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2.8Q...Do i change it?

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by kriswa428, Dec 29, 2010.

  1. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    I've had my a4 quattro since april. She's the 30valve on a P, black with cream leather. I do love her but I'm torn. Do i keep it...chuck loads of £'s at it to get her looking beautiful. Or get as much as i can for her and buy an a3 1.8TQ or something of this ilk?

    I'm only 19/20 and feel a relatively untuneable v6 is worth keeping?
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  3. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    I avoided the 2.8 myself specifically because its not tuneable, and went with a 1.8TQS A4 instead.

    As it stands the engine has remained standard, but at least i know the option is there should i wish more power in future.

    I dont like the A3, so cant really recommend one of those :p
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  4. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    hmm yeah. My dad is a bit anti turbo.... he used to have a 200 turbo avant and it cost him big time. I want to start modifying but should i really invest in a 13 year old 130,000er with a thirsty v6.
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  5. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    I'd go with Aragon and get a tqs I've had mine around 4/5 month now and I love it and have loads of stuff on my mind for the future but if you are thinking a3 why not go s3 they are practically the same as a 1.8tq only better looking, smarter interior and a lot quicker and just a couple of mods could gain alot ie remap etc
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  6. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    Yeah i see your point. I have a big attachment to my a4 but its pre facelift and the volcano black paint has seen better days. To be honest being a 19 year old and trying to insure an s3 is bloody hard. best quote for the 1.8tq is 1.4k.....s3 is like 2.6k.
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  7. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    Is that fully comp and who with ?? I'm paying 2.6k on the tqs with direct line with 1yrs ncd and 1 claim beginning of this year.
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  8. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    no tpft. I've got 3 years ncb with 0 claims so that makes a big difference. my 2.8q is insured through churchills for £1400, not bad seeing as i'd just turned 19 when i bought it. Churchill wont touch me on any 1.8t fwd! let alone 180 versions. But they'd insure me my big 2.8.... madness really.
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  9. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    Ye see your point well hopefully it will drop in feb as I get 2 yrs ncb won't drop much and I'm hoping it doesn't go up either as I've heard off a few ppl that every ones has gone up insurance is just f**king scandalous these days !!
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  10. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    yeah i'm a bit concerned about mine, I got caught doing 115 by an unmarked octavia vrs in the summer. no points but 1 month ban and a big fine, so i wouldnt be suprised if churchill turned around and asked for 2k or something stupid. Struggling to find a facelifted a3/a4 1.8tq, bloody rare things.
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  11. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    That's what I like about the tqs there not many around I've seen 1 a4 avant and 1 a3 round my area in fact only 1's I've every seen driving plus my tqs has the half leather electric recaro's which not many have which is a bonus Was well worth the train journey to southhampton and the 4 hour drive home was wicked lol
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  12. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    yeah i bet it was. how much did you pay for it? I am also faced with the aggro of selling my 2.8 quattro. Not sure if it will get alot of interest locally.
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  13. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    #12
  14. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    yeah, I want one sorted before the show season kicks off. Need some time to get it sitting right on some coily's, stainless pipe etc. Is it permanent 4x4 on the a4 1.8tq? Or is it the same system used on the a3 1.8tq?
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  15. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    Not to sure new to the Audi scene it's same system as the 2.8q I think.
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  16. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    A4's have proper 4WD. A3's are a half-assed affair.

    I guess you could always mod the V6 for now, so long as you stick to bolt on items, such that should you swap to a 1.8TQS in a year or two you can transfer everything over.
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  17. 205man
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    205man Active Member

