn't matter. Basically Audi engineer this as a "will fail" component by having a motor that has it's end stops defined by the distance the flaps travel via a linkage... And this encourages wear.. which is of course the plan.

    OR if you could reprogram the ECU to look for 10% tolerance then it would last for years and years. Someone on the forums must know how to do that???

    cheers

    WJAM
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  12. hazey7
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    hazey7 Member

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    [Nov 24, 2011]
    Someone answered this 3.0 Inlet manifold thread on the A4 B7 forum and stated there is a 2% tolerance for wear on these little rods before the MIL is set off.

    Really poor design.
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