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2.0 TDi Turbo switching into "Limp mode" or losing boost until restart car...?

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by Simon16, Feb 13, 2011.

  1. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Hi Guys,

    I hope you can help me a bit, I am very new to the forum and my new A3 but I have noticed something that I am unsure of...

    When I am on a dual carriageway or motorway etc and get up some decent pace with my foot down 70/80 mph in 5/6th it seems to lose power/ boost.

    It doesnt do it all the time only occasionally but when it does it feels like I have no power going up hills I can lose speed, I have my foot all way to the floor but it does nothing until I pull over and turn the engine off and on again.

    When ignition back on I have boost/ power and it flies!

    I have done a search for this but cannot pin down much info...

    Any help is much appreciated guys.

    Thanks,

    Simon
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  3. zedzo
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    zedzo Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    something is causing your car to go into limp mode. if you have access to VAGCOM it may help. otherwise look for split or loose turbo hoses
    #2
  4. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Simon - if you do a search for 'limp mode' or 'overboost' you will find dozens of threads which will help you understand your problem.

    A diagnostic scan will confirm the cause
    #3
  5. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Ok thanks,

    I assume VAG COM is the diagnostic program to plug into the car? I dont have access to that but I can find a garage that does, how much is a check normally please? If it was split or loose hoses would it be permanently in limp mode rather than every now and again though ?

    Cheers!
    #4
  6. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Cheers Mike, I will do just that
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  7. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Also I dont know if it is relevant but sometimes when sitting at lights idling it fluctuates by about 50rpm for a short period and hunts around but then can be fine most of the time?
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  8. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    You don't say what year your car is but if it's done 60k plus it could (hopefully!) just be a split boost hose that is causing the turbo to overboost. Do you get smoke of any colour ?
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  9. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Apologies Mike it is a Feb 2004 vehicle and yes it has done twice that ;) It has been looked after prior to my ownership a full service history detailing a new throttle body etc etc.

    No smoke as far as I can see just the normal bit of smoke when you start it cold on a morning..

    Thanks
    #8
  10. Ian_tdi
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    Ian_tdi Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    I had exactly the same problem when I first bought mine. I took It back to the garage i bought it from as i thought it may be the turbo, they cleaned out the egr valve and vie never had the problem since.

    But i would be interested in seeing if anyone has had this problem mand know the definite cause because i thought the garage I bought it from were fobbing me off but to be fair it's not happened again since.
    #9
  11. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    Hmm, thanks for that info Ian, how much was it to clean out the egr valve if you dont mind me asking? Did they do diagnostics or just know it would be that?

    Cheers,
    #10
  12. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Feb 13, 2011]
    New throttle body ? The BKD engine does not have a throttle body ! In fact no diesels do.

    Was it an intake manifold flap valve (V157) ?

    Either way, it could be what I've already said or it could be sticking turbo vanes. At that mileage on that engine you would have to expect that the turbo is getting seriously tired to say the least !

    VCDS (new name for Vagcom) is a diagnostic system available to buy if you wish. An Audi dealer will probably charge £75 plus for a scan but an independant specialist should be half that.

    If you check the signature of a guy on here called NHN (who by the way sells genuine VCDS cables ) you will see a geographical list of forum members who will be happy to help you if there is one close to you.
    #11
  13. dunk
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    dunk Member

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    [Feb 14, 2011]
    limp mode can be caused either by underboost or overboost

    underboost is usually a split hose somewhere or at least a boost leak

    overboost is usually sticky vanes in the turbo or possibly something like a bad remap (but then you would know its remapped)

    once youve got the error code readout then you might know which one to look for. if its overboost with sticky turbo vanes then there are products you put in the fuel which are alleged to help clear this - got to be worth a go cos the alternative is a turbo remove/clean and/or replace.
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  14. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Feb 14, 2011]
    Thanks Dunk, I am going to try and find that map with all the people who have got VCDS locations and see if they can scan my car and find out what the fault is, I hope it is not an expensive fix, why didnt this flag up when I test drove it, just my luck haha!!
    #13
  15. navnayyar
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    navnayyar Member

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    [Feb 14, 2011]
    could be a noumber fo faults already dicussed, but to add it it, actuator (is the rod moving freely?) and N75 solenoid, is this working correctly? Do you have a vaccum leak? So many VAG cars have this sh!t fault
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  16. Ian_tdi
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    Ian_tdi Member

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    [Feb 14, 2011]
    Well it didn't cost me anything because I only bought it about two weeks previously from the garage. They also ran nit through vag com diagnostics and no fault codes came up.
    #15
  17. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    Hi guys,

    Thanks for all the suggestions and help, I took it to an independent specialist in Leeds today who even told me over the phone but confirmed for free with his VCDS that it is sticking vanes causing overboost and tripping into limp mode. Sticky vanes caused by build up of Carbon and **** etc from years of the turbo not been used properly every now and again!