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    [Dec 29, 2010]
    ive got a 2.8qs and had it now for almost 6 years and love it, yes its cost me alot to get it to where it is now power wise etc and i know if i wanted anymore it would cost me an arm and a leg lol.........but im happy with what i got out of it and love the smooth v6

    lol besides im getting new car early next year either b5 rs4 or c6 rs6......but im keeping the 2.8, well my girlfriend is as she wants it and is selling her 206gti
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  18. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Dec 30, 2010]
    Yeah couldn't agree more. Love the smoothness of the V6. It is tuneable. Any engine is tuneable. A supercharger (you can get the bolt on PES kit now for £1500 second hand in good nick-I have one in the pipe), will get you just shy of 300bhp providing it has the right exhaust/downpipes. Thats usually plenty for most joe bloggs....
    Now I've had SHED loads of forced fed cars. Skyline,Supra,Lancia,21,9000, to name a few. These are MASSIVE fun (especially when a nice set-up comes on boost!), and if you've never had a turbo'd car then you REALLY need to get it off your chest(and your insurance companies!lol!). In my experience turbo cars are not as reliable as naturally aspirated machines. There are a lot more parts that can go wrong and it usually takes ages to get the setup right. Now, unless you have a turbo'd car that massively over engineered (like a chap on here has with an alias of in2deep) when you crank up the boost it will accelerate the time it takes before something goes bang/pop/crunch etc. On the more retro cars I've had (9000/21 etc) its much easier. If you wanna have some fun pop the bonnet and unwind a bleed valve. Next day before driving to work simply close it and you have it back to the manufacturers boost levels. MAGIC!
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  19. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 30, 2010]
    hmm yeah, i had a sit down last night and decided it would be wrong to sell such a lovely car right now. Grass always looks greener on the other side!

    So yeah in terms of chipping my engine.....I know N/A engines will only give a small return... but i want her running at least 200 and after 13 years I doubt she's running stock 193!

    What chips work best on the 30v?
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  20. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Dec 31, 2010]
    Honestly mate, I wouldnt bother! I've had my 2.8 30v for 18 months now and spent a lot of cash on her getting her mechanically and cosmetically perfect (as can be). All I've done to slightly up the bhp is drill the airbox, put a performance panel filter on (not that that makes any difference...lol) and a full Milltek system. Best an cheapest thing you can do to start is give the engine a 50/50 diesel flush. Do a search for it on here for the details. It TRANSFORMED engine!
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  21. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Dec 31, 2010]
    Hmm yeah I heard something about a diesel flush before, i can see how it would help! Does the militek system sound as good as I imagine it too? I know performance wise you'd be lucky to unleash 5bhp....but the twin stainless pipes look the business.
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  22. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Jan 2, 2011]
    Nah its nothing to shout about....If you like the twin pipe thing you can get literally 100's of universal backboxes with twin pipes for a ton!
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  23. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 2, 2011]
    I'd look at getting some sport cats on there, and a decent exhaust, perhaps the XS Power offerings for the S4 could be modified to fit without too much problem, although it may not provide enough silencing for a NA engine, its worth a go for the price they sell for.

    I dont think i'd bother with a remap unless you find it flatspotting or similar. When you free up the airflow thru your mods the AFM "sees" this additional flow and ups the fuel to match.

    After that i'd be looking at smoothing out the entire inlet tract, removing as many rough edges and sharp corners as possible, as well as port matching the inlet manifold to the head etc.
    #22
  24. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Jan 3, 2011]
    Seriously mate, for the the money it would cost vs performance gained its not worth it. Forget sports cats and do a de-cat instead. Simply cut out the cats on the downpipes, and weld in a bit of pipe the same diameter in their place. Noise increase isnt massive and its bloody cheap to do! A mid-range exhaust (2.5-3 inch diameter) should suffice. Dont have to get rid of the intermediate silencer as no power gains or responsiveness will be gained from this. Be aware for standard diameter downpipes you will need an adapter so a larger bore exhaust will fit, most suppliers should include this though. Also be aware that with no cats it will fail the emmissions on its MOT, so make sure to make "friends" with a station near you!lol!....Or, have a second pair of downpipes with cats on standby and fit them come mot time. This shouldnt be neccassary due to all garage grease monkeys (the bods that conduct the MOT) should turn a blind one for a nifty (or a score if its up north! Lol!).....good luck and enjoy pal!
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  25. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 3, 2011]
    Well yeh, a full decat would be better, but its a hassle come MOT time.

    Universal sport cats can be had from ebay for about £100, and shouldnt be too much work to weld them into an XS Power Exhaust. Probably do the whole lot for less than the price of an off the shelf 2.8Q cat back exhaust.

    I would imagine an XS power system with no cats might be a bit loud, as its designed to work with a turbocharged engine, so keeping the cats in will help keep the noise levels sensible.
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  26. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Jan 4, 2011]
    ......And the power down. Its no prob if your local garage is friendly.
    #25
  27. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 4, 2011]
    Tbh, i dont believe it makes any real difference.

    I've decatted cars in the past, and yes, it makes a barely perceptable difference to the bum dyno, but it really is insignificant, and having a passenger onboard tends to make a bigger dent. The old A4 was decatted when we baught it, and i fitted a poverty-spec cat to it to get it thru an MOT, and the difference was so small i just left it on.

    I'd recon at the top end you'll be losing about 10hp from the standard cats on a 2.8, bearing in mind theres two of them, so it has a fairly large core area. With 100cell sport cats fitted you might reduce that to almost nothing

    Heres a graph showing a tuned LS3 running with no cat, 100cell cat, and 300cell cat:

    http://image.circletrack.com/f/28007273 w750 st0/ctrp_1009_05_o project_green_dyno graph_four.jpg

    The difference between the 100cell cat and no cat is basically non-existant. 300cell loses less than 10hp on a 540hp motor.
    #26
  28. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Jan 4, 2011]
    yeah. to be honest i think i'll go with a high flow cat, I'm not going all out for power like i would with a 1.8t. Also if/when i sell it on I want to make life as easy as possible so the cat on is a good idea. I want her sitting low, what is a worthile drop, 20mm? Seeing as its the QS it sits lower than standard models anyway.
    #27
  29. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 4, 2011]
    if you buy 40mm springs, it will probably lower your car around 20mm.

    I'm a fan of Eibachs Pro-Kit, but they're quite expensive.
    #28
  30. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Jan 4, 2011]
    Sounds good, well if I'm going to do it, its worth getting a good kit. I dont plan to change the alloys, I cant see any oem or good quality euro rims that are worth buying....Porsche ones are quite tempting.
    #29
  31. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Jan 5, 2011]
    I got porkers on mine, getting bored with them no so moving them on when back home....

    Aragorn, mate, I'm simply stating that a complete decat is the cost effective option. And in terms if power (if thats your goal) is probably a better option, mot hassle aside. But jeez, thanks for cat 101 class. You never cease to amaze me.....
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  32. sam4191
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    sam4191 If In doubt, Flat out!

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    [Jan 6, 2011]
    Sounds like the same dilemma I've been having with my 2.4. Though your 2.8Q is far superior to the 2.4 FWD. I have just turned 20, owed the A4 2 years. Am seriously considering an S3 at the mo. Deffinately fancy something turbo charged (even Diesel!). The A4 1.8T's seem so expensive to insure (an A4 1.8TQS is £200 more than an S3 for me to insure!!!!!!)

    The V6 is a pretty reliable engine too in my experience.... I am still thinking maybe better the devil you know. It is a tough decision, and if you're anything like me, in 2 weeks you'll be asking the same question again. lol! It's a constant battle with yourself! All I have done to mine, is, as pheonix said, drilled the air box and K&N filter. Does make a lovely sound though!:p
    #31
  33. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 6, 2011]
    Cat 101? You may know all there is to know about cats, but the post is there to provide the information to the OP on what options are available.

    You may have no problems in driving around in a technically illegal car, others will however including myself. People can and do get stopped by VOSA and these things do get checked from time to time, and so i'm simply giving the OP all the information required to make an informed choice as to what he wants to do. Some folks are willing to bung the MOT man some cash, or happen to be mates with the tester, others are not.