    He suggested he could strip the VNT out and replace it and clean all the pipes and seals around the turbo but it was a labour intensive job and would be approx 700 quid plus VAT.

    Or he said if the vanes have damaged the turbo and it needed replacing I am looking at about £1000 plus VAT.

    Looking on google it would seem this is a super common thing with these engines and some people had tried to clean the VNT them selves by using thin piping and oven detergent...!!
    Other than that he said you can either live with it or I can get somewhere to try cleaning the turbo/ vanes with Innotec which seems pretty highly rated however this may not fully cure the problem but is only £90 at R tech in Hinckley and is a damn sight cheaper than the 700 quoted :'(!

    If anyone can point me in the right direction it would be much appreciated as I have only had the car 3 weeks and although I have the money I dont want to blow it when someone on here could maybe help or do the job a lot cheaper?

    Thanks so much!

    Si
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  18. navnayyar
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    navnayyar Member

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    For them prices you can buy a new turbo, no point to recon
    #17
  19. roman3000
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    roman3000 Member

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    Ive used the Innotec turbo cleaner on my turbo when it went into limp mode but it did it only 2 times before i used it and the car has been fine so far. But im still going to take the turbo off and have it reconditioned before my remap. I would reccomend using the Innotec cleaner first, it should be enough to clean the turbo. If the turbo still goes into limpmode i would then get it reconditioned/replaced, but you never know Innotec may be enough to fix things.

    Reconditioning a turbo costs £245-£425 (my quote), would be good if you could do the work yourself.
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2011
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  20. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    Just had my turbo replaced by a VAG independent in Leeds. Cost £650 + vat

    12 month warranty on the turbo !
    #19
  21. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    Hi mike is that including cleaning or new vanes and where was that, volksworks? Cheers
    #20
  22. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    Complete reconditioned turbo unit and new oil pipe and 'yes'
    #21
  23. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    How easy is Innotec to put into the 2.0 engine, I have seen there is a guide on AS for the 1.9 engine is it the same process when you get the cover off?

    I would like to think of myself as an ok mechanic I can do the basics such as change brake shoes, discs pads, calipers etc and have removed and changed radiators and the like so I am happy getting stuck in but I am new to this BKD engine set up

    And to recondition the turbo is that what you would charge for labour to strip out the turbo and vanes etc and clean up and put back together, I would be willing to lend a hand if that would affect the cost much, what would be the main variable for the price you say, time it takes to do it?

    PS Where are you located?

    Thanks for your help,

    Si
    #22
  24. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    My recon. turbo actually cost £375. The rest was new oil pipe. oil, filter and labour and VAT.

    If you think you can do it yourself then just go and buy a refurb one and fit it ! I think they are a part exchange item so you will need to give the old one back.

    Can't see the point of fannying about with the old one when you can get a 12 month warranty one off the shelf !
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2011
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  25. roman3000
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    roman3000 Member

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    [Mar 1, 2011]
    Heres a guide i put up when i applied the Innotec Turbo cleaner to my car
    How to apply the Innotec turbo cleaner - uk-audis

    The price i quoted is what i got from turbo technics, you would have to take the turbo off and send it to them yourself for that price. Then you would have to fit it back on with a new oil pipe, etc. If you can try and get it done same time as your service to save on oil, etc. You save more than £300 if you do it yourself which is always good.

    This engine is new to me too but it doesn't seem too complicated. Its a shame there are no how-to's on how to remove the turbo, i can make one when i do mine but thats going to be in June.

    I would try Innotec first then take it from there.
    #24
  26. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 2, 2011]
    The labour I was charged for fitting the reconditioned turbo was £175 +vat = £210
    #25
  27. Simon16
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    Simon16 Member

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    [Mar 2, 2011]
    Thanks for that mike, I think I have decided to take the plunge and look at the long term fix and book in at volksworks as I have been on the phone to them today and they quoted me no more than 740 for new reconned turbo and seals and new oil pipe, labour and vat. To put it into perspective I called German auto care in morley who said a reconned turbo was a grand just for the part haha!
    #26
  28. mike foster
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    mike foster Fossie VCDS Map User

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    [Mar 2, 2011]
    Nice one mate - they'll sort you out !
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