    This is the entire point of a discussion board. Just because you dont agree doesnt give you the right to take the piss and rubbish my opinions. I dont agree with you suggesting a complete decat, and i've provided reasoned and easy to understand points as to why.
    #32
  34. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Jan 6, 2011]
    haha yeah it's one of those things. I'm just turning 20 and feel the need to get a turbo'd car. To be honest I'm going to stick with my 2.8 for at least another year. She's a beautiful old thing and I want to do it justice. I looked at the 2.4 which is still a lovely refinded motor but when i found I could insure quattro for £20 more a month.... it had to be done. How have the Jamex coily's worked for you??
    #33
  35. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 6, 2011]
    I'm not really sure how your finding a 1.8TQS so difficult to insure? I've just done some quotes today, and there was a 7% difference in premium between a 2.6 V6 and a 1.8TQS, and nothing between a 2.8 30v and a 1.8TQS with admiral.

    My brother has an S4, a clean licence and 4 years noclaims and at 22 was only paying 800quid to insure it. The missus is currently paying around 650 for the TQS, and thats at 23 with 4 years NCB
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  36. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Jan 6, 2011]
    It's cool, everyone has an opinion.....I was open to all suggestions whether it be a sport cat or a full de cat. Thanks to all you guys on here for the help and I wont rush into anything. I'm just going to save hard, enjoy my a4 for now and come spring time get cracking on the mod's. When do all the big VW/Audi shows kick off?
    #35
  37. sam4191
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    sam4191 If In doubt, Flat out!

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    [Jan 6, 2011]
    That's fair enough! When I bought mine, the 2.8 was a lot more. If it was the same as you found, I would have done the same thing!:)

    I have found them pretty good to be honest! I did think when buying them that they would last 5 minutes, if they were any good at all as they were so cheap. After 18 months of being fitted, they are still going strong, and the ride is not too harsh. Fairly smooth in fact. They are not the easiest of things to adjust on the car though!!!! Much blood sweat and language was had playing about with it! lol. I would recommend them (though must admit, havent tried anything else. Also only reason I got them was that the original rear shocks blew.)

    I haven't done any quotes lately, these were about a year ago now, when I was considering a 1.8tqs or 1.8t A4. The A3's were insurable for decent money, but A4's weren't.

    cor! £800 at 22 for an S4!? nice! Im looking at £1200 just for an S3 at the moment. :( I hate girls with their cheap insurance!!! :( lol!
    #36
  38. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Jan 7, 2011]
    Cool.... yeah I imagine trying to get a 2.8 quattro insured at 18 would of been tough! £1200 for an S3 doesnt sound too bad! I'm tempted but i think I'll give the a4 one more year. Save up and get a mint s3/s4.....

    Are your ronal's oem or replica's? How much were they?
    #37
  39. phoenixv6quattro
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    phoenixv6quattro staylowmovefast

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    [Jan 7, 2011]
    Your toys back in your pram yet Kev? Sometimes you get a little carried away with info......Amongst other things. Big hugs Kevin, big hugs....; - )
    #38
  40. sam4191
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    sam4191 If In doubt, Flat out!

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    [Jan 8, 2011]
    Sounds like a plan to me mate! lol. Thats £1200 with the missus on it too (19yrs, 2ncb)!!!

    They are OEM. I was looking for some for about a year. I payed £280 for them iirc. Had to re-rubber them though with 225/40/18 Kumho's. (another £300) I will be selling them when/if I get rid of the car, as want to sell the car on standard rims. They have had a 'refurb' which in my opinion isn't great, but they look ok.... until the missus decided to kiss a couple of kerbs :mad: haha!
    #39
  41. kriswa428
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    kriswa428 Member

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    [Jan 8, 2011]
    a year..... blimey i cant wait that long for new rims!! I guess I'm gonna have to start looking. Mine are standard 16's on pirelli's, 17/18's with the right stance look great but i wouldnt want to go any bigger. I'm curious about the black lip spoiler too? What one have you got?

    Are you definatley getting rid of your a4?
    #40

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